Time to face facts?

[bluebastardo]

Nobody has a crystal ball, you can only judge him on his past. Of course he has what it takes to take us forward, but who ever else we got in would have the same problems that Moyes has. A lack of cash.

Look at the squad now compared to when he came in, hes clearly made progress, but his hands are tied by the imcomptence of the current board and mangement. He has made progress squad wise nearly every year, his league postions have shown that he can make us great, he has struggled to make that final push to 4th, but thats not easy, he is competing with teams who have had far more money than us.

Hes only human, but the way he has taken us from the pile of shiiit we where, to the team we are now is nothing short of wonderful. As is reflected by the awards from his peers.

We can only judge him on what hes done and I personally have found the Moyes bashing this week a complete disgrace. Theres reasons that we have started badly, there are reasons we didnt get the players in we needed, the 1 place we shouldnt be looking is the best pound for pound manager in the League.

Theres only 1 question to ask really, If not Moyes, then who? Who else would put up with the crap from the board? Who else would be able to push sometimes average players and make them shine? Who else?

For me, Moyes and the players is the only reason I still give those utter clowns in charge my money, when Moyes leaves, his players will leave, then I can see no reason at all that I will spend another penny untill the current board have jogged on.

Good post, and I can't argue with much of it, but what Moyes has done in the past, and what he is currently doing now are 2 different things, all except the quality of football, which has always been the same standard, and that standard is poor.

The last 2 years, our preparation for the season, and our start to the campaign have been nothing short of abysmal.
A managers job isn't just about what happens on the pitch, but what happens off it too.
Yes, he has bought some good players, but he's bought some lemons in the past also.

If he had £50 mill to spend each year, could he win the league?
Would he be able to make us play great football?
Would he buy the right players?

I'm not so sure to be fair.

I love Moyes, but there are many things about him also that make me bang my head against the wall each year.

 

[Goat]

Out of the non SKy 4 teams you mentioned, i.e Boro, Portsmouth and Blackburn, which of them would you swop postions with?

 

[bluebastardo]

Yeah I was meaning Ossie became a first team regular, Moyes has moulded his playing career, if not his youth development. Cahill as a ball playing midfielder was the bigger stretch I thought. He was in the move though.

Cahill - Has been good in the past, but Moyes has messed the team up so much he doesn't have a regular role anymore.

Pienaar - One good season, and that was the 2nd half of last season. Not quite there yet.

Baines - One good season, but has been garbage so far this season.

Ossie - Has been a let down on the wing for many seasons, yet has been picked by Moyes like Ossies dad had held a gun to his head.

I'm bad lol

 

[Goat]

Is this the same Cahill that had the whole of the League nearly wanking over the end of last Season?
Is this the same Pienaar that shined in the Confed Cup, despite players such as Kaka, Torres and Villa being there?
Is this the same Baines that has been the closet thing to Roberto Carlos the world has ever seen?
You can have Ossie.

But I will add, Lescott, Jagielka, Arteta, Neville.

 

[micknick]

Lets get rid of the lot and get that Darren Ferguson in- hes related to SIr Alex so must be good! We will win the league within 2 years. FACT.

**wheres the hydrochloric acid**

 

[bluebastardo]

Is this the same Cahill that had the whole of the League nearly wanking over the end of last Season?
Is this the same Pienaar that shined in the Confed Cup, despite players such as Kaka, Torres and Villa being there?
Is this the same Baines that has been the closet thing to Roberto Carlos the world has ever seen?
You can have Ossie.

But I will add, Lescott, Jagielka, Arteta, Neville.

Pienaar has found confidence and is starting to shine.
The fact that he was probably in my opinion the best football player in the Confederation Cup speaks volumes, but he wasn't playing on the left wing.
Why is it then that Moyes insists on playing him out of position?

Why has Osman been played out of position for so long too?

Fellaini has been played out of position throughout.
Neville was a right back, and has also been played out of position.
Cahill is a funny one , in that we no longer know what his best position is.

Arteta was played out of position on the right wing, untill Moyes finally saw what the fans had seen long before.

Jags looks good, but lets not get carried away. He has only really just got his feet under the table, and for three quaters of a season played great.

Our biggest problem is that Moyes doesn't know his knee from his elbow regarding how best to play the squad, and this is highly apparant for all to see, especially at the moment.

Will Nevilles injury force Moyes to focus harder on our positions?
Will he bring another young lad through?
Will he say bollox to that, and hire Lucas Niel?

It's early lol.

 

[Goat]

Osman has played on the right cos we had nobody else, Neville is played in Midfield cos we have nobody else, what IS Fellainis postion? Cahill has had to play in CM cos we have nobody else, everybody knows his best postion is the AM, but its not as if Moyes is playing him CM thru choice.

