Obama

[edge]

Thing is mate, it just requires a bit of thinking ahead. Even closer to home, it sounds very much like a Brexit would prompt Scotland to leave the Union. Would Wales want to leave too? What would happen in Ireland? Would it require a 'hard' border between north and south? Would the north want to remain in the EU themselves and if so, would that precipitate a unification of Ireland, with all of the ramifications of that.

I mean, believe it or not, our economy has actually been in growth for a few years now so by most laws of economic cycles we're probably due a recession before long and we have an environment where lots of knee jerking populists who love blaming other people for their problems are gaining ground all over the continent, and the prospect of a country leaving the EU that would almost certainly cause sufficient short-term economic trouble to kick us into that recession that we're due. All evidence suggests that it's in exactly those times that those aforementioned populists gain even more ground, which may well result in large chunks of Europe being governed by racists or socialists, which worked bloody marvelously the last time it was tried.

And keeping Scotland and Wales is seen as a reason to stay in ?
Deffo out from me if that happened.

 

[edge]

Yeah basically, I'd like to see the NHS protected from TTIP. That's the issue for me personally.


I'd hope, regardless of party allegiance, that any government would do that.

When you look a little closer at TTIP the USA wanted any part of the health sevice that had been put out to tender and won by a private company ,never to be taken back in house again.
that would lead to most of the health service being run by private companies over time.
They can get to f with that one

 

[peteblue]

When you look a little closer at TTIP the USA wanted any part of the health sevice that had been put out to tender and won by a private company ,never to be taken back in house again.
that would lead to most of the health service being run by private companies over time.
They can get to f with that one

And this is the problem with the EU. If the UK was to do a trade deal with the USA then the concerns of the two parties would be addressed. When the EU negotiates, it has to concern itself with the interests of 28 different countries with differing concerns. It will be an absolute dogs dinner.......

 

[daylightrobber]

And this is the problem with the EU. If the UK was to do a trade deal with the USA then the concerns of the two parties would be addressed. When the EU negotiates, it has to concern itself with the interests of 28 different countries with differing concerns. It will be an absolute dogs dinner.......

Who's going to get the better deal, the lone nation or the collective?

 

[SNova]

 

[SNova]

Who's going to get the better deal, the lone nation or the collective?

The fact about TTIP is that if the EU sign the trade deal there is nothing we - the people - can do about it. If an independent UK were to sign a deal we could vote in a new government that could change the deal.

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices...the-eu-official-in-charge-of-it-a6690591.html

"I do not take my mandate from the European people.”

 

[daylightrobber]

Where are the UKIP vids of Farage being racist towards Obama?

 

[peteblue]

Who's going to get the better deal, the lone nation or the collective?

Depends on how you look at it. If the UK alone deals with the USA and can't get a good deal then we just walk away from it. If the EU negotiates on our behalf and gets a good deal for Germany and a bad one for the Uk then the Eu will push it through.......

 

[SNova]

Where are the UKIP vids of Farage being racist towards Obama?

When? I haven't heard of such videos.

 

[rascal]

Yes, and the state should not be above that law. If utilities were nationalised, would you be ok if it was them poisoning your water supplies? I doubt that. No one should be above the law.

I would be in a position to do something about that. As would everyone else who is suffering.

 

[Eggs]

.....he's a fine orator but having read his books I wandered what he actually achieved in his time as an 'organiser' and politician in Chicago. I really liked the insight from the recent 'inside the White House' documentaries, how he had to negotiate with democrats to get his health care package through and his genuine stance against the US gun laws. All politicians have issues but in the scheme of things I think he's been ok and has the right type of values.

 

[Caolam]

The part of the "leave campaign" argument that I can't fathom is that as a member of the EU we don't have enough influence to be able to lead. We are one of the big 3, in Europe but Germany and France make all the decisions which all are contrary to our interests. However take us out of that club of 28 and into the world we are going to strong arm the EU into giving us a trade deal that is beneficial to us. We are going to flex our muscle and do deals with China and America again to our benefit.
I really don't understand how we can go from the poor relation of the EU to dominating the world at the stroke of a pen.If we can't be Great Britian on the smaller stage I really can't see how we can be Great Britian on a bigger stage.
It is time to fully endorse Europe and get stuck in and make a serious attempt to influence the direction it is going not turn up and make demands and then spit the dummy out of the pram.

 

[SNova]

The part of the "leave campaign" argument that I can't fathom is that as a member of the EU we don't have enough influence to be able to lead. We are one of the big 3, in Europe but Germany and France make all the decisions which all are contrary to our interests. However take us out of that club of 28 and into the world we are going to strong arm the EU into giving us a trade deal that is beneficial to us. We are going to flex our muscle and do deals with China and America again to our benefit.
I really don't understand how we can go from the poor relation of the EU to dominating the world at the stroke of a pen.If we can't be Great Britian on the smaller stage I really can't see how we can be Great Britian on a bigger stage.
It is time to fully endorse Europe and get stuck in and make a serious attempt to influence the direction it is going not turn up and make demands and then spit the dummy out of the pram.

A trade deal with us is in their interest.

 

[peteblue]

The part of the "leave campaign" argument that I can't fathom is that as a member of the EU we don't have enough influence to be able to lead. We are one of the big 3, in Europe but Germany and France make all the decisions which all are contrary to our interests. However take us out of that club of 28 and into the world we are going to strong arm the EU into giving us a trade deal that is beneficial to us. We are going to flex our muscle and do deals with China and America again to our benefit.
I really don't understand how we can go from the poor relation of the EU to dominating the world at the stroke of a pen.If we can't be Great Britian on the smaller stage I really can't see how we can be Great Britian on a bigger stage.
It is time to fully endorse Europe and get stuck in and make a serious attempt to influence the direction it is going not turn up and make demands and then spit the dummy out of the pram.

I think you've answered part of it yourself. "Germany and France make all the decisions which are all contrary to our interests". This is not about being big or dominating the world. It's about being able to make choices and decisions that are in the best interests of the UK. We joined a trading club. The club now wants to become a big country, all speaking different languages, with different cultures, that ever expands (Turkey) and insists that every EU person has the right to live and work in the UK, and passes laws that come from an elite that we cannot vote out of office......we didn't vote for that back in the 70's......

 

[ToffeeTim]

I am finding it strange that Obama is patronising us by insisting we should do and accept things that America would never dream of doing. It's also utterly absurd to suggest that America would not trade with Britain. They will in or out of the EU. Plus Obama is going and Clinton will ally closely with Britain regardless of the EU vote, and so would Trump dare I say if they are mad enough to elect him.

All that said, I've no idea regarding the EU referendum and am so confused I probably won't bother to vote. My brief conclusion is that it's good and beneficial for Britain to be part of Europe, but the current Europe is as shambolic and disfunctional as the NI Assembly here in my neck of the woods. So I'm none the wiser....