So, this Syria thing...

[Allezfan]

We are a permanent member of the UN Security Council, with responsibilities. Either we are interested purely in ourselves or we are interested in the security of the world. If the former, give up our seat and become an Ireland, if the latter then behave as we have the ability to do so. Younger people on here may not remember that we have been and still are a major military power. We should also behave as one......

Former for me. Like I said, I'm an isolationist down to my bones.

 

[fozzy]

IMO, no.

You can argue otherwise but I don't believe a government has any moral obligation towards people it doesn't govern.

easy to say living in a free country.

 

[peteblue]

Former for me. Like I said, I'm an isolationist down to my bones.

I understand that. If a kid was being beaten up in the street, I would step in, you I assume would walk by......or have I got that wrong........

 

[Allezfan]

I understand that. If a kid was being beaten up in the street, I would step in, you I assume would walk by......or have I got that wrong........

Is the kid british?

 

[peteblue]

Is the kid british?

Does it really matter.......

 

[Allezfan]

easy to say living in a free country.

Easy to support foreign intervention on moral ground when living in a country that hasn't suffered from that very thing, too.

I imagine your iranians or chileans or iraqis or filipinos would disagree.

 

[fozzy]

Easy to support foreign intervention on moral ground when living in a country that hasn't suffered from that very thing, too.

I imagine your iranians or chileans or iraqis or filipinos would disagree.

easy to wright that in a free country

 

[peteblue]

Easy to support foreign intervention on moral ground when living in a country that hasn't suffered from that very thing, too.

I imagine your iranians or chileans or iraqis or filipinos would disagree.

We fought two world wars for the principles we hold dear.......

 

[Allezfan]

Does it really matter.......

If I saw a kid on the street of the town I live being beaten up, I would intervene.

If I saw a video of a kid being beaten up in france, I wouldn't ditch work to buy a plane ticket to fly over to france and start randomly hitting people who looked like the guy I saw in the video, though.

We fought two world wars for the principles we hold dear.......

No we didn't.

We fought them to protect british interests. Which aren't served by attacking syria.

 

[peteblue]

If I saw a kid on the street of the town I live being beaten up, I would intervene.

If I saw a video of a kid being beaten up in france, I wouldn't ditch work to buy a plane ticket to fly over to france and start randomly hitting people who looked like the guy I saw in the video, though.



No we didn't.

We fought them to protect british interests. Which aren't served by attacking syria.

So you would intervene, providing you didn't have to travel too far.......

We fought two world wars on the basis of guarantees we gave to allies, not for our own benefit. Both wars effectively cost us our place as the ultimate power, economically and militarily, on the planet. I think we deserve some credit for that....

 

[Pat's Van]

...our place as the ultimate power, economically and militarily, on the planet. I think we deserve some credit for that....

I think the way in which we initially gained that status is a little at odds with wanting credit for having lost it mate

 

[Allezfan]

So you would intervene, providing you didn't have to travel too far.......

It's a crap metaphor.

If a kid's been attacked you step in and save him, easy peasy. A war isn't like that, armed intervention very rarely reduces the body count or doesn't lead to problems down the line. It just makes you feel better for having done something.

I object to spending british money and british lives on something that I don't think will have any real benefit in terms of improving lives, beyond make people feel good about the fact we were involved.

What would we do which would improve things? How would armed intervention help in any way?

We fought two world wars on the basis of guarantees we gave to allies, not for our own benefit. Both wars effectively cost us our place as the ultimate power, economically and militarily, on the planet. I think we deserve some credit for that....

We do. And if syria were an aggressive power attacking our allies and threatening to expand exponentially, we certainly should intervene.

But they're not, they're purely focused on internal enemies. And there's a reason we went to war with hitler but not stalin, because our policy is not to intervene for moral reasons but for strategic ones.

The aggressive expansive power, is the islamist rebels syria are gassing.

 

[peteblue]

I think the way in which we initially gained that status is a little at odds with wanting credit for having lost it mate

Hey, we gained it through an Industrial revolution that changed the world, and we brought more good to the world than bad. We should not be ashamed of what our forefathers did. Name one other country that has done more to improve the planet....

 

[Raymondo077]

SKY WANTS WAR.

I despair,,, i really do.

 

[Pat's Van]

Hey, we gained it through an Industrial revolution that changed the world, and we brought more good to the world than bad. We should not be ashamed of what our forefathers did. Name one other country that has done more to improve the planet....

I'm not ashamed of anything, well, not stuff that I'd post on here anyway.

but to answer your question, I'd need more insight....improved the planet in what way mate ?