Was Dunc right for hooking Kean?

collymcd · December 16, 2019

joey_macmo said:

From looking at that you've got to wonder if Kean understands what Ferguson is saying. His accent his pretty strong.

Sharpies volley · December 16, 2019

Kean doesn't look fit to me. Have you seen the size of his backside. My god.

BlueToff · December 16, 2019

Little Ralphy said:
So even by those stats there is nothing positive from kean. He mis-controlled it 3 times it says. What did he offer exactly? As a sub when the team is under the cosh and he's got fresh legs, he'd have been expected to hold the ball up and close down the Utd players. I remember watching it thinking wtf is he doing, he's not offered anything to the team. As a player I'd have had a go at him cos everyone else was working hard and despite what you say he wasn't. He could do sprints up and down the line taking no interest in the game and you'd be telling us how he performed more sprints than anyone else. He offered nothing in the time he was on.

I suspect there has been some sort of issue with Kean because SIlva didn't really play him either, so perhaps Ferguson felt taking him off was the best way to try and deal with the situation. Pretty much every other player has given everything for Ferguson in his two games.

Plenty of subs come on and don't quite work out how you planned.

You don't turf them off in that manner. You tweak it.

The argument from some seems to be he wasn't following instructions. Well as I've said, it didn't actually appear like he had any clear instructions, since he was played in three different positions.

Undisputed_blue · December 16, 2019

BlueToff said:
Plenty of subs come on and don't quite work out how you planned.

You don't turf them off in that manner. You tweak it.

The argument from some seems to be he wasn't following instructions. Well as I've said, it didn't actually appear like he had any clear instructions, since he was played in three different positions.

Very difficult to tweak things with a lack of options on the bench and on the field.

It just seems a mixture of communications and caught out of positions that led to Moise's demise.

Hopefully, Moise will learn from this and move on.

upthetoffees · December 16, 2019

I would imagine he knew exactly why he was subbed off despite whether it was his fault or not. I would also imagine that he has probably gotten over it by now and is going to continue to work hard to get into the starting teams.

Bob Latchford · December 16, 2019

LinekersLegs said:
But as eloquently pointed out by @Bob Latchford Morgan was a changed man last week.

”Special mention for Morgan Schneiderlin who played like Dunc had his family held hostage at a remote country farmhouse.”

I think I’ve definitely peaked with that one....
Many thanks @LinekersLegs it means a lot.

Stan Lee Park · December 16, 2019

BlueToff said:
Plenty of subs come on and don't quite work out how you planned.

You don't turf them off in that manner. You tweak it.

The argument from some seems to be he wasn't following instructions. Well as I've said, it didn't actually appear like he had any clear instructions, since he was played in three different positions.

If you're a manager then you need to change things in a way that you think will improve performance. There is no place for trying to protect fragile egos when you're under pressure at Old Trafford

rochdaleblue · December 16, 2019

With reflection, I was supportive of Ferguson’s decision yesterday, as at the end of the day he was only doing what he thought was best for his team. However with him subbing him in the 89th minute and in all probably our new manager in place before the weekend, was this really the best course of action for a player who is already struggling to adapt to this league. In all probability it wasn’t.

Glasshalffull · December 16, 2019

rochdaleblue said:
With reflection, I was supportive of Ferguson’s decision yesterday, as at the end of the day he was only doing what he thought was best for his team. However with him subbing him in the 89th minute and in all probably our new manager in place before the weekend, was this really the best course of action for a player who is already struggling to adapt to this league. In all probability it wasn’t.

BUT, leaving him on might have cost us the point, at least in Dunc's opinion, so obviously sensible to take him off, regardless of anything else.

Nealroy · December 16, 2019

I think this was Dunc laying down a marker for what type of manager he wants to be, in fact you could say the same of several things he's done over the two games. Seems like he's planning on being a 'with me or against me', no nonsense type. It's worked for plenty before, some of the very best in fact. Definitely wants to people to know, he knows what he wants from his team - may have got him on the radar sufficiently to get a chance somewhere in the championship later in the season.

Sad for kean but he either felt he deserved it (to some extent) for behaviour in training or that Kean is so isolated from the group he could upset him without causing a wider issue.

LiptonLight · December 16, 2019

I’m a huge fan of both big Dunc and Moise Kean (mainly based on FM lol) so this was a tough one for me.

I ended up voting for NO.

I do feel the manager should always be backed and there could be even more going on behind the scenes. If Kean didn’t listen at all to the managers instructions or hasn’t been applying himself in training then he probably deserves to be criticised..

However if Kean leaves in a year or 2 after an ultimately failed spell this could be looked back on as a major catalyst.

Would that reflect badly on him? Probably, but could it have been avoided by doing things differently? I mean maybe?
A strong word behind the scenes and dropping from the team seem a much better motivator to me.

I’m never a fan of publicly humiliating anyone which is clearly how Moise felt based on his reactions.

You can call him an entitled teenager or poor team player but honestly, if my boss decided to rub my nose in a poor performance by chastising me in front of not only my colleagues but a large crowd of people I can guarantee you I would probably be looking for a new job the next morning.
(I mean I’m not on silly money but I think the point still stands).

Buckers · December 16, 2019

Carlo speaks his language. It’s all going to turn out just fine.

thirdmantackle · December 16, 2019

Was playing football in a local junior league in Ireland years ago and we'd only one sub for an away game. anyway, one of our players gets injured just into the second half so we'd to take him off and the sub starts taking the tracksuit top off to warm up.
The manager turns around to him and says to put the tracksuit top back on.

Story is still told almost 20 years later

Goat · December 16, 2019

JobForTheMoyes · December 16, 2019

Apparently one of the reasons he got sacked at Bayern is he lost his right hand man, er, Paul Clement.....:

Ancelotti could easily — and quite rightly — argue that Neuer would not have made that mistake, while the retirements of Philipp Lahm and Xabi Alonso were always going to leave a gulf that it would take time to fill. Add to that the loss of Ancelotti's trusted assistant Paul Clement last season, and the Fates have not been as kind as they could have been to the ex-Bayern boss.