Rewiring history..

[SerenityNigh]

Many of them are monuments at Civil War battle sites, graveyards, etc, and should stay. But most are in public spaces, like the one I can see from my office window that sits outside the Parish (County) Courthouse. Such as these serve no good purpose.

As an example, of which I presume most of these are similar, here is the one outside my office. You can see it here in front of the Parish Courthouse and a larger shot as well. I'll have to get a closer image later; it's an interesting statue that I believe includes a Greek goddess.

This first picture is the courthouse

This is the statue, 2 stories tall, in front of the entrance to the courthouse. It's set between the US and Louisiana flags. It marks the entrance to justice and the foundation of law and governance of the Parish. I don't think its location is "incidental" to the images it's meant to provoke--I don't think you can ever assume that images are accidental. (The top is obscured by trees, I'll see if I can get a better picture)

Our Parish was named after the the conglomerate of Caddo Indians (local Native Americans under one name) and the city and Parish seat after a river boat captain who broke up the "great raft"/"log jam" and innovated the riverway and economy of the area, allowing the river to become navigable while still floating logs from forest to sawmill, and finally allowing the area it to be settled. None of the history of the area is relative to the 5 people nor the Greek Goddess on the monument, and no Civil War battles were fought in this area (the nearest battle was in an adjacent Parish).

So tell me, what does this symbolize, other that Jim Crow era oppression of black by whites? There's no "history" nor "heritage" that this preserves, only hate and oppression.

 

[SerenityNigh]

As far as whether they were good people I made no argument using that as to why they should stay. Or be taken down for that matter. Iwas merely telling a story that many, including yourself probably weren't aware of. I'm sorry it made you jump to the conclusion you had to defend yourself or your position.

I simply thought the individual in your article saying Jackson was essentially Eichmann carried things more than a little too far. I don't believe, and I'd say most objective people would agree, the two men aren't at all similar. I'd even think an objective journalist would attempt to find a quote to use that wasn't so patently ridiculous.

Points well made

 

[OldDominionBlue]

Back in the day I was good friends with a Spanish girl called Laura.

On one occasion, we were talking about Spanish history and what the kids learned at school in general.

So I asked her "What about that Sir Francis Drake?"

She looked blankly at me.
I went on to explain about the lad who sank your Armada, beat you all the way back home.
But only after he finished his Budweiser, packet of fags, sandwich and a game of bowls. Allegedly.

She continued to look blankly at me.
She had no idea the Spanish had a fleet of ships that regularly tried to bully the friendly Brits.
She had no idea who Francis Drake was.
Anyway, I touched her boob.

She only has one? Poor lady...

 

[BigBlueConk]

She only has one? Poor lady...

I felt a right tit.

 

[SerenityNigh]

I felt a right tit.

If you didn't sink her vessels, you're no Drake, sir

 

[BigBlueConk]

If you didn't sink her vessels, you're no Drake, sir

I missed the boat with her.

 

[bignev23]

Should they pull down all the memorials and ostracise anyone who had anything to do with the wars in Vietnam, Lebanon, Afghanistan or Iraq (2003) the drone wars in Pakistan or the bombings of Libya just to name a few and stop pretending that these are heros because they were also wars fought for unjust causes... Thought not. Maybe in a few hundred years when someone has a political agenda and is looking to score points and be morally superior it might happen.

 

[bignev23]

Here in England we have so many statues and tributes to our former masters who in reality were exporters of mass murderer it would only be just to call them serial killers but I think the general public would tend to be protective of these and would cause uproar if they were removed.

 

[magicjuan]

Again, they are not artifacts. Battlefields are artifacts. Things that existed in the period are artifacts. A statue created after the fact is not an artifact.

You're wrong. Right about the battlefield, wrong about man made historical stuff.

 

[Groucho]

 

[tim gabbott]

 

[Xenimus]

How despicable. Taking down a monument to our heritage, statues should never be brought down.

 

[TheFinnFan]

There seems to be an overt trend at the moment to wipe out elements of history just because it doesn't fit in with current morality and political views.
This isn't a new phenomenon, it was always done by conquering hoardes to eradicate cultures, the library at Alexandria is the biggest known occassion, but more recently too with the Taliban destroying buddhist monuments, the destruction of ancient sites across Iraq and Afghanistan, by both sides, and now with the pulling down of confederate 'monuments'.
Do we allow the past to stand and instruct and to learn from? Or do we eradicate, sanitise, to be forgotten, only to see the mistakes repeated further down the line?
This has been mooted closer to home with suggestions on renaming streets in Liverpool that were named after slave traders. It wouldn't stop the historical fact that our city grew and benefitted from slavery.
Why the need to 'rewire' history?

Just like ISIS did. Idiots.

 

[Raindog]

Should they pull down all the memorials and ostracise anyone who had anything to do with the wars in Vietnam, Lebanon, Afghanistan or Iraq (2003) the drone wars in Pakistan or the bombings of Libya just to name a few and stop pretending that these are heros because they were also wars fought for unjust causes... Thought not. Maybe in a few hundred years when someone has a political agenda and is looking to score points and be morally superior it might happen.

No, memorials are one thing. A lot of fine innocents were sent to the meat grinder in Vietnam.

However, how would you percieve a statue of William Westmoreland right outside the Vietnamese embassy in NY, or even in Ho Chi Min city?

P.s, long time listener, first time caller. Hello.

 

[Raindog]

Back in the day I was good friends with a Spanish girl called Laura.

On one occasion, we were talking about Spanish history and what the kids learned at school in general.

So I asked her "What about that Sir Francis Drake?"

She looked blankly at me.
I went on to explain about the lad who sank your Armada, beat you all the way back home.
But only after he finished his Budweiser, packet of fags, sandwich and a game of bowls. Allegedly.

She continued to look blankly at me.
She had no idea the Spanish had a fleet of ships that regularly tried to bully the friendly Brits.
She had no idea who Francis Drake was.
Anyway, I touched her boob.

A little surprising (not the boob part), I once got buttonholed in a bar in Barcelona for being English and was told in no uncertain terms that Drake was a pirate and a cad. Thought nothing more of it, but brought up tje topic with another Spaniard at a later date (I knoe, my life is non-stop fun and games) only to have the opinion repeated. Both blokes, no touching.