Would Siggurdsson walk into the Top 4?

[Yarrgh]

Well he wouldn't run into them would he? The slow so-and-so.

 

[Yarrgh]

Walk into their bench

So he is a perfect replacement for Barkley then?

 

[Tel001]

Barkley is a completely different player, he is playing 90+ passes a game at 95% accuracy. That is what the top 6 want.

30 passes at 70% accuracy won't cut it.

Siggy attempts risky, forward , penetrating passes , second only to Silva in chances created .

 

[BlueToff]

Barkley is a completely different player, he is playing 90+ passes a game at 95% accuracy. That is what the top 6 want.

30 passes at 70% accuracy won't cut it.

Well, it's what Sarri wants. There's a difference.

 

[BlueToff]

This is a good point and I have noticed it too. Especially since the Fulham home game his through balls have been far more frequent, and it is great to have someone in the side that has the ability to play them.

It helps when he has people making runs for him to pass to, tbf

 

[Parker]

It helps when he has people making runs for him to pass to, tbf

Players who don't shy away from receiving the ball at every opportunity.

 

[APN_EFC]

No way

He's competing with

Silva or De Bruyne
Mata or Pogba - actually now I think about it Man U could use him
Ozil or Ramsey
LFC I don't see where he fits in
Can't displace Delle Ali or Eriksen or get in their system
Doesn't fit at Chelsea either who already have a young and oldish player forthis position

 

[efcjames]

So he is a perfect replacement for Barkley then?

Most likely.

 

[Darth Toffeeman]

He is an excellent footballer capable of magic moments.

The top 6 also possess high quality players too.

The weakness in the side currently is a lethal striker and the right hand side.
Not that we have bad players in these roles, they are just weaker than the top 6 clubs options.

So Sigurdsson is good enough, but not really required as the top 6 clubs are already strong in that area.

 

[Timak]

Siggy attempts risky, forward , penetrating passes , second only to Silva in chances created .

You've made me dig out the stats again.....

He is doing what he did for Swansea, he generates very high volumes of low quality chances and shots from very few touches. He gets a very high volume by taking all the set pieces, playing a high number of minutes and shooting/attempting a cross at 3x the rate of most other forwards.

His open play chance quality creation is nothing spectacular. But much better than last year.

The attached shows his expected performance based on the average player taking shots / making passes from the positions he does would expect to get.

From this we can see the shots he has taken would normally generate 1 goal, and he has 4. This can either mean a player is better at long shots than average, or has been really lucky. GS has outperformed other players at long shots for a long time so I think it is fair to say that he is really good at them.

In terms of chance creation he is generating a high volume of chances but of low quality. This is because the vast bulk of chances are created from set pieces and crosses which are converted far less frequently.

From this we can see his key passes (passes resulting in a shot) from open play is 12, with 16 from set pieces.

The open play chances he has created have an expected return of 1.56 goals. Pretty much identical to Troy Deeney.

Ryan Fraser has created similar numbers of open play chances (14 vs 12) but his have been much higher quality with an expected assist score of 3.84.

In other words every chance created by Fraser is more than twice as likely to result in a goal (e.g. a square ball to a striker in front of goal rather than a cross into a crowded box).

Open play xG (from 10 teams)
Man City Silva 4.36
Chelsea Hazard 2.36
Watford Deeney 1.54 (to illustrate my point Hoeblas of Watford has a higher combined xA than Gylfi from set pieces)
Everton Sigurdsson 1.56 (Walcott 1.42; Digne 1.11)
Fulham Vietto 2.08
Arsenal Ozil 1.88

 

[Tel001]

You've made me dig out the stats again.....

He is doing what he did for Swansea, he generates very high volumes of low quality chances and shots from very few touches. He gets a very high volume by taking all the set pieces, playing a high number of minutes and shooting/attempting a cross at 3x the rate of most other forwards.

His open play chance quality creation is nothing spectacular. But much better than last year.

The attached shows his expected performance based on the average player taking shots / making passes from the positions he does would expect to get.

From this we can see the shots he has taken would normally generate 1 goal, and he has 4. This can either mean a player is better at long shots than average, or has been really lucky. GS has outperformed other players at long shots for a long time so I think it is fair to say that he is really good at them.

In terms of chance creation he is generating a high volume of chances but of low quality. This is because the vast bulk of chances are created from set pieces and crosses which are converted far less frequently.

From this we can see his key passes (passes resulting in a shot) from open play is 12, with 16 from set pieces.

The open play chances he has created have an expected return of 1.56 goals. Pretty much identical to Troy Deeney.

Ryan Fraser has created similar numbers of open play chances (14 vs 12) but his have been much higher quality with an expected assist score of 3.84.

In other words every chance created by Fraser is more than twice as likely to result in a goal (e.g. a square ball to a striker in front of goal rather than a cross into a crowded box).

Open play xG (from 10 teams)
Man City Silva 4.36
Chelsea Hazard 2.36
Watford Deeney 1.54 (to illustrate my point Hoeblas of Watford has a higher combined xA than Gylfi from set pieces)
Everton Sigurdsson 1.56 (Walcott 1.42; Digne 1.11)
Fulham Vietto 2.08
Arsenal Ozil 1.88

You can use stats to prove anything , firstly he hasn’t been taking all our set pieces, and he should have at least another 4 assists if Walcott etc hasn’t missed sitters. The point I was replying to was that I said if barkleybcan get mins I’m a top 6 team them siggy can. He replied saying barkley had a 90% pass completion I responded with the comment that siggy actually tries complicated passes that go forward.

 

[mkrudden]

You've made me dig out the stats again.....

