Reidy's Bottle Of Grecian
The Unobstructed View
unfortunately proportional representation .......
cant think of another long word to go there
The Tories
- Thread starter davek
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unfortunately proportional representation .......
cant think of another long word to go there
I'd probably be financially better off if Cameron got in.
I'd rather chop my co ck off than vote for him though. My little girl's just starting her journey through State Education, we may (touch wood, not) need to use the NHS, the eldest has just got her first job (and it's not on £1.75/hr thanks to the minimum wage), and if the cuts are as swingeing as the Tories are promising, the second dip could very well be around the corner, and then a lot more people will be relying on the State for funds that it will no longer be prepared to give.
Bruce, your comment about letting the banks go to the wall as a lesson was an interesting one. It has a certain visceral appeal, but it overlooks the real victims of the bank's greed. Those who espoused the shockingly short sighted profit driven practices of the last 10 years would be relatively immune for the worst of a full financial collapse, they've made and probably quite wisely divested their money. The people who really get it in the shorts are small businesses and their employees who rely on these banks for the low level credit that supports the cashflow of businesses of all sizes around the UK.
Let the banks go to the wall and just watch a succession of employers follow, you will then have a huge welfare burden and income shortfall when there's nobody left in a position to pay their taxes.
The real lesson that should have been learned, and hasn't, is that the overcomplication of the banking system and financial tradeable products needed to be curtailed. Once money itself became a mathematical and statistical abstract to be played with and manipulated for pure profit, the system was onto a hiding, and it will happen again.
What needs to happen (sit down and brace yourself Bruce, I'm going to mention the R word) is a far more effective regulation and control of the banking system. If a financial institution wants to play fast and loose with investors cash, it needs to be branded as an Investment House and have no direct or indirect connection with a savings and loan bank. That way, S+L Banks can run with tighter regulation and those depositing their savings or using the credit facilities on offer can be safe in the knowledge that the bank will still be there tomorrow. Those who fancy taking a little more of a risk, they can go to an Investment House, where the staff can be as creative as they like and the customers know the risk and can afford the implications.
You're right about politicians though, there's a certain type of individual who chooses that career path, and those who succeed tend to do so due to intense personal ambition (which isn't necessarily a good quality for someone running the country). What is really needed is a benevolent dictatorship, it allows for proper long term planning.
[coughs] I'll do it...
I'd rather chop my co ck off than vote for him though. My little girl's just starting her journey through State Education, we may (touch wood, not) need to use the NHS, the eldest has just got her first job (and it's not on £1.75/hr thanks to the minimum wage), and if the cuts are as swingeing as the Tories are promising, the second dip could very well be around the corner, and then a lot more people will be relying on the State for funds that it will no longer be prepared to give.
Bruce, your comment about letting the banks go to the wall as a lesson was an interesting one. It has a certain visceral appeal, but it overlooks the real victims of the bank's greed. Those who espoused the shockingly short sighted profit driven practices of the last 10 years would be relatively immune for the worst of a full financial collapse, they've made and probably quite wisely divested their money. The people who really get it in the shorts are small businesses and their employees who rely on these banks for the low level credit that supports the cashflow of businesses of all sizes around the UK.
Let the banks go to the wall and just watch a succession of employers follow, you will then have a huge welfare burden and income shortfall when there's nobody left in a position to pay their taxes.
The real lesson that should have been learned, and hasn't, is that the overcomplication of the banking system and financial tradeable products needed to be curtailed. Once money itself became a mathematical and statistical abstract to be played with and manipulated for pure profit, the system was onto a hiding, and it will happen again.
What needs to happen (sit down and brace yourself Bruce, I'm going to mention the R word) is a far more effective regulation and control of the banking system. If a financial institution wants to play fast and loose with investors cash, it needs to be branded as an Investment House and have no direct or indirect connection with a savings and loan bank. That way, S+L Banks can run with tighter regulation and those depositing their savings or using the credit facilities on offer can be safe in the knowledge that the bank will still be there tomorrow. Those who fancy taking a little more of a risk, they can go to an Investment House, where the staff can be as creative as they like and the customers know the risk and can afford the implications.
You're right about politicians though, there's a certain type of individual who chooses that career path, and those who succeed tend to do so due to intense personal ambition (which isn't necessarily a good quality for someone running the country). What is really needed is a benevolent dictatorship, it allows for proper long term planning.
[coughs] I'll do it...
B
BlackToffee
Guest
normally I don't go round shouting about my politics, but I have make a point. Apart from a few protest votes I've always voted Labour. Never voted tory.
With a government which seeks to criminalise everyone, who wants to watch everyone no matter what they do, and who seem to be afraid of its own citizens, I want Labour out. What makes it worst is that labour has lost its core.
What the hell does it stand for? Certainly not the "working class", they've [Poor language removed] on them from a great height from day one.
I've never done this before, I have a reasonable good local labour man, but I can't bring myself to vote for Labour and I've decided to vote tory to get them out. I don't want a protest vote, I want them gone.
Am I wrong?
With a government which seeks to criminalise everyone, who wants to watch everyone no matter what they do, and who seem to be afraid of its own citizens, I want Labour out. What makes it worst is that labour has lost its core.
