Villa > Everton

[TraffordBlue]

What a load of nonsense Villa are not a big club even when they were doing well they couldn't fill their allocation, Everton , Spurs and Chelsea are far bigger clubs than Villa. In terms of support they have less fans than Sunderland and Newcastle so the divvy needs to get his head sorted. Their not even that bigger than Birmingham really in terms of away support. When have Villa taken 10 000 to France like we did against Lille or 3000 to Kharviv. Honestly I'm surprised he's allowed on TV at all the dope, Villa are not a big club like clubs like United, Liverpool, Arsenal, Us, Chelsea, Spurs, Leeds, Newcastle, Sunderland, and West Ham. S**t on the Villa.

Villa are a very big club like us. It's ignorant to suggest they aren't when they have played so long in the top flight, have won 7 league titles and a European Cup and have also had some lesser prestigious cup wins to also boost their trophy count. I do agree that they're not quite as big as us, but they are still in the same tier of clubs as us in terms of size, although that may change if they stay down for a few years and we progress.

Regarding their away support, this season it has been as good as anyone's in the whole country given the circumstances. They do have it easier geographically but they were selling out allocations up and down the country when they hadn't won away for a year. It's easy for the Geordies to go round selling out allocations now they're winning games every week, but Villa were doing it when their team was an absolute disgrace.

I do think our away support is a lot better than theirs overall though and as I mentioned previously, they went through a spell a few years ago when they started to go stale in the Premier League where they were down to pitiful away followings of about 1,000 at Man City etc. It's why I was surprised they have stayed more loyal this last couple of seasons as I do remember them struggling to sell 3,000 at times when they were good, and they also brought 4,000 instead of 6,000 for an FA Cup game in 2009 when we would have sold 6,000 at VP with absolute ease.

I don't know how you can write off Villa and include Leeds, Newcastle, Sunderland and West Ham though?

 

[Gufty]

Everton vs Villa is the most played fixture in top flight football. I think it's fair enough that they are classed in the same 'big club' bracket as us, although we edge it!

 

[Caolam]

They are big, easily as big as we are.

Loads of trophies, good big ground, huge support.

Other clubs are allowed to be big too ffs.

I agree, they are a big noise in the Championship, and will be an even bigger noise in the 3rd teir of English football.

 

[Moomin]

They have won more major trophies than us and a European Cup.

 

[jtl60]

If I was ever famous and got invited to go on Room 101 the "Whose the biggest club" debate would be one of my choices.

 

[anton66]

I do not trust Welsh dwarfs, to tell the truth.

 

[Gwladysstreetlad]

Personally i've never been arsed about the "biggest club" argument. It's nonsense and the main argument of the glory hunters to justify their support of a club. I just care about the blues and I don't need to justify my support by rambling on about what a big club we are. To me nobody is more important then Everton, not Real Madrid or Barcelona or anyone else and that will never change regardless of our trophy count or any other way you want to measure success.

 

[TraffordBlue]

Personally i've never been arsed about the "biggest club" argument. It's nonsense and the main argument of the glory hunters to justify their support of a club. I just care about the blues and I don't need to justify my support by rambling on about what a big club we are. To me nobody is more important then Everton, not Real Madrid or Barcelona or anyone else and that will never change regardless of our trophy count or any other way you want to measure success.

Agree with you there obviously but I always find it an interesting debate. Having said that, some people let it bother them a bit too much and some of the comments on here about how superior we are to Villa are open to ridicule seeing as though our club has under performed for the past 25-30 years.

As great as we've been in the past, our fans would do well to remember that we're less successful than Leicester City in the Premier League era who have won 3 major trophies to our 1, with 1 being the biggest of them all, and we are on a par with Wigan Athletic who won their FA Cup far more recently than us.

 

[Gwladysstreetlad]

As great as we've been in the past, our fans would do well to remember that we're less successful than Leicester City in the Premier League era who have won 3 major trophies to our 1, with 1 being the biggest of them all, and we are on a par with Wigan Athletic who won their FA Cup far more recently than us.

There is no such thing as the "Premier League era" this is just a myth put out by sky. All that happened in 1992 was The first division changed its name, the league structure was slightly altered and more cash was injected, it's exactly the same game with a different title. It's not a new era in any way whatsoever, its just BS trotted out by the media. Are Leicester more successful then Arsenal because they won a league title more recently then them? It doesn't work like that, Southampton have won one single major trophy in their entire history it doesn't matter if they won it one year ago or a hundred it still counts as just one. Why do we have to remember how recent our trophies were won, they don't count any less based on their age do they? An FA Cup won back in the 80's counts just as much as the one that sombody will win this season.

 

[Pejic300]

I like Villa and I miss their presence in the PL, particularly the 6 points we took off them every season.

 

[TraffordBlue]

There is no such thing as the "Premier League era" this is just a myth put out by sky. All that happened in 1992 was The first division changed its name, the league structure was slightly altered and more cash was injected, it's exactly the same game with a different title. It's not a new era in any way whatsoever, its just BS trotted out by the media. Are Leicester more successful then Arsenal because they won a league title more recently then them? It doesn't work like that, Southampton have won one single major trophy in their entire history it doesn't matter if they won it one year ago or a hundred it still counts as just one. Why do we have to remember how recent our trophies were won, they don't count any less based on their age do they? An FA Cup won back in the 80's counts just as much as the one that sombody will win this season.

