Current Affairs Coronavirus Thread - Serious stuff !!!

[Harryflashman]

I’m no fan of Morgan and I’ve openly said that on numerous occasions .

however if government ministers want to come on the telly not answer questions and repeat the “we’re following the science manta” ,which reeks of Cummings by the way , they have to expect to be harshly challenged on it .

If you’re a minister and a member of the government you can’t expect to simply duck questions because it suits you . I’ve no time for Morgan or his history but I’d be happy enough to see Jeffery archer , klopp or Gerrard getting into them if it meant questions were being asked and they were being called on their obvious BS being .

It seems attempts are being made to censor the written press , we have questions over the independence of much of the media, we haven’t had questions from the opposition for much of this . I don’t want to see a government simply lie and unchallenged be allowed to promote falsehoods as truth particularly during a huge crisis such as this .

 

[zzr45]

If it's good enough for the Americans it's good enough for us is your answer, it's made to specific standards and templates that are being used around the world to manufacture this type of PPE kit.

You have private self-employed at home tailors and seamstresses manufacturing gowns and scrubs and delivering them to hospitals and the staff are glad to receive it.

Is it actually happening though? It seems to be a story that’s been oft repeated that local business has been turned down so they threaten to sell their stuff in America, but transpires that either A) it’s not going anywhere or B) going to private firms who are then trying to hawk it on elsewhere, with similar results.

It has to meet BSi standards (which are there to keep users and patients safe) to be used in the UK. If companies aren’t allowing their products to be tested, they can’t be procured by the NHS. Just because it’s produced to a guideline doesn’t ensure quality.


Yes it’s crap there’s not enough PPE, but using stuff that’s unsafe is just as, if not more, dangerous.

 

[OnlyBlueWillDo]

Is it actually happening though? It seems to be a story that’s been oft repeated that local business has been turned down so they threaten to sell their stuff in America, but transpires that either A) it’s not going anywhere or B) going to private firms who are then trying to hawk it on elsewhere, with similar results.

It has to meet BSi standards (which are there to keep users and patients safe) to be used in the UK. If companies aren’t allowing their products to be tested, they can’t be procured by the NHS. Just because it’s produced to a guideline doesn’t ensure quality.


Yes it’s crap there’s not enough PPE, but using stuff that’s unsafe is just as, if not more, dangerous.

Educate yourself...

BBC One - Panorama, Has the Government Failed the NHS?

The delays and mistakes that may have put the lives of NHS staff at risk.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Bruce Wayne]

I’m no fan of Morgan and I’ve openly said that on numerous occasions .

however if government ministers want to come on the telly not answer questions and repeat the “we’re following the science manta” ,which reeks of Cummings by the way , they have to expect to be harshly challenged on it .

If you’re a minister and a member of the government you can’t expect to simply duck questions because it suits you . I’ve no time for Morgan or his history but I’d be happy enough to see Jeffery archer , klopp or Gerrard getting into them if it meant questions were being asked and they were being called on their obvious BS being .

It seems attempts are being made to censor the written press , we have questions over the independence of much of the media, we haven’t had questions from the opposition for much of this . I don’t want to see a government simply lie and unchallenged be allowed to promote falsehoods as truth particularly during a huge crisis such as this .

I edited my previous post to add a bit of context, but there are clearly understandable challenges involved in the global supply of PPE at the moment, as you'd expect when demand for it must have risen enormously in a very short space of time. Speaking personally, I'd love to know more about that, to understand where PPE comes from, the regulatory requirements the NHS has for it in terms of quality, how the procurement system works in terms of bringing new suppliers online, whether the shut down in global trade is hindering things. Quite basic stuff. I'm sure there are many people from industry and so on that could join the conversation and make it informative.

Instead, the very tone of Morgan's interviews put the interviewee on the back foot immediately, because they know they're going to get attacked, so adopt a default defensive posture where their primary aim is to not trip up (too badly). I'm afraid that's not holding the government to account at all as it encourages a siege mentality that is really not needed right now. You can bring differing points of view across without being an aggressive, confrontational arsewipe.

 

[Brisan123]

The one rewarding thing in that article is that the manufacture of the vaccine (if successful )is that it will be open sourced and widely manufactured
American companies wanting exclusive world wide rights is a shame on them

 

[Brisan123]

For COVID-19 Patients, Could Breathing Easier Be as Simple as Flipping Over?

BU pulmonology experts will team up with Boston Medical Center to investigate if lying face down might improve lung function

www.bu.edu

That was standard practice in Italian covid 19 wards

 

[Harryflashman]

I edited my previous post to add a bit of context, but there are clearly understandable challenges involved in the global supply of PPE at the moment, as you'd expect when demand for it must have risen enormously in a very short space of time. Speaking personally, I'd love to know more about that, to understand where PPE comes from, the regulatory requirements the NHS has for it in terms of quality, how the procurement system works in terms of bringing new suppliers online, whether the shut down in global trade is hindering things. Quite basic stuff. I'm sure there are many people from industry and so on that could join the conversation and make it informative.

Instead, the very tone of Morgan's interviews put the interviewee on the back foot immediately, because they know they're going to get attacked, so adopt a default defensive posture where their primary aim is to not trip up (too badly). I'm afraid that's not holding the government to account at all as it encourages a siege mentality that is really not needed right now. You can bring differing points of view across without being an aggressive, confrontational arsewipe.

ok so that’s fair I prefer c4 news, Its the news i watch but for the last month or so we’ve had lies and untruths served up as fact . Because of his ‘popularity ‘ they still turn up to Morgan it’s something to watch them get challenged on .

