Current Affairs Coronavirus Thread - Serious stuff !!!

[peteblue]

So based on that, what about India?

Chapati Republic.....

 

[peteblue]

Can you be a Little EUer?

No, because it is so big.....

 

[Sy-]

That's fine mate, but all Tory bashing aside (and I agree they deserve pretty much everything that comes their way), do you honestly believe that vaccine has an 8% efficacy? Does that ring true in any way?

For that to be the case, AZ lied about everything they did. The UK authorities lied about their processes - not the Tories, but independent regulators. India and other countries turned a blind eye to their own data to approve it. All for a placebo that would obviously come back and bite them hard.

8%.

I'm sorry mate but... nah.

...not forgetting the implication that one of the world’s best universities would also be complicit in said lies.

 

[jonnyboy316]

If there turns out to be some truth in these claims will the U.K be forced to reverse its roll out strategy with under 55’s being prioritised with the Oxford vaccine

 

[BlueToff]

No, because it is so big.....

Honestly Pete, I love European countries. I don't even think the EU is 'big bad'. Whether we're better off in or out, well time will tell but I'm done with that argument.

End of the day, it's just a trading block. And this is an issue between a big Pharma company and a trading block. BILD and the other publications have run off an anonymous source and those claims have been firmly denied. Those publications will now have a case to answer unless they get on-record evidence to back up what they say. The one part of law I have a tiny (very tiny) grasping of is media law. You can't just say something like this and not have firm evidence.

We'll see in the coming days I suppose.

 

[BlueToff]

...not forgetting the implication that one of the worlds best universities would also be complicit in said lies.

Tory Breeding Ground

 

[Neiler]

But that's why the story rings untrue - the fact it'd STILL get authorisation for the under 65's???

Human biology doesn't work that way. Yes, immune responses vary somewhat between ages, like there's minor variations with the seasonal flu vaccine, but not to the point where it drops off a cliff magically once you hit the age of 65!

I don’t disagree 8% is ridiculously low.

The reason why over 65s is usually a marker as it tends to be an average age when people’s immune system becomes weaker. Obviously someone in their 90 is likely to have a worse immune system then someone 65. While a 20 year old will have a better one then a 60 year old. There are those types of variables.

The only other variables I can think of the top of my head might be, the initial data from AZ wasn’t great generally, then revised, then the dosage and spacing was being ripped up and redone, while data was being presented, they were keen to get it to market. The only other thing I can think of is the nature of the Oxford vaccine is based on a modified chimp virus, different from the MRNA vaccines unless some anommolly exists with the technology or interplay with a reduced immune system. That’s just me speculating of the top of my head however and thinking steps ahead. 8% is ridicously low.

I think we are only at the point of two positions and neither backing down, as yet. Hopefully the newspaper speculation proves false. Like I say if there is a problem with the AZ vaccine the whole world is a looser not just one country.

 

[peteblue]

Well it looks like being a great night here in Covid fairyland, but some of us are helping with Zoom lessons for 7 year olds tomorrow. In Science they are answering the question, ‘why would the Germans attempt to undermine a British vaccine costing x20 times less than a German vaccine’......should be good......

 

[BlueToff]

If there turns out to be some truth in these claims will the U.K be forced to reverse its roll out strategy with under 55’s being prioritised with the Oxford vaccine

@Dymak will be chuffed

In all seriousness, isn't this kind of a fair bit of the policy already?

Oxford AZ only just started to roll out on mass what, 10 days ago?

Most people who have received the vaccine so far will actually have had Pfizer. It's probably just about evening out right now?

 

[peteblue]

Honestly Pete, I love European countries. I don't even think the EU is 'big bad'. Whether we're better off in or out, well time will tell but I'm done with that argument.

End of the day, it's just a trading block. And this is an issue between a big Pharma company and a trading block. BILD and the other publications have run off an anonymous source and those claims have been firmly denied. Those publications will now have a case to answer unless they get on-record evidence to back up what they say. The one part of law I have a tiny (very tiny) grasping of is media law. You can't just say something like this and not have firm evidence.

We'll see in the coming days I suppose.

AZ, sue the crap out of them......

 

[tsubaki]

Well it looks like being a great night here in Covid fairyland, but some of us are helping with Zoom lessons for 7 year olds tomorrow. In Science they are answering the question, ‘why would the Germans attempt to undermine a British vaccine costing x20 times less than a German vaccine’......should be good......

Christ, you are tedious. They don’t want to undermine it, they want the vaccines they’ve paid for.

 

[JMT]

why oh why did the doctors keep Boris alive in that hospital, That was our lottery ticket out of this.

 

[Dymak]

I know plenty of people who have got the vaccine first jab, all of them in the category of 80+ - two of them are my grandparents who I would very much like to have in this mortal coil for a bit longer thank you very much - and one of them is my aunt who looks after my gran as she has dementia.

I understand, to an extent, your point, but what do you think would be the end goal?

We'd still have the same issue - we'd still have a lot of deaths, because the older people you don't think should be vaccinated will still be catching the virus. This thing has turned up in care homes where staff are tested twice a week and have been in lockdown for months. It's a virus, it spreads.

So giving millions more younger people their jab, and protecting them from serious illness, but not stopping them spreading it, isn't really going to get us anywhere either.

They'll have weighed up the risks. As I said, Indonesia have done it differently, and we'll have to see how that turns out, but while I have some reservations, I can't fault the idea of getting the old done first. I did initially question it, but that was more to do with ensuring frontline staff were the first in line as they were the ones treating multiple patients. Luckily, the UK's program so far has covered both groups and we're on the way to hitting the Feb 15th target. Still some going yet.

You don’t need to do the strawman; as if I’m advocating the condemnation of everyone over 70 to death, as I’ve never made that point. I’ve made a couple of points; one I know healthy working people that have dates for their jab that are as young as 50, which is just wrong, really. The other point relates to a hierarchy of tragedy if you like, which I don’t wish to discuss any further but there is a truth to it!

 

[BlueToff]

Okay, so Jan 4th was apparently when the first Oxford AZ jab was administered.

So that's 22 days ago as of tomorrow.

Hardly time to be able to draw any data so quite how the government sources would have it would be also questionable?

The only data they have is through testing which has got through independent regulators. If the EU didn't want the AZ vaccine, then they wouldn't be in the little bit arsed about starting a whole case against said company pulling out of their obligation, would they?

 

[BlueToff]

You don’t need to the strawman; as if I’m advocating the condemnation of everyone over 70 to death, as I’ve never made that point. I’ve made a couple of points; one I know healthy working people that have dates for their jab that are as young as 50, which is just wrong, really. The other point relates to a hierarchy of tragedy if you like, which I don’t wish to discuss any further but there is a truth to it!

I didn't say you were, and didn't mean it that way. I said myself, my nan probably is one of the safest people in terms of being at risk of catching COVID, because she never leaves her home and is cared for by my aunt and mum. But, if she did get it, then it probably wouldn't end well.

But hang on, isn't your argument that healthy working people of 50 should be getting the jab?