Martinez Sentiment Poll: In or Out

[Prevenger17]

So overall I dont think this viewpoint that has it that Roberto has pissed a great squad up against the wall and blown our 'natural advantage' is one that resonates too well.

Yeah, a lot of the "great squad" Martinez inherited were or are on the decline. Jagielka, Baines, Pienaar, Distin, Howard and Osman were all decent-very good players in their day, but the 30 barrier can often coincide with a steep drop-off in energy and ability. Even Baines, who is still a good player for us, hasn't been immune to it. Of all the players left behind by Moyes, only Mirallas, Coleman, Barkley, Stones and Gibson(when fit) represent something you could build a squad around. McCarthy, Lukaku, Besic and, to a certain extent, Robles, are all great additions. Kone and Alcaraz have been duds and it can't be denied. I like McGeady and we got him for chips. Lennon is becoming a good example of Martinez' ability to exploit the loan market, though not quite the shining example of Del last year. Barry was immense for us in his first season, although it's easily forgotten now. Martinez has made some great additions to an ageing squad, and summer will be the real test. Right now he's plugging holes, but he'll have to completely rebuild the ship by next September. Judge him in December, I say.

 

[davek]

Will agree with a lot of "ropey" ( I could use a far stronger word than that but fear of a ban we will stick to yours ) performers week in week out.

Need to hit the ground running and I mean day one of ore season and getting the players look fit, drilled and hungry to win.

The process needs to start now. As others have said: let's get the next 3 points and then send the periphery of the squad on the pitch and see what we have. Also, get moving in the transfer market right now and have players lined up to get in quickly (before preseason training we should have done the vast majority of all incomings/outgoings).

No arseing round this time waiting for players.

 

[maccavennie]

The process needs to start now. As others have said: let's get the next 3 points and then send the periphery of the squad on the pitch and see what we have. Also, get moving in the transfer market right now and have players lined up to get in quickly (before preseason training we should have done the vast majority of all incomings/outgoings).

No arseing round this time waiting for players.

Agreed mate. Players lined up, signed and announced and all together from.day 1 of pre season. Make a statement to us that they are all in it together and mean business.

 

[USABlue]

Not if this season is anything to go by!

If we were in it next season I'd hope that Martinez would play understrength teams until we needed vital points to make the KO phase...and if we couldn't do it that way then hard ****, we get knocked out and concentrate on the domestic programme.

Our issue this season was we didn't add enough to the squad to have enough depth to deal with the additional games, we only added besic. We want everton to get back to the top but it's a gradual effort. Alot of the better teams in europe (not talking about the Barca, Bayern, etc) compete in EL and/or CL group stage while maintaining their league form. Bundesliga isn't that strong a league top to bottom but Wolfsburg's held 2nd despite their EL participation, Selliva's still in 5th(4 points of Atl Madrid for CL), fiorentia is 6th (2 points off 4th). We need to get to the point were we can consistently compete at two fronts. We can't just keep trading league form for europe and vice versa (Dropping partially due to EL this year, rising next year w/ no europe, so on and so on)

 

[davek]

Yeah, a lot of the "great squad" Martinez inherited were or are on the decline. Jagielka, Baines, Pienaar, Distin, Howard and Osman were all decent-very good players in their day, but the 30 barrier can often coincide with a steep drop-off in energy and ability. Even Baines, who is still a good player for us, hasn't been immune to it. Of all the players left behind by Moyes, only Mirallas, Coleman, Barkley, Stones and Gibson(when fit) represent something you could build a squad around. McCarthy, Lukaku, Besic and, to a certain extent, Robles, are all great additions. Kone and Alcaraz have been duds and it can't be denied. I like McGeady and we got him for chips. Lennon is becoming a good example of Martinez' ability to exploit the loan market, though not quite the shining example of Del last year. Barry was immense for us in his first season, although it's easily forgotten now. Martinez has made some great additions to an ageing squad, and summer will be the real test. Right now he's plugging holes, but he'll have to completely rebuild the ship by next September. Judge him in December, I say.

Cant disagree with that, especially the part about over 30s and rapid decline. We were always flirting with danger giving contracts out to players in their early 30s. It's a policy that has to stop...it's discredited.

