Current Affairs The Conservative Party

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He gave you some books to read and you said "that proves you can't answer my questions".
Books on open border policy everywhere. Which is a massive deflection when it was in relation to only this country.

Unless a good few million people uproot and go to a different country to 'make space' which then becomes purely fantasy based rather than realistic.

But again it circles back to it being completely right and not devoid of any drawbacks. So saying 'theres some books' doesn't deviate from it being someone's opinion on how THEY think it would work rather than actual evidence that proves it does.

Ergo opinion , not right or wrong, plenty out there that disagrees with an open border policy, especially when it's reliant on a fantasy element.
 
Books on open border policy everywhere. Which is a massive deflection when it was in relation to only this country.

Unless a good few million people uproot and go to a different country to 'make space' which then becomes purely fantasy based rather than realistic.

But again it circles back to it being completely right and not devoid of any drawbacks. So saying 'theres some books' doesn't deviate from it being someone's opinion on how THEY think it would work rather than actual evidence that proves it does.

Ergo opinion , not right or wrong, plenty out there that disagrees with an open border policy, especially when it's reliant on a fantasy element.
It's not a deflection, it's a different ideology regarding how to view a shared space and resource.

Within that there is some evidence to answer the questions you asked. You chose not to bother reading it in favour of wanting to 'win' an argument.
 
It's not a deflection, it's a different ideology regarding how to view a shared space and resource.

Within that there is some evidence to answer the questions you asked. You chose not to bother reading it in favour of wanting to 'win' an argument.

But it's still an opinion , not right or wrong. Therefore this idea that someone cannot disagree with it is pathetic.

By the way, it's a complete cop out of any discussion to tell someone to go and read something rather than answering the question directly. It's actually a pathetic way of offering a viewpoint, I really don't care what those authors think, I asked Bruce for his thoughts.
 
But it's still an opinion , not right or wrong. Therefore this idea that someone cannot disagree with it is pathetic.

By the way, it's a complete cop out of any discussion to tell someone to go and read something rather than answering the question directly. It's actually a pathetic way of offering a viewpoint, I really don't care what those authors think, I asked Bruce for his thoughts.
He didn't say you couldn't disagree, he said you were lazily dismissing his opinion and evidence, which you did.

Now here you are arguing that no opinion is right or wrong, only opinions.

By the way, no it's not a complete cop out, it's an opportunity for further debate based on the ideas in those books.
 
He didn't say you couldn't disagree, he said you were lazily dismissing his opinion and evidence, which you did.

Now here you are arguing that no opinion is right or wrong, only opinions.

By the way, no it's not a complete cop out, it's an opportunity for further debate based on the ideas in those books.
It’s amazing isn’t it … just proves the point you can’t reason with stupidity
 
But it's still an opinion , not right or wrong. Therefore this idea that someone cannot disagree with it is pathetic.

By the way, it's a complete cop out of any discussion to tell someone to go and read something rather than answering the question directly. It's actually a pathetic way of offering a viewpoint, I really don't care what those authors think, I asked Bruce for his thoughts.
Why wouldn’t you care what people who have given the matter considerable thought and carried out extensive research on the subject think?
Similarly, it ought to be reasonable to deduce that Bruce, having read the books, recommended them to you as a way of (a) communicating his views to you as expressed by eminent subject matter experts and (b) giving you an opportunity to expand your knowledge of the subject.
You are confusing the fact that everyone has the right to an opinion with all opinions are equally valid, which clearly they are not. Opinions based on fact and evidence, such as those in the books that you are refusing to read, usually outweigh someone’s ranty YouTube video made after a lunchtime session with like minded experts in Wetherspoons.
 
Why wouldn’t you care what people who have given the matter considerable thought and carried out extensive research on the subject think?
Similarly, it ought to be reasonable to deduce that Bruce, having read the books, recommended them to you as a way of (a) communicating his views to you as expressed by eminent subject matter experts and (b) giving you an opportunity to expand your knowledge of the subject.
You are confusing the fact that everyone has the right to an opinion with all opinions are equally valid, which clearly they are not. Opinions based on fact and evidence, such as those in the books that you are refusing to read, usually outweigh someone’s ranty YouTube video made after a lunchtime session with like minded experts in Wetherspoons.
You got the option of life saving treatment:

You have the opinion of a renowned expert on the particular illness or the opinion of random internet guy.
 
