Current Affairs London Protests

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But, as it's not really a major thing within UK BLM,

I see.

I mean, I visit their website and this is their homepage.

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There's a saying about when America sneezes, and it's very true.

I'd be interested to know what other issues you have with the movement? A lot that I've seen seem to be people with issues with 'censorship' of media which isn't an aim of BLM, or the statues, which seems a fairly small point in the grander scheme of things.

This very discussion, the very reason you're asking is why all it's unnecessary baggage.

Black Lives Matter. Of course, duh.
Racial equality. Of course.
"Defund the police? Dismantle capitalism? End broken windows policing? Nah. I disagree.

"YOU DISAGREE WITH BLACK LIVES MATTER? RACIST!!!"
 
This is a pretty good summary, I think anyway.


What do Black Lives Matter actually want?
Dig deeper and you’ll find that “ending oppression” or “empowerment” aren’t quite what you might imagine they mean


Everyone can agree that the oppression of human beings by others is bad, and that human life is sacred. Everyone can also agree that throughout Western history, there have been countless examples of atrocities committed, very often racially motivated.

No one, either, can deny the role of the British Empire in this. Nor can anyone deny that, across the West today, certain communities still face disadvantages that others would not wish to have themselves.

Black Lives Matter (BLM) is a movement, we all know, that started in the US in response to the killing of African American men at the hands of the police. And now it is here, too. There are myriad reasons as to why this is, which we could argue over until we are blue in the face. But something that is rarely discussed is what the movement aspires to. What does BLM want?

On the face of it, very few people can disagree with the title. Do black lives matter? Yes, of course. Even those who respond “all lives matter” cannot deny it. So straight out of the blocks, people may feel inclined to stop examining the movement there. Only a racist would say that black lives specifically do not matter, and that they weren’t opposed to people being mistreated as a result of their ethnicity, after all.

But dig a little deeper, and you’ll find that “ending oppression” or “empowerment” aren’t quite what you might imagine they mean.


In 2016, the US BLM campaign released ten demands as part of a manifesto, almost all to do with changing police practices in the US — things like increasing the number of minorities in community police forces to better reflect their ethnic make up, and the introduction of body cameras for officers to ensure acts of brutality would be caught on tape. Beyond those two, few of the points were or are applicable to the way policing is conducted in the UK. But the movement has morphed since then. Today, segments of BLM don’t want to change the police: They want to defund it. Some actively want forces abolished.

Today, BLM’s sites are deliberately vague on what, exactly, they want. There’s a reason for that: If policy isn’t revealed in any great detail, and aims are kept opaque, broadly based on catchy slogans everyone in principal agrees with, it makes it harder to examine, and to criticise, what a political movement wants.

But the official GoFundMe page set up to support BLM in the UK moves beyond the idea that its adherents just want a different approach to policing, or for society to remain the same but with a level playing field for all regardless of background. It claims to be committed to “dismantling imperialism, capitalism, white supremacy, patriarchy and the state structures that disproportionately harm black people.”

That’s quite a leap from what the movement originally asked for — and is a full marathon from what a lot of ordinary Brits may have in mind when aligning themselves with what they imagine is the continuation of the civil rights movement. This is no such thing: It actively calls for the dismantling of the state and the system it operates within. Don’t be fooled when it tries to only single out the structures that hurt ethnic minorities: In the past week, even the NHS, staffed to the brim with ethnic minorities, has been branded institutionally racist. When they say “dismantle state structures,” they mean the lot.

Suddenly, it begins to change the way one looks at the activities of the past few days, with hammer and sickle emblems daubed all over London’s monuments, and suggestions that, following the defenestration of the statue of Colston in Bristol, that those of the likes of Robert Peel, Earl Grey and, for some reason, Harold Wilson, should follow suit. It is no longer about police brutality, either here or in the US. It isn’t even, really, about racism. It is about regime — the regime itself is racist, and so the whole thing must go.