Fair point and I am usually equally as dismissive of that term, but with it having been in existence for 25 years, it was just another way of me describing that period. I think it is relevant to discuss what teams have achieved in more recent history as well as the overall picture so the last 10, 20, 25, 30 years too.

And in that time, ourselves along with loads of other perceived 'big clubs' have had a pathetic trophy haul. As has been mentioned, Villa's trophy count in the last 50 years has been bailed out entirely due to a period of success between 1980-1982. They have no titles in the past 50 years and no FA Cup Wins which is laughable for a club their size. Spurs have no titles in the past 50 years either so I don't see how we can possibly be dismissed by others at the expense of them, especially with them having won only 2 in their whole history. Spurs are a big club no doubt but are not as worthy in any discussion as several clubs as they have been the countries best team less than Huddersfield Town and Preston.

But recent achievements are also worthwhile mentioning in my opinion and we have had next to none. We came 4th in 04-05 which wasn't success, but was an excellent achievement due to the financial constraints, and the 95 Cup Win. Amusingly, the RS are starting to slip in to the category that a lot of clubs have been in for ages in that they've had little recent success. 1 League Cup win on penalties in the last 10 years. Of course the goalposts are moved where the RS are concerned though to massage the ego's of the deluded hordes down South, in Ireland, and Norway.

 

[barneygumble]

Yeah, a good point too. This season we will have sold out 18 of 19 aways, with Sunderland midweek being the only one with about 50-100 empty seats so still a good 2,800-2900 I would guess.

Only the "big 6" will have sold out all 19 aways and we know from past experience that if Chelsea, Man City or even Spurs were in our position they wouldn't do the same. Spurs would have had the best away support of the 3 I mentioned after 2 11th placed finishes in my opinion but I don't reckon they'd have sold out 18 out of 19 aways after the 2 seasons we've just endured.

I think you have to be fair to us, as supporters.

In 2010/11 for example... Liverpool, United, City, Blackpool, Blackburn, Bolton, Wigan were all close to get to, and in moderate proximity, Stoke, Wolves, Birmingham Villa and Wolves, were all easy sells for us.
To show how far our support has improved, in 2016/17, Burnley, Liverpool, United and City are the only North West teams remaining.. with Only West Brom and Stoke remaining out of the easy Midlands games.
Meanwhile, there are 6 London clubs (incl. Watford), and two teams even further south (possibly 3 if Brighton come up!), so its a true testament to our fan base that we travel so well.

With a very real possibility of three Northern teams going down in Hull, Boro and Sunderland, we may aswell just move down south lol

 

[crockyblue79]

They were in the 3rd division in the 70s,a division we have never been. They are made to look bigger than they actually are because there are no other huge clubs in the Midlands whereas we are not considered massive because we have Liverpool and United on our doorstep, virtually.

 

[EMTB]

Hiya. Kinda found this an interesting read to be honest, and yeah there are some good points. I am a Villa fan and I'd totally always put us two clubs on basically a similar level, and because of this its always made me look favourable. Man Utd and Liverpool top, Arsenal next, then Villa and Everton (in this list there are only two clubs I would like). I'd kinda put Villa first but I think the reasoning I would do that might be offset by my natural bias.

On history, I totally think you were screwed over in the 1980's which is a shame, but it happened. I think if that hadn't happened you would definitely be bigger. I'm referring to English clubs getting booted out of Europe, and I have a hazy but possibly mistaken memory that you were gunna get a load of money, but then that upped sticks and went to Liverpool?

But no one mentioned here that Villa founded the football league. I always consider that massive, but I think this is perhaps my bias.

I never really have heard a convincing argument (or at least one that convinces me) for the irrelevance of achievements the further back you go in history. They are all time periods, and they are all relevant to history, equally so. I mean I could totally get a bit philosophical about time and maybe metaphysical. But I would certainly suggest that titles won a hundred years ago are of more relevance that titles possibly to be won in the future, and they all contribute to the history of the clubs we love or the game we love. One of the things that I think is great about both Villa and Everton is that their history's stretch so far back.

I guess the main reason I love football is because I love stories and football is the story that never ends. I think if you looked down the stories of Everton and Villa they would both be really great reads, and properly epic on a scale that not many clubs, even other big clubs mention. And I kind of respect Everton because of that.

Ultimately I totally love everything about my club, but if there was a club whose everything about it was similar, perhaps other than the last few years, I would say its you guys.

Also one other thing I consider is that to be a great club you need to act in the best interests of football rather than yourself. I think Everton do this. I think Villa do this. Historically.

And this forum name totally suits Everton. But I also think in a parallel universe, there could be a Aston Villa forum called Grand Old Team, and it would work too.

I reckon its pretty similar, but we will take it alphabetically. But what do I know, Dean Saunders was my favourite player when I was a kid.

 

[Ernie]

They've won the European Cup

much bigger clubs unfortunately