Why wouldn’t you care what people who have given the matter considerable thought and carried out extensive research on the subject think?
Similarly, it ought to be reasonable to deduce that Bruce, having read the books, recommended them to you as a way of (a) communicating his views to you as expressed by eminent subject matter experts and (b) giving you an opportunity to expand your knowledge of the subject.
You are confusing the fact that everyone has the right to an opinion with all opinions are equally valid, which clearly they are not. Opinions based on fact and evidence, such as those in the books that you are refusing to read, usually outweigh someone’s ranty YouTube video made after a lunchtime session with like minded experts in Wetherspoons.
Haven't you heard mate? We've all had enough of experts...


michael-gove.webp
 
He didn't say you couldn't disagree, he said you were lazily dismissing his opinion and evidence, which you did.

Now here you are arguing that no opinion is right or wrong, only opinions.

By the way, no it's not a complete cop out, it's an opportunity for further debate based on the ideas in those books.
That's not how discussion works.

But more to the point I challenged someone on their views and that was likened to denying evolution and now because I personally aren't going to read hand picked books written on the subject I must be stupid.

It's pathetic, and a complete pompus attitude to put accross.

Why wouldn’t you care what people who have given the matter considerable thought and carried out extensive research on the subject think?
Similarly, it ought to be reasonable to deduce that Bruce, having read the books, recommended them to you as a way of (a) communicating his views to you as expressed by eminent subject matter experts and (b) giving you an opportunity to expand your knowledge of the subject.
You are confusing the fact that everyone has the right to an opinion with all opinions are equally valid, which clearly they are not. Opinions based on fact and evidence, such as those in the books that you are refusing to read, usually outweigh someone’s ranty YouTube video made after a lunchtime session with like minded experts in Wetherspoons.

Let me ask you, disagreeing with an open border idea, what's wrong with that? We know that's not an isolated thought process and there is plenty out there that disagrees with it or doesn't think it's viable so what is wrong with holding that idea? After all, it generates potential negatives such as

1. Too many unskilled workers settling in one country

2. Welfare issues

3. Loss of national identity

Not to mention the impact of losing high skill workers in a country. Or the idea that it wouldn't be an open door policy so therefore immigration rules would then have to apply putting you right back in the same position you are in now.

It loses value to a country, being able to go wherever you want doesn't benefit a country in any way, unlike countries like Australia who require worth for immigration. You lose all of that.

It's a completely utopia style argument based in fantasy no matter how strongly you think about it.

So what is wrong with disagreeing with that notion? Rather than dismissive and insulting comparisons and childish name calling. Reading and learning your own viewpoint doesn't validate it any more, it's simply reading the like minded thoughts and creating an echo chamber mindset.

Open border policy isn't the answer to life's problems. It's generates its own problems as other academics have also written about.
 
That's not how discussion works.

But more to the point I challenged someone on their views and that was likened to denying evolution and now because I personally aren't going to read hand picked books written on the subject I must be stupid.

It's pathetic, and a complete pompus attitude to put accross.



Let me ask you, disagreeing with an open border idea, what's wrong with that? We know that's not an isolated thought process and there is plenty out there that disagrees with it or doesn't think it's viable so what is wrong with holding that idea? After all, it generates potential negatives such as

1. Too many unskilled workers settling in one country

2. Welfare issues

3. Loss of national identity

Not to mention the impact of losing high skill workers in a country. Or the idea that it wouldn't be an open door policy so therefore immigration rules would then have to apply putting you right back in the same position you are in now.

It loses value to a country, being able to go wherever you want doesn't benefit a country in any way, unlike countries like Australia who require worth for immigration. You lose all of that.

It's a completely utopia style argument based in fantasy no matter how strongly you think about it.

So what is wrong with disagreeing with that notion? Rather than dismissive and insulting comparisons and childish name calling. Reading and learning your own viewpoint doesn't validate it any more, it's simply reading the like minded thoughts and creating an echo chamber mindset.

Open border policy isn't the answer to life's problems. It's generates its own problems as other academics have also written about.
Nothing is wrong with having your opinion mate. As I stated in my previous post, having an opinion is fine.
People disagreeing with it is also fine. No one has called your opinion childish but you haven’t offered any evidence to support your argument, all you’ve done is repeated your own opinion using different words or analogies.
When others have offered evidence you’ve chosen to ignore it. If your confidence in your own viewpoint is so strong, you would take the time to read the contrary view and be able to refute it. As it is you’ve just trotted out some nebulous cliches about being overrun with unskilled workers and losing national identity (whatever that is). No one has said that open border policy is “the answer to life’s problems” and I agree that it’s a policy that would have consequences, just the same way that closed door policies would.
 
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