Current Affairs The Labour Party

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First past the post is antiquated...

You need to look at how the voting is for ALL sections of the party. Only the NEC will be chosen that way, the other sections FPTP.

It's a cynical change to rules, so important that they can only be taken by the whole of the party at conference. This is a grab for control by the right wing of the party led by Starmer - aided by the party officials who helped the Tories to scrape home in 2017 at the expense of Corbyn's leadership of the LP - to marginalise the left.

Running as 'the unity candidate' was a sick joke.

He'll get a war if he wants it.
 
You need to look at how the voting is for ALL sections of the party. Only the NEC will be chosen that way, the other sections FPTP.

It's a cynical change to rules, so important that they can only be taken by the whole of the party at conference. This is a grab for control by the right wing of the party led by Starmer - aided by the party officials who helped the Tories to scrape home in 2017 at the expense of Corbyn's leadership of the LP - to marginalise the left.

Running as 'the unity candidate' was a sick joke.

He'll get a war if he wants it.
Not for the Leadership, I believe.
 
No neither am I. I'll just simply state that you're an apologist for a man who made several, shall we say, 'illiberal' judgements to protect the state's "security" forces while DPP.

This feller is a careereist and part and parcel of the Establishment. How on earth a scumbag like him has gained power after Corbyn I dont know.
erm...will of the people?
Democracy?
Majority rule/1st past the post?
Best of a bad bunch?
The people who voted for him are either ignorant, ill-informed, misled by the media or all 3
 
it really isn't; the problem with our politics is parties not the way we vote

The way we vote is down to the individual voting, by reflecting the message they have understood.

STV allows an order preference. A more rounded consensus can be gained.

Plenty I agreed with Corbyn on, however. press freedoms and his complete pacifism, I did not.
 
You need to look at how the voting is for ALL sections of the party. Only the NEC will be chosen that way, the other sections FPTP.

It's a cynical change to rules, so important that they can only be taken by the whole of the party at conference. This is a grab for control by the right wing of the party led by Starmer - aided by the party officials who helped the Tories to scrape home in 2017 at the expense of Corbyn's leadership of the LP - to marginalise the left.

Running as 'the unity candidate' was a sick joke.

He'll get a war if he wants it.
Yep he probably will
Labour love a good internal blood letting.

Nobody ever really wins

Except the tories
 
The way we vote is down to the individual voting, by reflecting the message they have understood.

STV allows an order preference. A more rounded consensus can be gained.


Plenty I agreed with Corbyn on, however. press freedoms and his complete pacifism, I did not.

That is certainly how its advertised, but that really is not how representative democracy should (or even can) work.

As a citizen, where its not possible to take part in the legislative process yourself you have to have a representative do that on your behalf. That representative has to have your (and the rest of their) constituents as their only concern, and honestly present their views at election time so that everyone can make an informed decision. If that happens, you get real consensus, real scrutiny and effective government. The cost of politics would also come down massively.

What we have now is party concerns being clearly more important to most MPs than the welfare of their constituents (or even representing them honestly). As we repeatedly see, MPs vote along party lines far too often for this to be healthy and there is abundant evidence this has been wrecking our country and killing our population for the past hundred years.

STV, or any PR that I've seen proposed in my lifetime, would (as we see in Europe) entrench parties even more in the system, causing even more damage.
 
Yep he probably will
Labour love a good internal blood letting.

Nobody ever really wins

Except the tories
Starmer is the Tories too. Just as Blair was the Tories.

We haven't had a Labour PM since Callaghan. He presided over Old Labour: a party with enormous faults, but one which still sought to curtail the impact of market relations on people's lives and espoused the redistribution of wealth. What's followed has been governments which are informed by varying degrees of Thatcherism.
 
Starmer is the Tories too. Just as Blair was the Tories.

We haven't had a Labour PM since Callaghan. He presided over Old Labour: a party with enormous faults, but one which still sought to curtail the impact of market relations on people's lives and espoused the redistribution of wealth. What's followed has been governments which are informed by varying degrees of Thatcherism.
Ah 'Old Labour' Callaghan, crisis? what crisis.
tbh, I was more Old old Labour. The Labour of Wilson.
He was my MP until he retired - good arl 'aitch...it all started going down hill then when Starmer sorry, Kilroy-Silk took over
 
Ah 'Old Labour' Callaghan, crisis? what crisis.
tbh, I was more Old old Labour. The Labour of Wilson.
He was my MP until he retired - good arl 'aitch...it all started going down hill then when Starmer sorry, Kilroy-Silk took over
It's not personality it's policies.

Compare the objective of the manifestos of the Callaghan Government with Blair's.

1979:
A generation has now grown up in a welfare state which remains the envy of the world in health care and education. We have demonstrated a capacity for skill and inventiveness which keeps us at the forefront of world technology. Those are no mean achievements. A Tory Government would put all this at risk. At work, they would substitute confrontation for cooperation. The free market forces they support would mean soaring inflation, rising prices and growing unemployment. Their uncaring meanness would mean misery for millions of the most vulnerable in our community, for their policy of cutting public expenditure can only mean a drastic reduction in all our social services.

Against this reactionary prospect, Labour sets its vision for the future. We seek to bring about a fundamental change in the balance of power and wealth in favour of working people and their families. We reject the concept that there is a choice to be made between a prosperous and efficient Britain and a caring and compassionate society. As democratic socialists, we believe they complement each other.

1997:
I want to renew faith in politics by being honest about the last 18 years. Some things the Conservatives got right. We will not change them. It is where they got things wrong that we will make change. We have no intention or desire to replace one set of dogmas by another. I want to renew faith in politics through a government that will govern in the interest of the many, the broad majority of people who work hard, play by the rules, pay their dues and feel let down by a political system that gives the breaks to the few, to an elite at the top increasingly out of touch with the rest of us.

The purpose of new Labour is to give Britain a different political choice: the choice between a failed Conservative government, exhausted and divided in everything other than its desire to cling on to power, and a new and revitalised Labour Party that has been resolute in transforming itself into a party of the future. We have rewritten our constitution, the new Clause IV, to put a commitment to enterprise alongside the commitment to justice. We have changed the way we make policy, and put our relations with the trade unions on a modern footing where they accept they can get fairness but no favours from a Labour government.
 
Labour can accept the role of reformers like they have done mostly for the last 100 years, but if that their strategy then lets have a bit more fight about it , there has been to much concessions to the free market fanatics in the last 40 years , stand up and speak about a better society and better world not conceded to the spiv culture every time ffs
 
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