I get we disagree but if a couple of people at home over breakfast suddenly take on board care home deaths or issues around PPE then I think he’s probably achieving something because Morgan is hitting a different audience than many others .

 

[Brisan123]

Well, they argue that a couple it requires ICU capacity to be above 60 beds per million people. Britain's ICU capacity is on the borderline (~66), which may be a factor, and of course, social distancing wasn't particularly well adhered to, hence why lockdown was issued after the weekend when people appeared to go hiking in the national parks en masse.

Perhaps another factor is the annual vulnerability to flu. Countries like Italy and Spain suffer from seasonal flu, due in part to underlying health issues that render their populations vulnerable. I've said repeatedly on various threads that we shouldn't continue to live unhealthily and expect the NHS to pick up the tab. It'll come back to bite us, and it's noticeable that this is happening here during the pandemic.

The wife and I were debating this last night as it seems bewildering that Czech is seemingly doing well despite making so many bungles. One factor in their favour is that despite being heavy drinkers, the population is generally not overweight. Here, that's certainly not the case, and certainly not among many of the ethnic minority communities that have suffered most from the virus.

Problem is Bruce overweight is the new normal and people with a BMI of 25-30 do not generally class themselves as overweight
I have a BMI of 24 and I struggle at times to maintain it
Pubs being closed is a help as I not a home drinker and do not do takeaways
We need to educate the population on diet and exercise

 

[Bruce Wayne]

ok so that’s fair I prefer c4 news, Its the news i watch but for the last month or so we’ve had lies and untruths served up as fact . Because of his ‘popularity ‘ they still turn up to Morgan it’s something to watch them get challenged on .

I get we disagree but if a couple of people at home over breakfast suddenly take on board care home deaths or issues around PPE then I think he’s probably achieving something because Morgan is hitting a different audience than many others .

I do wonder if people tune into him precisely because they dislike the Tories (or remainers during the Brexit debate) and just want to see them shouted at or 'done over' in some way. It's a bit like Trump's support. He's a cretin, but people think he's both on their side, and sticking it to people who aren't on their side. For Morgan, he's the news version of watching Liverpool get beaten. Satisfying, but it doesn't change the general crapness of Everton one bit.

 

[peteblue]

I edited my previous post to add a bit of context, but there are clearly understandable challenges involved in the global supply of PPE at the moment, as you'd expect when demand for it must have risen enormously in a very short space of time. Speaking personally, I'd love to know more about that, to understand where PPE comes from, the regulatory requirements the NHS has for it in terms of quality, how the procurement system works in terms of bringing new suppliers online, whether the shut down in global trade is hindering things. Quite basic stuff. I'm sure there are many people from industry and so on that could join the conversation and make it informative.

Instead, the very tone of Morgan's interviews put the interviewee on the back foot immediately, because they know they're going to get attacked, so adopt a default defensive posture where their primary aim is to not trip up (too badly). I'm afraid that's not holding the government to account at all as it encourages a siege mentality that is really not needed right now. You can bring differing points of view across without being an aggressive, confrontational arsewipe.

It‘s not even a very clever interview technique. Why ministers go along with him I have no idea. He’s a showman, not an interviewer. Bullying or non ending questioning just elicits sympathy for the now victim......

 

[Harryflashman]

I do wonder if people tune into him precisely because they dislike the Tories (or remainers during the Brexit debate) and just want to see them shouted at or 'done over' in some way. It's a bit like Trump's support. He's a cretin, but people think he's both on their side, and sticking it to people who aren't on their side. For Morgan, he's the news version of watching Liverpool get beaten. Satisfying, but it doesn't change the general crapness of Everton one bit.

I think he’s got a huge audience though of which I’m not one , although I will admit to watching some of his clips . I think people like him , for some reason , enjoy a popularity and therefore have a control over public opinion hugely out of sync with with talent .

 

[Bruce Wayne]

Problem is Bruce overweight is the new normal and people with a BMI of 25-30 do not generally clas themselves as overweight
I have a BMI of 24 and I struggle at times to maintain it
Pubs being closed is a help as I not a home drinker and do not do takeaways
We need to educate the population on diet and exercise

For sure. We talk of the NHS being stretched at the moment though, and that's despite the vast majority of 'normal' usage falling away. As I said earlier, there will be a lot of residual usage of the NHS as a result of the pandemic, plus the likely return to the normal usage levels we saw before it. That's going to be incredibly tough to maintain, especially at a time when you would imagine government tax revenues will fall considerably, and unemployment payments are going to rise. We haven't discussed it much, and you hope to goodness it's postponed, but the spectre of Brexit also lingers 8 months away as well.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

It‘s not even a very clever interview technique. Why ministers go along with him I have no idea. He’s a showman, not an interviewer. Bullying or non ending questioning just elicits sympathy for the now victim......

It's worth remembering that he comes from a tabloid background, and his television style is a tabloid one. You wouldn't turn to a red top to be informed on something.

 

[Harryflashman]

It‘s not even a very clever interview technique. Why ministers go along with him I have no idea. He’s a showman, not an interviewer. Bullying or non ending questioning just elicits sympathy for the now victim......

I agree with your comment on his technique I probably do disagree with your comment on the end result. I’m not sure he generates a lot of sympathy, maybe he does .
Perhaps you , me or both of us are allowing ourselves to see what we want .

 

[Bruce Wayne]

Speculating somewhat, but I dare say this would give you better insights into the PPE situation than all of Morgan's interviews on the topic

Connecting healthcare and manufacturing: The challenges of COVID-19

Tim Minshall, head of the IfM, looks at the many challenges of matching offers of support from the manufacturing community with the dynamic and uncertain needs of the healthcare system.

www.ifm.eng.cam.ac.uk