Current Affairs Coronavirus Thread - Serious stuff !!!

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JEBUS_LIVES said:
Respectfully I disagree. If you intend to introduce something at a point where existing public trust is low, while asking people to trust that what you introduce is a 'game changer' and it falters - then it's worse than not introducing it.

As it is, it's being pushed through, hastened through, to ease a return to work (which is extremely important) and to deflect attention away from noise about a SPAD.

And I expect public trust in a process reliant on App led by someone who has in recent memory presided over a monumental data breach, coupled with the NHS own recent history with cyber attacks (WannaCry) is rightly sceptical.

It will be, as you suggest, pretty crucial where public adherence to the messages are upheld (big if) and where all the issues I raised are addressed. If only the Government were focussed solely on this issue...
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To me, it's just about trying to save lives.

I don't care about the Tories, or Labour, or who gets in at the next election.

If using an app and adhering to the rules helps save some people, it's worth doing, for that reason alone.
 
whiteshadow said:
So, despite being a doctor, you think track and trace is a waste of time, despite it being used by every country that has managed to get on top of the case numbers.

Pretty wreckless comment when all the evidence shows track and trace after reducing the initial number of cases is the way to control the number of infections.

Your answer is to, just give up and do nothing, as it's already there ....
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When did these countries use track and trace? When the numbers of infections where what? If we've had 60k excess deaths during this period of time, how many people do you think are infected in communities by now. Plus, do you know who's in charge of it? Do you know the security of the app they want to force people to use?
Please don't use my profession against me and call me reckless when my entire career is about caring for the public.
 
whiteshadow said:
To me, it's just about trying to save lives.

I don't care about the Tories, or Labour, or who gets in at the next election.

If using an app and adhering to the rules helps save some people, it's worth doing, for that reason alone.
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You are 100% correct with this bit.

The only problem is we are (or will be at an undetermined date in the future) using an app that we have no understanding of how (or if) it works, allied to a tracing system that was partially trained by Serco using pdfs and online quizzes apparently, which doesnt have any means of making sure people adhere to the rules or reporting breaches and which (from reports) appears to have less field workers to cover the entire UK than the city of Istanbul has devoted to contact tracing.

One of the worst modern political traits is announcing something and people think its been done. We've seen it loads of times during this crisis and it is ruining us.
 
whiteshadow said:
To me, it's just about trying to save lives.

I don't care about the Tories, or Labour, or who gets in at the next election.

If using an app and adhering to the rules helps save some people, it's worth doing, for that reason alone.
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Exactly right. But public perception and consent are critical. People will go along with something if they think it is fair and applied equally. They won't if they think it isn't.

And particularly as more evidence starts to emerge about differing socioeconomic impacts of the virus - areas with pre-existing socioeconomic disadvantages are much more likely to be subject to 'localised lockdown' resulting from greater exposure, as well as much more likely to be fined for breaches that other areas aren't - it will present many more problems.

The App and tracing system needs to be successful at the first attempt - rushing it through is not sensible in the current climate.
 
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DrEFC said:
When did these countries use track and trace? When the numbers of infections where what? If we've had 60k excess deaths during this period of time, how many people do you think are infected in communities by now. Plus, do you know who's in charge of it? Do you know the security of the app they want to force people to use?
Please don't use my profession against me and call me reckless when my entire career is about caring for the public.
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I agree with you on the number of infections being too high. I said in an earlier post they should have had the system in place before they lifted lockdown.

Trying to curb the infections is better than doing nothing though and will delay any future peaks and lockdowns, even if only marginally.

Mentioned about security in an earlier post too. Most people have facebook, use google, both of which pretty know everywhere you go, what you buy, etc. yet are worried about using an app to help saves peoples lives, seems pretty rediculous.

I imagine if the government wanted to really know stuff about people they would have means and ways of doing it that wouldn't require people to download an app either.

I said you're wreckless because most medical experts believe or are using track and trace in countries to curb the outbreak.

Being a doctor your words carry a lot of weight and your posts would give the impression that the medical establisment are against track and trace, which isn't true. Look how many countries are using it successfully, New Zealand, South Korea, Thaiwan etc.

You trying to say all their medical experts and Epidemiologists are wrong to be recommending that course of action?
 
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