Current Affairs The General Election

[Number_25]

Maybe its got something to do with the threat of a Corbyn administration blindly plundering anyone who has more than £2.56 in their bank account.

As unpalatable as it sounds, a successful country needs some folk to be rich.

Nobody is saying that nobody should be rich?

 

[tsubaki]

Thought this sums it up well...

Why Jeremy Corbyn’s big Brexit leak gives Boris Johnson and the media a headache

Jeremy Corbyn has unveiled a leaked Treasury document showing that, despite Boris Johnson’s assurances, there will be customs checks on goods going

www.newstatesman.com

Jeremy Corbyn has unveiled a leaked Treasury document showing that, despite Boris Johnson’s assurances, there will be customs checks on goods going between Northern Ireland and the rest of the United Kingdom and vice versa.

His argument is that, as Johnson has already broken his word by putting a customs and regulatory border in the Irish Sea, we can’t possibly trust him to keep his word on Brexit. Corbyn’s case is unimpeachable, copper-bottomed, seaworthy: whatever synonym for “unarguable” you want, it fits.

But his actual prop to make that case tells us nothing new at all – it is the first official document saying that as well as checks going east to west (that is, between Northern Ireland and the rest of the United Kingdom) there will be checks going west to east (that is, between the United Kingdom and Northern Ireland). But that is “news” only in the sense that someone telling you “you have to take the stairs to get to the top of the tower” might tell you that you have to take the stairs to get back down again – it follows inexorably from the first point.

It’s similar to Corbyn’s first big secret document, which only told us what anyone who had looked at the detail of US-UK trade knew: that the only way to have a meaningful US-UK trade deal is to put British agriculture and pharmaceuticals on the table.

For Labour, the two documents are inextricably linked. Labour’s case is that, because Johnson has been shown he can’t be trusted on the customs and regulatory border in the Irish Sea, he also can’t be trusted on keeping the NHS out of a US-UK trade deal, or increasing the number of police on the beat, or any other promise you care to name. And again, the policy case here is unarguable: there are, in my view, good political reasons to think that in practice Boris Johnson will never be able to overcome public resistance to breaking these promises. But the pattern across these documents is clear: that policy assurances from Boris Johnson tend not to mean very much.

While both documents perfectly illustrate the case Labour wants to make, neither document is “new”. But Team Corbyn know full well that the only way to get most of the press, particularly our all-important general interest broadcasters, to cover policy is to add the words “Top Secret” in big shiny letters on it. So after an NHS story that revealed nothing we already know, we have a customs and regulatory story that reveals nothing that isn’t in Boris Johnson’s withdrawal agreement. Yet without these leaks, coverage of the content of Johnson’s Brexit deal would be even thinner than it currently is.

One of the troubling things about this election is that, outside of the specialist press and Sky News, the policy detail of Johnson’s Brexit plan has barely been scrutinised. That matters not just because of the election and how it might change the result but what happens next. Trade policy isn’t, largely, about things that are hidden from view: it’s about the granular detail of things like the withdrawal agreement – the kind of thing that the BBC’s Brexitcast podcast, the most influential Brexit podcast, frequently describes as “nerdy”.

It’s not nerdy – it’s essential, and it shouldn’t require the leader of the opposition to treat things we already know as top secret for it to be covered properly.

TBF it’s a bit misleading to say this is a new phenomenon - things like who funds our politics, what Brexit will actually mean, what Johnson’s character is and what our economic policy leads to are all known, but are not spoken of anywhere like as much as they should be.

 

[flibbyflob]

We are being badly let down by our journalists, who are not giving the Conservative Party the scrutiny their behaviour amd policy or lack of it warrants.

Their strategy has been to scrape into power by avoiding scrutiny and our media has gone along with it, pretty much.

Or when they try they make it up like Channel 4 did earlier with the "People of colour" shambles.

 

[evilwebby]

Nobody is saying that nobody should be rich?

In political discussion:

Rich is someone who is paid more than me.
Lazy is someone who is paid less than me.

 

[roydo]

Nobody is saying that nobody should be rich?

Not really the point. I think its more that this Labour Party seem to view being rich, or fairly wealthy, as something to inherently frown upon. Most people dont get born rich. Some do, obvs, but most rich people GET rich. Generally from building businesses.

Now, what Labour do not seem to get is that central business building issue; having businesses is good, but the rewards for building one need to be respected because the risks in trying it are 100% on one person, or family. They have put up their cash/house to build something which many will benefit from, so some of the reward for that should be respected. By treating dividend income and CGT the same as income tax removes at a stroke one of the incentives to risk building one. So frankly, why bother?

 

[OnlyBlueWillDo]

Not really the point. I think its more that this Labour Party seem to view being rich, or fairly wealthy, as something to inherently frown upon. Most people dont get born rich. Some do, obvs, but most rich people GET rich. Generally from building businesses.

Now, what Labour do not seem to get is that central business building issue; having businesses is good, but the rewards for building one need to be respected because the risks in trying it are 100% on one person, or family. They have put up their cash/house to build something which many will benefit from, so some of the reward for that should be respected. By treating dividend income and CGT the same as income tax removes at a stroke one of the incentives to risk building one. So frankly, why bother?

Corporation Tax, Germany 29.8%, France 34.4%, Spain 25%, Italy 27.8%, UK 19%.

Do you think that is morally right, that 95% of the population has just suffered austerity for 9 years and our Corp Tax has gone from 28% to 19% under the Tories.

Johnson said he was cancelling a further 2% reduction to put 6bn extra into the public's coffers.

