Current Affairs Coronavirus Thread - Serious stuff !!!

[ForeverBlue92]

I still dont get the obession with infection rate in comparison to deaths - im sure today there were 3,899 new cases and 18 deaths - which works out at less than 0.5% and thats not including those largely asymptomatic.

Surely therefore as long as the elderly and most vulnerable are sheltered as much as possible then largely healthy and less at risk people getting it and building up some form of natural immunity as a back up incase the vaccine doesn't come to fruition is the only realistic and natural way out of this?

Just seems we are that invested in a vaccine being just around the corner that we think lockdowns are sustainable. Dont get me wrong if deaths suddenly jump up by all means lock it all down again but at the moment without a vaccine we cant keep doing this as there will always be an inevitable spike.

I dont know what to think with it all anymore tbh.

 

[Brennan]

I still dont get the obession with infection rate in comparison to deaths - im sure today there were 3,899 new cases and 18 deaths - which works out at less than 0.5% and thats not including those largely asymptomatic.

Surely therefore as long as the elderly and most vulnerable are sheltered as much as possible then largely healthy and less at risk people getting it and building up some form of natural immunity as a back up incase the vaccine doesn't come to fruition is the only realistic and natural way out of this?

Just seems we are that invested in a vaccine being just around the corner that we think lockdowns are sustainable. Dont get me wrong if deaths suddenly jump up by all means lock it all down again but at the moment without a vaccine we cant keep doing this as there will always be an inevitable spike.

I dont know what to think with it all anymore tbh.

I find posts like this from you frustrating. You keep harping on about “the media” but you’ve clearly not read what “the media” is saying.

It’s not the number of cases now which is a problem. It’s the number of cases by mid October if case growth continues at its current pace. Which it will do without further measures. News outlets have been clear on this for over a week.

 

[Goat]

I find posts like this from you frustrating. You keep harping on about “the media” but you’ve clearly not read what “the media” is saying.

It’s not the number of cases now which is a problem. It’s the number of cases by mid October if case growth continues at its current pace. Which it will do without further measures. News outlets have been clear on this for over a week.

This is what "the media" are trying to tell us.

This is our future.

We saw it in March, we ignored it, we yet again have plenty of notice and yet again we will ignore it.

Cos "the media" arent to be trusted.

 

[ForeverBlue92]

I find posts like this from you frustrating. You keep harping on about “the media” but you’ve clearly not read what “the media” is saying.

It’s not the number of cases now which is a problem. It’s the number of cases by mid October if case growth continues at its current pace. Which it will do without further measures. News outlets have been clear on this for over a week.

But this is the point I keep making - FORGET how many cases it could be - im on about how many deaths it could be - if cases quadruple but deaths only still equate to around 0.5% then surely thats manageable in line with social distancing?

People bang on about a 2nd wave when they forget the official death rate was as high as around 7-8% of known cases back in April and we had no social distancing in place, no nightingale hospitals, no knowledge of how to treat patients, no drugs to help combat it, no procedures in place to protect the most vulnerable and care home residents, no use of face masks in public.

You're only answer to fight this is to lock down every 3 months or so once cases inevitably spike back up until we're all out of work or homeless or worse.

It just isnt sustainable and we seriously need to have difficult conversations on how to combat this long term if a vaccine isnt ready for another 12-18 months+

 

[Goat]

But this is the point I keep making - FORGET how many cases it could be - im on about how many deaths it could be - if cases quadruple but deaths only still equate to around 0.5% then surely thats manageable in line with social distancing?

People bang on about a 2nd wave when they forget the official death rate was as high as around 7-8% of known cases back in April and we had no social distancing in place, no nightingale hospitals, no knowledge of how to treat patients, no drugs to help combat it, no procedures in place to protect the most vulnerable and care home residents, no use of face masks in public.

You're only answer to fight this is to lock down every 3 or months once cases spike back up until we're all out of work or homeless or worse.

