Match Thread Wolves v Everton, Sat 11/8/18 17:30

[paulbefc]

Going to be a very interesting read on here if there is a similar tackle on one of our players and the ref doesn't give a red because "it wasn't excessive force" wonder if we'll be shaking our heads in agreement with the ref............

If the ref plays on there, I think most everyone ends up giving Jagielka credit for recovering his poor touch and very little is made of the incident. That'll probably be what happens if the exact same thing was to happen to one of ours.

 

[Mugwump]

Only Pawson apparently said he’d sent him off your denying an obvious goalscoring opportunity, when your striker didn’t even have the ball. It should have been a yellow for catching him on the follow through after over stretching to win the ball. It was a donkey decision by a bad homer of a referee.

You watch him change it in his report to cover himself. Haven't actually seen that anywhere that he said that, is there a link to it?

 

[Mugwump]

If the ref plays on there, I think most everyone ends up giving Jagielka credit for recovering his poor touch and very little is made of the incident. That'll probably be what happens if the exact same thing was to happen to one of ours.

Its going to happen quite a lot i'd say. Until we got the one against us i never even knew it was a thing. After, i've been wondering why a large percentage of tackles arent red cards.

 

[paulbefc]

I didnt explain why it isnt down to the letter of the law at all. He threw himself into a tackle, he just about took the ball, then he connected with the players ankle. They are all indisputable facts. The technicalities are all there for a red card to be given so i haven't undermined anything. Not sure why you aren't getting its the system i'm pointing out is the problem. My personal opinion, or your personal opinion is irrelevant. You have stated in your opinion his tackle wasnt excessive, i'd agree as well. Unfortunately for you, your name or my name isnt Craig Pawson, and he thought it was excessive. Like it or not, if the ref thinks the tackle has excessive force, its a red. Thats the rules the game is refereed by and it doesnt actually mean the ref has made an error either, he just has a different opinion. So unless there is a system to standardise some of these decisions ( which there isnt ) that clears that up.

As for the rest of my paragraph not adding anything, it adds nothing for you because you dont want to hear the Everton wall wasnt 10 yards from the ball. So the ref has pretty much stuffed up with the placement of the ball and the placement of the wall. We both got dudded, we just had a bloke who it didnt matter to i guess.

So the ref cannot be wrong under any circumstances because of "the system". Even though it's the ref's decision and he was perfectly within his right not to give the red if he agreed with us on the excessive force. Perfect.

It doesn't add anything because it's a hypothetical that had no effect on anything that actually happened. If the free-kick had been blocked, I'd agree that it should be retaken. But it wasn't, was it? It was scored. This shouldn't be difficult to grasp.

 

[evertony]

Wolves fan here. Very interesting to read comments about today's game on this forum, as I was at the match. I thought Everton were really poor, even when they had 11 men. It was a bit like playing a mid table championship team who got a bit lucky. I thought that our passing and movement were another class compared with you guys. Were you folks really watching the same match?

I think you’re confused.....Everton were in blue.
Easy mistake I guess when you’re watching in black and white in Cannock.
And we wouldn’t really know what a championship side looked or played like.
Crack on.

 

[LouReedwalkonthewildside]

If the ref plays on there, I think most everyone ends up giving Jagielka credit for recovering his poor touch and very little is made of the incident. That'll probably be what happens if the exact same thing was to happen to one of ours.

All about opinions mate, if that same tackle had happened to one of our players yesterday then I would have been screaming for a red, but we know refs and consistency don't go hand in hand.

 

[Doco]

I have a big problem with Silva already why the [Poor language removed] did he even start jags in the first place ....

 

[paulbefc]

All about opinions mate, if that same tackle had happened to one of our players yesterday then I would have been screaming for a red, but we know refs and consistency don't go hand in hand.

Same here, but there's no way I'd actually think it was one. I'll never think it's ok for a red to be given for a good tackle that accidentally catches the opponent after the ball's been won, as it's a contact sport.

 

[Doco]

Sorry about that .

 

[LouReedwalkonthewildside]

Wolves fan here. Very interesting to read comments about today's game on this forum, as I was at the match. I thought Everton were really poor, even when they had 11 men. It was a bit like playing a mid table championship team who got a bit lucky. I thought that our passing and movement were another class compared with you guys. Were you folks really watching the same match?

You were 'nice and tidy' and passed the ball around without really threatening, but you were absolutely gash when you got into the final third where it actually matters, at times you would have thought it was you who were down to 10 men, we will be looking down at you from a high, and you'll stay up by the skin of your teeth.

 

[Mugwump]

So the ref cannot be wrong under any circumstances because of "the system". Even though it's the ref's decision and he was perfectly within his right not to give the red if he agreed with us on the excessive force. Perfect.