 

[USABlue]

It will be possible this season, Chelsea won the League Cup so that EL place drops to the team that finishes sixth mate.

so 7th would get EL if Arsenal wins correct?

 

[Gwladys St. Glory]

No arseing round this time waiting for players.

A good portion of those scenarios are out of our control, though...especially if you're going after your top choices. Do we go after 2nd and third just because we know we can get them in quickly?

 

[Woolly Blue]

Does anyone know what "You have this user on ignore" means ?

 

[USABlue]

A good portion of those scenarios are out of our control, though...especially if you're going after your top choices. Do we go after 2nd and third just because we know we can get them in quickly?

plus it was a WC year as well. Best players are there then take a few weeks vaca

 

[davek]

Our issue this season was we didn't add enough to the squad to have enough depth to deal with the additional games, we only added besic. We want everton to get back to the top but it's a gradual effort. Alot of the better teams in europe (not talking about the Barca, Bayern, etc) compete in EL and/or CL group stage while maintaining their league form. Bundesliga isn't that strong a league top to bottom but Wolfsburg's held 2nd despite their EL participation, Selliva's still in 5th(4 points of Atl Madrid for CL), fiorentia is 6th (2 points off 4th). We need to get to the point were we can consistently compete at two fronts. We can't just keep trading league form for europe and vice versa (Dropping partially due to EL this year, rising next year w/ no europe, so on and so on)

Good point about the European scene (though they are aided by getting that breather in mid-season).

We spent the bulk of cash on the squad on Lukaku. Signing him was the right thing to do because he's top drawer; but we needed another £20M to reconfigure the CD and have a player who could pass Lukaku the bullets/open up teams in the final quarter. I suppose what I'm saying is we needed more cash for last summer's transfer window to have worked out.

 

[ilikecheese]

Our issue this season was we didn't add enough to the squad to have enough depth to deal with the additional games, we only added besic. We want everton to get back to the top but it's a gradual effort. Alot of the better teams in europe (not talking about the Barca, Bayern, etc) compete in EL and/or CL group stage while maintaining their league form. Bundesliga isn't that strong a league top to bottom but Wolfsburg's held 2nd despite their EL participation, Selliva's still in 5th(4 points of Atl Madrid for CL), fiorentia is 6th (2 points off 4th). We need to get to the point were we can consistently compete at two fronts. We can't just keep trading league form for europe and vice versa (Dropping partially due to EL this year, rising next year w/ no europe, so on and so on)

I agree with this in part. However, entering the season I felt we did have a big enough squad...then the injuries hit and hit and kept on hitting.

 

[USABlue]

Good point about the European scene (though they are aided by getting that breather in mid-season).

We spent the bulk of cash on the squad on Lukaku. Signing him was the right thing to do because he's top drawer; but we needed another £20M to reconfigure the CD and have a player who could pass Lukaku the bullets/open up teams in the final quarter. I suppose what I'm saying is we needed more cash for last summer's transfer window to have worked out.

and people were taking the piss after Martinez mentioned a winter break. Yeah Rom was almost the whole budget which is understandable, like you said we needed to bring in a few more. Only thing that could've helped if the money wasn't there was masterstroke loanees like Del Rom and Barry were last year which is unlikely

 

[Gwladys St. Glory]

Does anyone know what "You have this user on ignore" means ?

It's like turning the sound off if Robbie Fowler is commentating a match.

 

[USABlue]

I agree with this in part. However, entering the season I felt we did have a big enough squad...then the injuries hit and hit and kept on hitting.

good point on injuries. haven't seen or heard from pienaar in ages and going in thought he'd be a great asset in europe

 

[davek]

A good portion of those scenarios are out of our control, though...especially if you're going after your top choices. Do we go after 2nd and third just because we know we can get them in quickly?

Yes, I think it has to be that way. I know a lot of transfer activity takes place in a flurry when teams need to get shut of players and then when one massive transfer takes place the whole league clicks into gear transfer wise on primary targets, but we cant afford to get caught up in that. I think we did it of necessity with Lukaku last summer because he is a goalscorer of proven quality and they are like gold dust. We're in a different place now though.