People lined up in corridors on hospital beds dying, 1 in 4 children in poverty, 41k food parcels given out in 2010 to 1.6m last year.

19% Corp Tax after what the Tories have done to the country for 9 years is obscene.

 

[roydo]

Corporation Tax, Germany 29.8%, France 34.4%,Spain 25%, Italy 27.8%, UK 19%.

Do you think that is morally right, that 95% of the population has just suffered austerity for 9 years and our Corp Tax has gone from 28% to 19% under the Tories.

Johnson said he was cancelling a further 2% reduction to put 6bn extra into the public's coffers.

People lined up in corridors on hospital beds dying, 1 in 4 children in poverty, 41k food parcels given out in 2010 to 1.6m last year.

19% Corp Tax after what the Tories have done to the country for 9 years is obscene.

I didnt comment on anything other than the Labour Party seemingly having a disconnect between the importance of businesses and their understanding of encouraging/rewarding folk for trying to start them.

 

[JimmyJeffers]

Corporation Tax, Germany 29.8%, France 34.4%, Spain 25%, Italy 27.8%, UK 19%.

Do you think that is morally right, that 95% of the population has just suffered austerity for 9 years and our Corp Tax has gone from 28% to 19% under the Tories.

Johnson said he was cancelling a further 2% reduction to put 6bn extra into the public's coffers.

People lined up in corridors on hospital beds dying, 1 in 4 children in poverty, 41k food parcels given out in 2010 to 1.6m last year.

19% Corp Tax after what the Tories have done to the country for 9 years is obscene.

‘We’re all in this together’ was one of the greatest lies of modern politics.

 

[roydo]

‘We’re all in this together’ was one of the greatest lies of modern politics.

Its a complete myth whoever says it.

 

[Connor]

Telling these folks to "work harder" and "pull up your bootstraps" doesn't really work.

We have a serious, heartbreaking problem here that will only be compounded if these Tory rats succeed next week.

Nearly 1 million children under 11 face Christmas 'without warm home or fresh food this year'

More than one in 10 young children likely to spend festive season without the basics, charity warns

www.independent.co.uk

 

[zzr45]

People lined up in corridors on hospital beds dying, 1 in 4 children in poverty, 41k food parcels given out in 2010 to 1.6m

I’ll be glad when this particularly overplayed record is put to bed. It seems to be deployed with regularity whenever people want to analyse things beyond sound bites.

 

[tsubaki]

Not really the point. I think its more that this Labour Party seem to view being rich, or fairly wealthy, as something to inherently frown upon. Most people dont get born rich. Some do, obvs, but most rich people GET rich. Generally from building businesses.

Now, what Labour do not seem to get is that central business building issue; having businesses is good, but the rewards for building one need to be respected because the risks in trying it are 100% on one person, or family. They have put up their cash/house to build something which many will benefit from, so some of the reward for that should be respected. By treating dividend income and CGT the same as income tax removes at a stroke one of the incentives to risk building one. So frankly, why bother?

Not really - Labour have been trying to encourage SME development via the manifesto, and for bigger firms most of the negative impact is going to be slightly increased corporation tax.

Also I would sort of point out that some reform is urgently needed, as has been shown repeatedly lately, in order to protect shareholders. Today's example (Eddie Stobart) were £200 million in debt, lost £12 million in the first half of the year, there are severe questions over its accounts and yet they paid out £24 million in dividend payments this May (and had been paying out for two years). They've just been "saved" by the investor (that had £150 million out of a rights issue less than three years ago) loaning them £55 million at 18% interest.

 

[OnlyBlueWillDo]

I didnt comment on anything other than the Labour Party seemingly having a disconnect between the importance of businesses and their understanding of encouraging/rewarding folk for trying to start them.

Labour want to raise Corp Tax to 26%, it's tax on profit, how does that put people off starting a business.

The reason we hear of these obscene bonuses of 500k, 1m, 2m, 5m to CEO's is because there is so much untaxed profit floating about at the top of these companies thanks to the reductions under the Tories.

For the many not the few, what's wrong with that?

 

[roydo]

Not really - Labour have been trying to encourage SME development via the manifesto, and for bigger firms most of the negative impact is going to be slightly increased corporation tax.

Also I would sort of point out that some reform is urgently needed, as has been shown repeatedly lately, in order to protect shareholders. Today's example (Eddie Stobart) were £200 million in debt, lost £12 million in the first half of the year, there are severe questions over its accounts and yet they paid out £24 million in dividend payments this May (and had been paying out for two years). They've just been "saved" by the investor (that had £150 million out of a rights issue less than three years ago) loaning them £55 million at 18% interest.

Stobarts has been a mess for a while iirc. But anyrate, bringing up one company, (private owned isnt it?) isnt really the point. I could equally bring up a company that started with 2 blokes, now employs 600 folk, and is a FTSE 100 as an example of said blokes having support via tax stuff to take the plunge 20 years ago.

The central issue is that equalising income dividend and CGT removes a key driver for small businesses to start in the first place.

 

[roydo]

Labour want to raise Corp Tax to 26%, it's tax on profit, how does that put people off starting a business.

The reason we hear of these obscene bonuses of 500k, 1m, 2m, 5m bonuses to CEO's is because there is so much untaxed profit floating about at the top of these companies thanks to the reductions under the Tories.

For the many not the few, what's wrong with that?.

You are totally missing the point mate. I have not said one word about large companies. One key driver for folk starting and growing a business is the ability to have dividend income taxed differently than income tax.

One is a tax on earnings, the other is a tax on taking the risk to end up employing people.