It just isnt sustainable and we seriously need to have difficult conversations on how to combat this long term if a vaccine isnt ready for another 12-18 months+

For me we have 2 choices.

We ride out the wave and see another 100k or so die.
Or
We have occasional lockdowns and save about 60k people.

A lockdown would be very damaging, but as I said in March, we can make more money, once somebody dies, that's the end.

 

[Brennan]

But this is the point I keep making - FORGET how many cases it could be - im on about how many deaths it could be - if cases quadruple but deaths only still equate to around 0.5% then surely thats manageable in line with social distancing?

People bang on about a 2nd wave when they forget the official death rate was as high as around 7-8% of known cases back in April and we had no social distancing in place, no nightingale hospitals, no knowledge of how to treat patients, no drugs to help combat it, no procedures in place to protect the most vulnerable and care home residents, no use of face masks in public.

You're only answer to fight this is to lock down every 3 months or so once cases inevitably spike back up until we're all out of work or homeless or worse.

It just isnt sustainable and we seriously need to have difficult conversations on how to combat this long term if a vaccine isnt ready for another 12-18 months+

You clearly fail to grasp how this works.

You don’t wait for thousands of people to start dying before taking measures. By that time it is too late.

 

[ForeverBlue92]

You clearly fail to grasp how this works.

You don’t wait for thousands of people to start dying before taking measures. By that time it is too late.

But who's to say thousands are or will be dying? all we are seeing at this stage is more people being tested positive and largely not needing hospital treatment in comparison to the numbers that were back in March/April when we did lockdown.

By all means if deaths and hospital numbers start ramping up then act but its all just a bit premature to be doing that at this stage imo.

Add in lockdown fatigue has set in for many and sadly for every responsible person there are groups of 10+ hanging around every street corner of Huyton, Kirkdale, Walton etc taking it back to their homes and spreading it we need better ways of dealing with this long term.

We can fire people into space and clone sheep but we are relying on century old tactics of lockdown which are not ultimately compatible in a modern globalised financial world.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

My overall point was that restaurants and pubs need to be shut. It was then pointed out that loads will lose their jobs. I then stated that those jobs can and should be saved by government stepping in and the private sector putting in. I was then accused of making up stories about private businesses doing ok post lockdown and couldn't chip in to save their own staff and businesses. But others have stated that their experience is that those businesses have been buoyant.

Chain restaurants including Pizza Hut and Starbucks are permanently closing over 1800 total locations during the pandemic. Here's the full list of chains.

Pizza Hut is the latest fast food chain to announce a wave of permanent closures during the pandemic.

www.businessinsider.com

This is obviously an American analysis, but I would be surprised if things were much different here. The eat out offer will have provided a stay of execution, but I would be amazed if footfall has been anywhere near the breakeven point over the year, even just for those periods where they were allowed to open.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

I find posts like this from you frustrating. You keep harping on about “the media” but you’ve clearly not read what “the media” is saying.

It’s not the number of cases now which is a problem. It’s the number of cases by mid October if case growth continues at its current pace. Which it will do without further measures. News outlets have been clear on this for over a week.

Indeed, I don't think people would be 'too' worried if things stayed as they are, but our knowledge of this and other infectious diseases suggests that cases rise pretty quickly. Due to the relative lack of testing in spring, I'm inclined to think the case numbers then were an awful lot higher than were recorded, so if we're drawing parallels, we're perhaps somewhere in February at the moment and are thinking about how we can stop a repeat of late March and April.

 

[YoboCopter]

Gunna be a long winter isnt it, you know all this talk of second wave etc will there just be a 3rd wave and so on till vaccine?

 

[Spadge Vernacular]

Gunna be a long winter isnt it, you know all this talk of second wave etc will there just be a 3rd wave and so on till vaccine?

Are we still in ‘one big wave’ of the pandemic? – COVID-19 FACTS

www.covid-19facts.com

 

[davek]

Chain restaurants including Pizza Hut and Starbucks are permanently closing over 1800 total locations during the pandemic. Here's the full list of chains.