In order to pick holes in Moyes selection, he must have had other options, most of the things he does are not thru choice, its about balancing an unbalanced squad. Some of that blame could be left at Moyes feet, but its not as if he hasnt tried to address the problems we have.

He tried to buy a RB in Naughton, he tried to get in a natural CM in Benega.

Its all very well everybody playing FM and thinking they could do it better, football is all about opinions and for me, Moyes has made mistakes, a few small 1s here and there maybe, everybody makes mistakes, errors of judgement. But he gets it right a hell of lot more times than he gets it wrong.

 

[daz4matty]

Moysie has done an incredible job for us and how anybody can question him beats me.
We are so lucky to have him and the way he puts up with kenshite amazes me.
If anybody is having negative thoughts about davey just think back to the glory days of tiler,madar,williamson,ginola,gazza and so on,believe me if we had not had davey we would now be a championship club.

 

[bluebastardo]

Osman has played on the right cos we had nobody else, Neville is played in Midfield cos we have nobody else, what IS Fellainis postion? Cahill has had to play in CM cos we have nobody else, everybody knows his best postion is the AM, but its not as if Moyes is playing him CM thru choice.

In order to pick holes in Moyes selection, he must have had other options, most of the things he does are not thru choice, its about balancing an unbalanced squad. Some of that blame could be left at Moyes feet, but its not as if he hasnt tried to address the problems we have.

He tried to buy a RB in Naughton, he tried to get in a natural CM in Benega.

Its all very well everybody playing FM and thinking they could do it better, football is all about opinions and for me, Moyes has made mistakes, a few small 1s here and there maybe, everybody makes mistakes, errors of judgement. But he gets it right a hell of lot more times than he gets it wrong.

We had a natural right winger in VDM, but Moyes was stubborn and refused to play him, yet instead of selling him, allowed his contract to expire. He also played Arteta on the wing. Pienaar is a natural right winger, but was played on the left.

Naughton is unproven in the Premiership, and Moyes tried to get him on the cheap, but wouldn't raise his price. The same can be said for Delph.
Instead of buying a defensive player like Taylor, who is young, he decides to buy an old defender who will need replacing again soon. When that time comes, Taylors price will be through the roof.

The Banega saga was rediculous and only added to the despair of the fans.

We still haven't bought a right winger, and our only alternative is to play Pienaar on the right.
This is Pienaars natural position, and in Billy, we have a left winger possibly.

What does Moyes do though?
A guy who has played a fair few games already this season in Russia, and is raring to go, has been left on the bench. This frustrates me greatly.

 

[daz4matty]

We had a natural right winger in VDM, but Moyes was stubborn and refused to play him, yet instead of selling him, allowed his contract to expire. He also played Arteta on the wing. Pienaar is a natural right winger, but was played on the left.

Naughton is unproven in the Premiership, and Moyes tried to get him on the cheap, but wouldn't raise his price. The same can be said for Delph.
Instead of buying a defensive player like Taylor, who is young, he decides to buy an old defender who will need replacing again soon. When that time comes, Taylors price will be through the roof.

The Banega saga was rediculous and only added to the despair of the fans.

We still haven't bought a right winger, and our only alternative is to play Pienaar on the right.
This is Pienaars natural position, and in Billy, we have a left winger possibly.

What does Moyes do though?
A guy who has played a fair few games already this season in Russia, and is raring to go, has been left on the bench. This frustrates me greatly.

He was obviously not ready plus why change a winning team ,the lads played well against wigan

 

[Goat]

Did you just mention VDM? Christ on a bike.

Heitinga said in an interview that he had only trained twice with the players before the Fulham game, it must have been the same with Billy. Maybe Moyes didnt feel like as the chap above says, changing a winning side, it worked against Wigan, why not Fulham? Sound reasoning there I feel.

Anyway, Billy has had time to bed in and now Moyes is giving him a chance, whats the problem?

 

[bluebastardo]

He was obviously not ready plus why change a winning team ,the lads played well against wigan

How is it changing a winning tean m8?

We had a late penalty against wigan, otherwise we would not have had a single league win in this campaign. It is anything but a winning side .

We also find ourselves looking at bringing in Lucas Neil.
We let Jacobsen go and didn't replace cover, presuming that Neville would fill in. Now he is panicking about cover for right back, yet Heitinga can play right back, as a can a few youngsters, as can Gosling.
Why isn't he looking at bringing in a free midfielder?

 

[Goat]

How do we know he isnt?

 

[bluebastardo]

How do we know he isnt?

lol.
Why couldn't he have done it during the window?

 

[Goat]

He tried? We had bids lodged for Defour, Gago, VDV and also a deal, we thought, for Benga.*