What the hell does it stand for? Certainly not the "working class", they've [Poor language removed] on them from a great height from day one.
I've never done this before, I have a reasonable good local labour man, but I can't bring myself to vote for Labour and I've decided to vote tory to get them out. I don't want a protest vote, I want them gone.
Am I wrong?
linglong
Player Valuation: £25m
Good post matey the banking system simply couldnt have been allowed to fail simple as that chaos would have ensued if it had now personally there could no should have been in place rules that if the risk taking got out of hand (as it clearly did) then criminal charges could have been brought about that would have at least made people think twice.
I fear after listening to the tory speach on the econemy thier sums just dont add up i i'm willing to place a pound coin right now they'll abolish the minimum wage within 2 years of gaining power,throwing us back to those dark ages of getting paid peanuts again.
At the moment neither party are an attractive propisition to vote for but given the tories are on record as saying "they'd have let the recession run its course without intervining" i think i think its safe to say if they get in we're in for a very hard time,of course cuts have to come from both sides but honestly i think Labour would do it more compassionatly than the tories.
StDomingosGringo
Player Valuation: £10m
Great discussion here, read all 10 pages. I'll only say one thing. You won't find many teachers voting Tory, I certainly wouldn't trust them with state education funding.
That's hardly surprising is it? Labour traditionally spend more on public services, ie paying teachers more.
The question where education is concerned isn't what teachers want, it's what parents want. They're the customers in all this.
As for the banks, any regulation should be aimed at avoiding this nonsense of a situation whereby any company is regarded as 'too big to fail'. No company should be protected from failure. If they mess up then they should fail. This culture of creative destruction is what markets are founded upon. The regulators will never be able to keep up with what the financial companies are doing, both because they generally don't have the same talent as the banks (due to pay) and because their paymasters (HM govt) are so reliant upon the taxation from the industry. In 2007 the industry contributed 13.9% of the countries entire tax intake, or £67.8bn in real money. Add in the same sort of numbers that were received from the property market and you can see why the government had a vested interest in maintaining the bubble in both markets. Hardly likely that they would be suitable regulators was it?
But Bruce, I thought you were all for a meritocracy, survival of the fittest and all that, surely by encouraging a system whereby the children of richer parents get the better education, they will be insulated from this competition, and so some of the intellectually weak survive and indeed thrive (and perhaps, become Mayor of London, for example)?
So in addition to watching large slices of the economy (not just the errant banks) go to the wall, landing millions on the welfare system, the government would be expected to wave goodbye to this 15% of it's income as well?
Surely, it's plain to see that one of 2 things would happen:
1) The National Debt goes even further through the roof as the government has to find funds to service this now far greater overhead with fewer resources.
2) The government does nothing and we return to the 'good old days' of the early 80's as people realise they've been abandoned... "every society is only a few meals away from anarchy"
The market isn't truly analogous to the natural world, there aren't that many organisms high up in the food chain who's disappearance would bring down an entire ecosystem.
Naturally, but I don't think a state run education system provides that. If you look at social mobility it is no better now than it was 30 years ago. If 'free' education isn't helping the poor to succeed then what's the point of it?
Firstly we have to believe that the entire financial industry wouldn't go tits up. That simply wouldn't have happened, so the belief that all tax intake would vanish is extreme.
I have to go to a meeting now so will come back to this later
davek
Player Valuation: £150m
Apropos of not much...WTF happened at that Tory Conference yesterday? They have a healthy lead in the polls, things are chugging along nicely, all they need to do is keep the pot boiling with broad brush strokes, but they send out a millionaire toff to tell the nation to work more for the same or less pay. We're all in it together. FFS. 
davek
Player Valuation: £150m
Apropos of not much...WTF happened at that Tory Conference yesterday? They have a healthy lead in the polls, things are chugging along nicely, all they need to do is keep the pot boiling with broad brush strokes, but they send out a millionaire toff to tell the nation to work more for the same or less pay. We're all in it together. FFS.
And the award for mixed metaphors goes to....
:blink:
kenada_blue
Welcome to Barcelonaton FC
Dunno much about politics. But I heard today the Tories are going to hike up the ale prices if they got in....
Not on my shift.
Not on my shift.
to stop the gap from widening. As the report clearly states, brighter children from poor families are likely to get overtaken by even the children in the bottom 15% on the intelligence scale from affluent families, and this happens between the ages of 3 and 7 (or the primary school years). If you were to then strip further funding from state schools is this discrepancy likely to get less or greater?
The less able but affluent children are being insulated from competition.
Firstly we have to believe that the entire financial industry wouldn't go tits up. That simply wouldn't have happened, so the belief that all tax intake would vanish is extreme.
I have to go to a meeting now so will come back to this later
No, you're quite right, a small portion of the banking system would survive, but really that's only the tip the iceberg isn't it? Because what would be lost, in addition to a large proportion of revenue from the banks, is a sizeable chunk of revenue from SME's who rely on the aforementioned banks for operating cashflow. A lot of otherwise healthy businesses would fail, and with them, go their taxes, their employees taxes, and those of their supply chain. That is why a failure of the banking system can lead to a depression rather than the recession that we are currently experiencing.
NeoNaoNeo
Banned - Abuse Towards Forum Staff
I love Politics!
You were saying?
Good LORD
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