Better than 85-87

Westend Blue

Player Valuation: £15m
I think it's the complete opposite. The speed and intensity of a modern team would have the older team sucking air like they're on Mt. Everest by halftime.
Fitness is the main difference that's easily rectified. Technique has always being king in sports.

You mentioned basketball before skills haven't improve bar three point shooting and that's more analytics based as points per possession is better at 3pt shooting. Big men are trash compared to the older days and most NBA title winners are either incredibly stacked or have players that can score in isolation.

Cricket is another example players can play for up to 20 years and good players are good players in many different formats and styles the modern teams being better than older ones is an utter myth
 

TheBigIguana

Player Valuation: £70m
Fitness is the main difference that's easily rectified. Technique has always being king in sports.

You mentioned basketball before skills haven't improve bar three point shooting and that's more analytics based as points per possession is better at 3pt shooting. Big men are trash compared to the older days and most NBA title winners are either incredibly stacked or have players that can score in isolation.

Cricket is another example players can play for up to 20 years and good players are good players in many different formats and styles the modern teams being better than older ones is an utter myth
The NBA is a whole different conversation but there tends to be this myth that defense is worse now, and that's far from true, but it appears true because offense is better and that goes beyond just shooting although that is the catalyst.

My opinion is that if the game is faster and requires more fitness than the skill level is higher because doing something at higher pace is automatically higher skill. It isn't to say that guys in the past weren't talented, just that the guys now are more talented.
 

AndyC

Moderator
Staff member
Too strong and technically superior for Reid and Brace. Sorry.

not saying they weren’t great in their day. They were class and won titles. In the modern era they’d be average though.

the Sony Walkman was technological genius in the 80s. Would you buy one now though?
Gomes and Felli too strong for Reid and Bracewell...
Barkley compared to Bally...
My word, the sunshine must be getting to people and addling the grey matter.
 

Viennablue

Player Valuation: £750k
Gomes and Felli too strong for Reid and Bracewell...
Barkley compared to Bally...
My word, the sunshine must be getting to people and addling the grey matter.
Ha!

how many games did Bally play in the 83-87 team?

I didn’t mention Bally. He was more ofa 60s/70s player wasn’t he? Love those white boots though. Really cool. Could hit one from distance from what I’ve seen on YouTube. Class player who would still get on well in today’s game.

Feli and Gomes would be technically superior. And their heights combined with modern strength and conditioning would be too much for the 80s central midfield.
 

JordanianEmbassy

Player Valuation: £1.5m
My opinion is that if the game is faster and requires more fitness than the skill level is higher because doing something at higher pace is automatically higher skill. It isn't to say that guys in the past weren't talented, just that the guys now are more talented.
It doesn't actually work like that though does it? For example in the late 80s the game was faster than the early to mid 80s, but the standard of the game dropped.

And you are also assuming pace and fitness are the only factors, which they aren't.

Put Ross Barkley in the 85-87 squad and he'd still continuously make the wrong decisions about when to pass and when to hold on to the ball.

Put Felliani in there and his lack of positional discipline and the fact that he only played at his best every other game would mean he would lose his place to Reid or Bracewell.

Put Walcott in there and his crosses would still be inaccurate and he would still lack the confidence to run at defenders...... and even being fitter than Trevor Steven he just wouldn't be able to keep him out of the side. Absolutely no way.
 

TheBigIguana

Player Valuation: £70m
It doesn't actually work like that though does it? For example in the late 80s the game was faster than the early to mid 80s, but the standard of the game dropped.

And you are also assuming pace and fitness are the only factors, which they aren't.

Put Ross Barkley in the 85-87 squad and he'd still continuously make the wrong decisions about when to pass and when to hold on to the ball.

Put Felliani in there and his lack of positional discipline and the fact that he only played at his best every other game would mean he would lose his place to Reid or Bracewell.

Put Walcott in there and his crosses would still be inaccurate and he would still lack the confidence to run at defenders...... and even being fitter than Trevor Steven he just wouldn't be able to keep him out of the side. Absolutely no way.
The thing is even if it was faster in the late 80s the gap was relatively small compared to what it is between then and now.

Ultimately when I look back at old games like that I just don't see the skill level being close. That's an arguable point no doubt, but I really do challenge you to go back and watch how often the ball goes long, how much is based on the center forward winning headers and how much less passing play is done than modern games. There's a reason that the best teams now don't do much of any of that stuff. Pressing systems back then don't really require much coordination because any amount of pressure and the ball went long. Nowadays even decent teams would slice through that.

And I don't mean that some players weren't exceptional. But the average player now is higher level.. Someone like Maradona could play with anyone.
 

BigBlueConk

Player Valuation: £70m
One thing is undeniable... The 80s teams were teams and not a bunch of (insert insults here) like many players we have had over the last 30 years.
The only improvement with the modern player is fitness and more emphasis on technical ability.
But the 80s lads had more fun!
 

Jeff Jones

Player Valuation: £35m
Can't agree with bailey better than mad pat. Bailey was the luckiest guy alive to a) play for Everton and b) play at that time. Van den hauwe was a league above. Baines wasn't as good a defender, but offensively he was better for me and perfect to overlap sheedy, who wasn't the most energetic
I can't imagine anyone overlapping Sheedy, even Baines. Why would he need to?

Nothing against Kev, he's one of my favourite all time Blues.
 

Jeff Jones

Player Valuation: £35m
Too strong and technically superior for Reid and Brace. Sorry.

not saying they weren’t great in their day. They were class and won titles. In the modern era they’d be average though.

the Sony Walkman was technological genius in the 80s. Would you buy one now though?
I've been trying to get one for weeks. Can't find one anywhere.
 

Jimmy Grimble

Player Valuation: £10m
I can't imagine anyone overlapping Sheedy, even Baines. Why would he need to?

Nothing against Kev, he's one of my favourite all time Blues.
Sheedy wasn't your pacey hare down the line, take them on kind of winger, but he could cross and pass majestically. The option of crossing for sharp, gray, or laying off inch perfect to the overlapping Baines is equally productive.
 

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