Transfer Rumour Matías Vecino

[MikeH72]

Be honest, have you ever seen Snides dribble the ball?

Not a single time ever.

 

[TheBigIguana]

Be honest, have you ever seen Snides dribble the ball?

Not much. But .3 a game over ten games means he has 3 this year. That seems plausible to me.

 

[TheBigIguana]

No it’s not, they’ll all go down as completed passes so if you didn’t watch the games and just looked at a set of numbers, all you see is that the player had a high pass completion. But most of them were rubbish passes, and said player actually had a succession of terrible games.

Like you quoting Schneiderlin’s dribble stats, how many times have you ever seen him actually dribble in a game? I can’t remember a single time off the top of my head since he joined Everton, so what is a dribble according to WhoScored? Literally taking more than two touches on the ball is probably classed as dribbling to them. Another worthless stat that means absolutely nothing.

I'm not going to really bother with you anymore. You'll always be mad because "stats bought us Sigurdsson" even though people who care enough to look into have said that isn't true.

 

[MikeH72]

I'm not going to really bother with you anymore. You'll always be mad because "stats bought us Sigurdsson" even though people who care enough to look into have said that isn't true.

This hasn’t got anything to do with Sigurdsson, I didn’t mention him once in that post.

 

[FtheWhat]

Right but how many times over the course of the season is that likely to happen? I mean if a player smashes it at his teammates neck for 5 straight games that's probably going to be reflected in the percentage of completed passes no?

I will say this. Defensive stats are a bit shaky because there's nothing that accounts for a situation where good marking stops the ball from going toward a defender. It doesn't mean that things like % of tackles won don't matter, just that there are bigger holes to poke. But attackers and midfielders use of the ball is pretty well measured at this point. There's certainly room to argue about how valuable that stuff is. What is ridiculous is saying it has no value.

Without other data, stats do have no value! With other useful data, you can use stats well to paint out an average, but they can be very misleading.

I'll take the positioning argument with defenders. I think it is very fair.

But for attackers and midfielders at some point it becomes about what you do with the ball. Saying positioning without it means more is basically the Bernard argument and I'm just not having that. Maybe from time to time you can draw someone away or whatever but by and large players who can't do things with the ball are just not very good.

I know plenty of lads amazing with a football at their feet, but woeful at the team game because their vision and movement is terrible.

I've seen many players in the PL that are so poor at showing for the ball, or moving after making a simple pass, that ends up leaving their team mate with a poor stat.

 

[TheBigIguana]

This hasn’t got anything to do with Sigurdsson, I didn’t mention him once in that post.

I've seen you mention him about ten times with the same line about how "Walsh was looking at a spreadsheet when he bought him."

 

[MikeH72]

I've seen you mention him about ten times with the same line about how "Walsh was looking at a spreadsheet when he bought him."

That’s my opinion but it’s got nothing to do with the above post, that was a post about the overarching debate around stats in football.

 

[Brisan123]

Without other data, stats do have no value! With other useful data, you can use stats well to paint out an average, but they can be very misleading.



I know plenty of lads amazing with a football at their feet, but woeful at the team game because their vision and movement is terrible.

I've seen many players in the PL that are so poor at showing for the ball, or moving after making a simple pass, that ends up leaving their team mate with a poor stat.

Duncan McKenzie anyone
By the way you wont change his mind
Have you ever watched an American sport on American TV.
Its all stats
They are breast fed stats

 

[TheBigIguana]

Without other data, stats do have no value! With other useful data, you can use stats well to paint out an average, but they can be very misleading.



I know plenty of lads amazing with a football at their feet, but woeful at the team game because their vision and movement is terrible.

I've seen many players in the PL that are so poor at showing for the ball, or moving after making a simple pass, that ends up leaving their team mate with a poor stat.

I'm not advocating never watching guys play. What I am saying is that if a guy is showing up poorly in some statistical area there needs to be a reason to ignore it that you see by watching him play. Just saying I don't believe in data is silly and the real reason that Steve Walsh was a complete failure. It will never stop amusing me that people think sound analytics would suggest basically any of his signings after Gana.

 

[LouReedwalkonthewildside]

Inter play tomorrow in the Coppa Italia against Fiorentina...

 

[Goat]

I'm not going to really bother with you anymore. You'll always be mad because "stats bought us Sigurdsson" even though people who care enough to look into have said that isn't true.

Iceland stats proved conclusively that his open play creativity was awful, I remember highlighting it before he signed, he was vastly worse than Barkley for example.

 

[Goat]

Inter play tomorrow in the Coppa Italia against Fiorentina...

Hasnt played for Inter since 6th Jan, so that wont really prove anything.

 

[TheBigIguana]

Iceland stats proved conclusively that his open play creativity was awful, I remember highlighting it before he signed, he was vastly worse than Barkley for example.

Exactly. And that's proven to be true.

If Walsh was actually using these types of measures in the right way he would never have considered Gylfi at that price, Klaassen or Sandro. Instead he looked at literally just goals and passed it off as "analytics" or "numbers" or whatever.

 

[Brisan123]

Hasnt played for Inter since 6th Jan, so that wont really prove anything.

So you are saying its on

 

[Coggy]

Any Vecino info on this Vecino thread ?