Pizza Hut is the latest fast food chain to announce a wave of permanent closures during the pandemic.

www.businessinsider.com

This is obviously an American analysis, but I would be surprised if things were much different here. The eat out offer will have provided a stay of execution, but I would be amazed if footfall has been anywhere near the breakeven point over the year, even just for those periods where they were allowed to open.

TBH, I'm done with making the case for restaurants and ale houses to keep their heads above water. Their proprietors clearly dont give a flying one about public health.

Get them shut; keep them shut.

 

[Harryflashman]

on places making money I know some bars have absolutely smashed it post lockdown, I mean done really well . Interestingly , or probably not , I think they fall into two camps the better service and something a bit more personal and the concert square and some Baltic market places where they’re packing them in and it’s been bar rather than table service etc . I think the table service decree is the right thing although very probably too Late .

As regards restaurants I think it’s a surprise to hear places have ‘never done better ‘ , some ticked over nicely with takeaway even during lockdown but even with the offer you have to factor in the reduced capacity, the double and even trebling of cleaning bills plus it’s looked like it’s been couples rather than the big Groups with the extra starters for the table and a few additional bottles of wine . Also speak to cabbies they’re really suffering and that’s because during eat out loads we driving so that will tell you how the wine and drinks have been going and that’s a big earner .

places have done ok but I don’t see many making out like bandits, I do see places that have already shutting early and employing less staff . as regards the10pm finish I can see the reasoning even though the message as to whether it’s last orders or doors shut didn’t seem particularly clear . However over a week that’s potentially what 14 hrs ? Given the impact that many places have suffered it’ll be hard for many not to be letting staff go for the period , it’ll certainly mean reductions in hours .

a lot of places that weren’t viable or we’re struggling shut during lockdown as they took the money and run so most of what you’ve got are the relatively decent businesses but in my opinion people aren’t making fortunes, well apart it seems from the very lucky ones .

 

[Harryflashman]

TBH, I'm done with making the case for restaurants and ale houses to keep their heads above water. Their proprietors clearly dont give a flying one about public health.

Get them shut; keep them shut.

you’ve got a firmly held opinion I don’t agree and I’m not a fan of huge generalisations or stereotyping although I know from your posts you clearly are . I do think that the table service rule for pubs is too late and I think it’s a little was it has to be imposed . It’s not difficult to follow and you’re hugely reducing the time people are in close proximity, it seems A no brainer Especially when you see certain places ignore their responsibilities and jam people together .

I did see a pie chart the other day , it’s probably rubbish , putting pubs and restaurants low down when attributing outbreaks or infections. Unsurprisingly it was care homes , then workplace and schools aljough like I say i’ve no idea of the veracity so it could be rubbish . I would genuinely be interested in seeing the figures though and that’s not in a passive aggressive way i.

 

[Groucho]

I don’t like masks but will wear one with no complaint (medical, wear several daily with patients anyway).

The virus is clearly a serious issue that needs dealing with, and to protest against masks for me is a tad childish - just wear one.

What I have an issue with is the people who seem to think they’re self-righteous by slating anyone who has been out in any capacity. The world simply cannot continue to shut down all the time and demonising people who are going out in a sensible fashion is not going to encourage anyone to stay sensible.

Obviously those who are gathering in huge numbers (eg. Blackpool & Formby beaches*) are silly and should be discouraged at the moment, however I don’t think coming down like a ton of bricks on people who have drunk/eaten out and followed the rules is fair, while shops (who do not have to track and trace** yet you can spend longer in them with more people) and schools are as normal. I have two kids in school and one year group is already isolating after less than a week***. But no, don’t blame the gov’t for ignoring advice, blame the poor sod who spent an hour socially distancing in a pub.

It’s very difficult to express an opinion on this matter without getting jumped on and for me that’s wrong.





* because Blackpool, y’know

** not run by the NHS, instead privately and abysmally run

** not their years (yet)