It doesn't add anything because it's a hypothetical that had no effect on anything that actually happened. If the free-kick had been blocked, I'd agree that it should be retaken. But it wasn't, was it? It was scored. This shouldn't be difficult to grasp.

So it only matters because we scored? Hmmmm. And its not hypothetical. Have a look for yourself. The ball was placed in the wrong position. Thats factual. The wall wasnt 10 yeards back. Thats factual. How is any of that hypothetical.

And no, the system isnt perfect, and refs can get it wrong, i havent said refs dont make mistakes. If a player handballs like Maradona did to score a goal for example, its a black and white decision. If the ref gets that wrong he has made a gross error. Problem is with some decisions, its down to an interpetation or the opinion of a ref. Thats why this decision that went against you has plenty of people saying it was right, and plenty saying it was wrong. I dont know how old you are, but like irishtony1878 said in his post, it probably depends on the era of football you grew up watching. For me, i'm used to seeing tackles like that as ok. Its not the case so much anymore. On this occasion, one person can think its a bad decision, and another can think its fine and depending on your point of view neither are actually wrong.

I'm sure if the previous poster is right and he was sent of for denying an obvious goal scoring opportunity, the red should get overturned.

 

[paulbefc]

So it only matters because we scored? Hmmmm. And its not hypothetical. Have a look for yourself. The ball was placed in the wrong position. Thats factual. The wall wasnt 10 yeards back. Thats factual. How is any of that hypothetical.

And no, the system isnt perfect, and refs can get it wrong, i havent said refs dont make mistakes. If a player handballs like Maradona did to score a goal for example, its a black and white decision. If the ref gets that wrong he has made a gross error. Problem is with some decisions, its down to an interpetation or the opinion of a ref. Thats why this decision that went against you has plenty of people saying it was right, and plenty saying it was wrong. I dont know how old you are, but like irishtony1878 said in his post, it probably depends on the era of football you grew up watching. For me, i'm used to seeing tackles like that as ok. Its not the case so much anymore. On this occasion, one person can think its a bad decision, and another can think its fine and depending on your point of view neither are actually wrong.

I'm sure if the previous poster is right and he was sent of for denying an obvious goal scoring opportunity, the red should get overturned.

The position of the wall was completely irrelevant to what actually happened. I thought I made that clear. It would have been relevant had the shot been blocked (hypothetically). In fact, it wasn't, so although we were breaking the rules, it had literally zero effect on the game. This obviously wasn't the case when it came to the ball being moved 5 yards closer to the goal. This had every impact on the game.

Yep, just seen that myself, it was given for denying the goal scoring opportunity. Now that is wrong.

 

[billyblue80]

More snide is the last thing we need, if anything we need less snide, unless you want more red cards coming out way

We need more winners no matter what way you look at it.

 

[ChesterBlue]

Studs up and showing going through jotas ankle to get the ball is a red card . Think a few on here need to go back to spec savers . It was a rash lunge by jags who tried to correct his own mistake but failed miserably. Danny bath got sent off for us last season with the exact type of foul , and I for one had no complaints or issue with the decision .

As far as the delusional minority evertonians still saying this is the 2nd string we played , what actually makes you think Mina and Zouma are going to improve Everton’s back line so drastically and work better as a cohesive unit . This the same Mina that let in 4 goals past him last season against the mighty levante while playing for barca ? Or is it the fact that if he was good enough to sit on Barca’s bench for most games last season then that makes him something special . Won’t even get started on Zouma ! Guess it’s honures even for now and Look forward to seeing you all at Goodison where apparently according to some we get smashed by the mighty Scouse Barcelona Z team, until then I’m out and good luck

Why come on another teams forum to chat wham? You were clearly playing against an Everton missing 3-4 first team players, and with ten men.

 

[Mugwump]

The position of the wall was completely irrelevant to what actually happened. I thought I made that clear. It would have been relevant had the shot been blocked (hypothetically). In fact, it wasn't, so although we were breaking the rules, it had literally zero effect on the game. This obviously wasn't the case when it came to the ball being moved 5 yards closer to the goal. This had every impact on the game.

Yep, just seen that myself, it was given for denying the goal scoring opportunity. Now that is wrong.

Think we will have to wait until he puts in his match report. I've had a look myself and cant find anything official yet about what the red is for. If you have a link to it can you share it?

Cant agree with you mate about the distance the wall was away. Yep, it didnt have any negative effect on us, but it still doesnt change the fact the ball and the wall weren't set right by the ref. I'm not sure i'd actually call that breaking the rules when its the match official thats supposed to deal with those things. Even though the ball wasnt in the right spot, Pawson not setting the wall properly made Neves job harder given he had less distance to get the ball up and over the wall. Makes me wonder if in the referees review they pull them up for basic things like that.