He is doing what he did for Swansea, he generates very high volumes of low quality chances and shots from very few touches. He gets a very high volume by taking all the set pieces, playing a high number of minutes and shooting/attempting a cross at 3x the rate of most other forwards.

His open play chance quality creation is nothing spectacular. But much better than last year.

The attached shows his expected performance based on the average player taking shots / making passes from the positions he does would expect to get.

From this we can see the shots he has taken would normally generate 1 goal, and he has 4. This can either mean a player is better at long shots than average, or has been really lucky. GS has outperformed other players at long shots for a long time so I think it is fair to say that he is really good at them.

In terms of chance creation he is generating a high volume of chances but of low quality. This is because the vast bulk of chances are created from set pieces and crosses which are converted far less frequently.

From this we can see his key passes (passes resulting in a shot) from open play is 12, with 16 from set pieces.

The open play chances he has created have an expected return of 1.56 goals. Pretty much identical to Troy Deeney.

Ryan Fraser has created similar numbers of open play chances (14 vs 12) but his have been much higher quality with an expected assist score of 3.84.

In other words every chance created by Fraser is more than twice as likely to result in a goal (e.g. a square ball to a striker in front of goal rather than a cross into a crowded box).

Open play xG (from 10 teams)
Man City Silva 4.36
Chelsea Hazard 2.36
Watford Deeney 1.54 (to illustrate my point Hoeblas of Watford has a higher combined xA than Gylfi from set pieces)
Everton Sigurdsson 1.56 (Walcott 1.42; Digne 1.11)
Fulham Vietto 2.08
Arsenal Ozil 1.88

I've seen this "quality of chance" being bandied about but it's surely subjective isn't it? It's subjectivity trying to be shoe-horned into objectivity.
Unless of course it considers the player being passed to for the chance, whether he is left footed or right footed, whether he has a particular skill in relation to a type of finish, whether he's quick, whether he's slow. Does the striker / receiver of the pass from Sig correctly manipulate the ball when he receives it? Does that affect the quality of the chance?

What i've seen with my eyes is Gylfi Sigurdssen play a number of passes to which should have been finished. Some to Tosun, some to Walcott, wasn't the through ball which won the penalty vs Utd from Richarlison? Who could have finished if he'd stayed on his feet but rightly went down.

I'm on board to a certain degree with using chances created, goals and assists to judge Gylfi from an attacking perspective. To start throwing in this 'quality of chance' is of lesser importance in my opinion.

 

[Timak]

You can use stats to prove anything , firstly he hasn’t been taking all our set pieces, and he should have at least another 4 assists if Walcott etc hasn’t missed sitters. The point I was replying to was that I said if barkleybcan get mins I’m a top 6 team them siggy can. He replied saying barkley had a 90% pass completion I responded with the comment that siggy actually tries complicated passes that go forward.

Well no, those are exactly the stats I've shown. No pass to another player is converted 100% of the time. The quality of chances Gylfi has created this year would on average see 2.5 goals scored (1.5 from open play), he actually has 1 assist. So he has been unlucky so far.

Barkley has 3 assists from less than half the playing minutes but should only have 1 from the total quality of the chances he has provided.

However Barkley has also played 90+ passes at 95% accuracy compared to 25 a game at 70% accuracy from Gylfi.

I've seen this "quality of chance" being bandied about but it's surely subjective isn't it? It's subjectivity trying to be shoe-horned into objectivity.
Unless of course it considers the player being passed to for the chance, whether he is left footed or right footed, whether he has a particular skill in relation to a type of finish, whether he's quick, whether he's slow. Does the striker / receiver of the pass from Sig correctly manipulate the ball when he receives it? Does that affect the quality of the chance?

What i've seen with my eyes is Gylfi Sigurdssen play a number of passes to which should have been finished. Some to Tosun, some to Walcott, wasn't the through ball which won the penalty vs Utd from Richarlison? Who could have finished if he'd stayed on his feet but rightly went down.

I'm on board to a certain degree with using chances created, goals and assists to judge Gylfi from an attacking perspective. To start throwing in this 'quality of chance' is of lesser importance in my opinion.

The quality of chance stat is much improved. I don't know what the site I linked to uses as a model but the likes of Statsbomb allow for covering defenders etc. I think it is a much fairer way of measuring than "key passes" which don't distinguish between a pass to Messi on the halfway line resulting in a goal or a dribble that takes out half the defence then a pass to a team mate for a tap in.

 

[Tel001]

Well no, those are exactly the stats I've shown. No pass to another player is converted 100% of the time. The quality of chances Gylfi has created this year would on average see 2.5 goals scored (1.5 from open play), he actually has 1 assist. So he has been unlucky so far.

Barkley has 3 assists from less than half the playing minutes but should only have 1 from the total quality of the chances he has provided.

However Barkley has also played 90+ passes at 95% accuracy compared to 25 a game at 70% accuracy from Gylfi.



The quality of chance stat is much improved. I don't know what the site I linked to uses as a model but the likes of Statsbomb allow for covering defenders etc. I think it is a much fairer way of measuring than "key passes" which don't distinguish between a pass to Messi on the halfway line resulting in a goal or a dribble that takes out half the defence then a pass to a team mate for a tap in.

Given the choice I’d have siggy over barkley every day of the week.

 

[Jamalio Danubio DiCanio]

He's a good player. Probably one of the best outside the 'Top 6' clubs alongside the likes of Zaha, Vardy, Richarlison, Doucoure, Dunk, Neves, Patricio, Pickford, Arnuatovic, Felipe Anderson.

Individually I think all of those players have a very good chance of getting in the 25 man squad of the every top 6 team. maybe even the match day 18 for most teams. I don’t think many would get a regular start though - not when everyone is fit. United and Arsenal are the 2 teams where a lot of these players might have a chance of starting.