Current Affairs The Labour Party

[neil999]

The very first privatisation of the NHS was by a Labour government in the Blair years - auxiliary services , like catering cleaning etc opened the door .....and the less said about his PFI idea of building PFI new hospitals have not been paid for even now......

Err no Joey... Started in the 80s with Cleaning contracts and john major started PFIs, you are so anti Labour now you just guess at stuff

 

[Black Belt Jones]

The principles contained in the Labour manifesto were good. The deliverer was poor. The delivery was poor.

But it doesn't make those ideals go away.

One day people will realise that there is a need for those sort of policies and hopefully there will be a leader to deliver them.

Manifesto policies were good and thoughtful in the main IMHO, they just needed to divide them by ten. It was obese - and thus had no credibility (plus JC obv). No one has that sort of mandate, the breadth of policy was like something you'd see in a post-war total rebuilding programme.

 

[Joey66]

Err no Joey... Started in the 80s with Cleaning contracts and john major started PFIs, you are so anti Labour now you just guess at stuff

1999 the Blair government stated to privatise the NHS..

 

[Joey66]

Watch the documentary, educate yourself, it will show you where it all started under Thatcher in the 80's and how the 2012 Health and Social care act opened the door to mass privatisation on a scale never seen before and 5 more years of Tory government will continue the escalation of making patients being treated as customers to be shipped in and shipped out as fast as possible to make profits.

Labour PFI scheme built some hospitals on HP basically and it was a poor deal, we all still benefited from using them and still do today.

Blair introduction in 1999 of hospital privatisation, and the PFI contracts were never VFM.......

 

[dead_soft]

Don’t be silly. Modern day Germans are not Nazis......

Why did you say the current political regime come from the same lineage then?

 

[The binman chronicles]

Didn't Corbyn claim that Labour had "won the argument"? Surely that's defending the manifesto?

Winning without winning. That will help make the next 5 years more palatable.

 

[OnlyBlueWillDo]

Blair introduction in 1999 of hospital privatisation, and the PFI contracts were never VFM.......

Watch the documentary Joey. since 2012 there are 1000's of operations being farmed out to private health companies to do them on behalf of the NHS, and these firms do not have the expertise the NHS hospitals do if something goes wrong with your Op.

The bits of minor services put out to tender under Labour are nothing in comparison of what's going on under the Tories.

 

[Joey66]

Watch the documentary Joey. since 2012 there are 1000's of operations being farmed out to private health companies to do them on behalf of the NHS, and these firms do not have the expertise the NHS hospitals do if something goes wrong with your Op.

The bits of minor services put out to tender under Labour are nothing in comparison of what's going on under the Tories.

They have been farmed out as a necessity, I don't believe in private medicine, but the NHS any more money has to go to the front line not the beurocrocy it seems to carry baggage ..,

 

[Bruce Wayne]

The very first privatisation of the NHS was by a Labour government in the Blair years - auxiliary services , like catering cleaning etc opened the door .....and the less said about his PFI idea of building PFI new hospitals have not been paid for even now......

It saddens me to have to make such a basic point, especially to Labour folk who you'd think would be experts, but privatisation is:

"the transfer of a business, industry, or service from public to private ownership and control."

Do private companies own the NHS? No. Will tendering services to them result in them owning the NHS? No. So can we please stop this nonsense that the NHS is being privatised? Probably not because the lie has whipped people up into a frenzy.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

Watch the documentary Joey. since 2012 there are 1000's of operations being farmed out to private health companies to do them on behalf of the NHS, and these firms do not have the expertise the NHS hospitals do if something goes wrong with your Op.

The bits of minor services put out to tender under Labour are nothing in comparison of what's going on under the Tories.

And do those companies own the NHS? Do what are essentially contractors have an ownership stake in the NHS?

 

[NilSatisOptimum]

Do private companies own the NHS? No. Will tendering services to them result in them owning the NHS? No. So can we please stop this nonsense that the NHS is being privatised?

Legally and financially beholden to them. They sneek round commercial law hiding their activities. It's proven in every other industry that private companies will willingly circumvent the law just to further said companies financial interests. Yet in health some would have us believe they are a virtue of good, vested interest or stupid!?

NHS makes undisclosed settlement to Richard Branson's Virgin Care after legal dispute

Labour is calling on the Department of Health to disclose the cost to the NHS of the legal challenge

www.independent.co.uk

What NHS care has been outsourced? - NHS for Sale

KEY POINTS 1 The range of clinical care that has been put out to tender since the competition rules went live in 2013 now covers most of what the NHS ... <a title="What NHS care has been outsourced?" class="read-more" href="https://www.nhsforsale.info/overview/what-nhs-care-has-been-outsourced/"...

www.nhsforsale.info

 

[Bruce Wayne]

Legally and financially beholden to them. They sneek round commercial law hiding their activities. It's proven in every other industry that private companies will willingly circumvent the law just to further said companies financial interests. Yet in health some would have us believe they are a virtue of good, vested interest or stupid!?

NHS makes undisclosed settlement to Richard Branson's Virgin Care after legal dispute

Labour is calling on the Department of Health to disclose the cost to the NHS of the legal challenge

www.independent.co.uk

What NHS care has been outsourced? - NHS for Sale

KEY POINTS 1 The range of clinical care that has been put out to tender since the competition rules went live in 2013 now covers most of what the NHS ... <a title="What NHS care has been outsourced?" class="read-more" href="https://www.nhsforsale.info/overview/what-nhs-care-has-been-outsourced/"...

www.nhsforsale.info

I wouldn't say perfect whatsoever, but the government, who lest we forget are the ones who are supposed to be virtuous custodians, are the ones doing the procurement so get to choose what they do and don't want.

 

[neil999]

It saddens me to have to make such a basic point, especially to Labour folk who you'd think would be experts, but privatisation is:

"the transfer of a business, industry, or service from public to private ownership and control."

Do private companies own the NHS? No. Will tendering services to them result in them owning the NHS? No. So can we please stop this nonsense that the NHS is being privatised? Probably not because the lie has whipped people up into a frenzy.

It does not mean we ignore the issues contracting out has potentially caused, did contracting out cleaning companies cause increase in diseases/infections in hospitals?maybe, maybe not but it certainly is worth investigating

 

[Bruce Wayne]

It does not mean we ignore the issues contracting out has potentially caused, did contracting out cleaning companies cause increase in diseases/infections in hospitals?maybe, maybe not but it certainly is worth investigating

Of course, and that's quite right. There are indeed many examples of poor procurement of services resulting in both poor value for money and poor outcomes. No question about that at all, and it should be addressed. It just bugs me when we talk about poor procurement as being equivalent to privatisation. It's not at all, and it merely serves to further politicise the NHS, which rarely helps anyone.

 

[neil999]

Of course, and that's quite right. There are indeed many examples of poor procurement of services resulting in both poor value for money and poor outcomes. No question about that at all, and it should be addressed. It just bugs me when we talk about poor procurement as being equivalent to privatisation. It's not at all, and it merely serves to further politicise the NHS, which rarely helps anyone.

Playing politics isn’t it,both sides do it and then we end up not discussing the issues at hand