The UK BLM movement, like its US counterpart, also actively calls for the “abolition of police.” That is a line, I think, almost no one here wishes to cross, especially when it is proposed by people who have no qualms about attacking others or committing acts of vandalism. The Old Bill may be going down an ineffective path of bully-boy tactics and language policing, but we still need murderers and terrorist apprehended by someone. Who else is going to do it? The abstract idea of the community?

It also pledges to use some of the funds it raises on education; but will it go towards helping people from impoverished ethnic minority communities in the UK learn trades? Enter the professions? Help them empower themselves by being able to earn a good living, lifting themselves and their families of their predicaments, and help forge a better society? You know, education? Or by “education” does it mean spread more of the ideology at play, recruiting more converts to the cause, which seeks conflict and change over dialogue and reform?

There is inequality in the UK. There is prejudice, and there are things to be done. But somehow, I’m not sure our nation is so bad that it warrants being torn down and started all over again by a movement with such aims at its core.
 
Poor deflection.

You didn't answer the question.

What is she specifically against?

And let me know if my doubt about her being against racial equality or black lives mattering is wrong.

Interesting use of the word bird as well. I'm sure she loves that.

the needless rioting; the violence; the hangers on (mainly the posh white kids); the lack of respect for law and order. And the fact that she doesn’t believe the U.K. has half the problems the USA does regarding racism

do you want me to get her to write you an essay???

and how progressive of you, I did used to call her “me tart” but she kept slapping me
 
I see.

I mean, I visit their website and this is their homepage.

View attachment 91256


There's a saying about when America sneezes, and it's very true.



This very discussion, the very reason you're asking is why all it's unnecessary baggage.

Black Lives Matter. Of course, duh.
Racial equality. Of course.
"Defund the police? Dismantle capitalism? End broken windows policing? Nah. I disagree.

"YOU DISAGREE WITH BLACK LIVES MATTER? RACIST!!!"

Of course, it's perfectly possible to agree with a movements aims but not its tactics to acheive them.
 
I see.

I mean, I visit their website and this is their homepage.




There's a saying about when America sneezes, and it's very true.



This very discussion, the very reason you're asking is why all it's unnecessary baggage.

Black Lives Matter. Of course, duh.
Racial equality. Of course.
"Defund the police? Dismantle capitalism? End broken windows policing? Nah. I disagree.

"YOU DISAGREE WITH BLACK LIVES MATTER? RACIST!!!"

That's the homepage for the US BLM movement. There is no international organising committee so I'm not sure why the US site would change to make it more suitable to a British readership?

But it's not 'of course, duh' and it's not as simple as saying, 'let's have racial equality' - that's the point. None of this is possible without structural and systematic changes. However, the main aim of the UK side of this movement is quite simply asking for equality. There are various suggestions of how this can be achieved.

How would you recommend we go about making black lives matter?
 
Policing in the US and the UK are completely different kettles of fish, though. I don't think its contradictory to argue that a militarised force being used as every thing from crowd control to mental health services who are responding to protests about police brutality with more brutality could stand to have their wings clipped a little whilst a force in the UK that seeks to police by consent and have seen 20% of their numbers taken away in recent years and struggle to fulfill their mission could stand to have more resources.

Yeah, I have pointed out I think they are different and that the UK side of BLM and the US side of BLM are very different movements.
 
the needless rioting; the violence; the hangers on (mainly the posh white kids); the lack of respect for law and order. And the fact that she doesn’t believe the U.K. has half the problems the USA does regarding racism

do you want me to get her to write you an essay???

and how progressive of you, I did used to call her “me tart” but she kept slapping me

Erm, we haven't had any rioting in the UK...

Are you talking about the largely peaceful protests by up to 170 000 people, as stated by the Met Police?
 
I don’t think politics should be anywhere near football. Why the PL feel the need to jump on the bandwagon I don’t know.
I agree 100% with this. My old man always used to say ' dont mix politics with sport' . A few of my mates voted tory, I voted labour, thats their choice and respect their choice. We never argue about it, disagree yes, but we all come together on match day and give 100% support to Everton.
 
That's the homepage for the US BLM movement. There is no international organising committee so I'm not sure why the US site would change to make it more suitable to a British readership?

But it's not 'of course, duh' and it's not as simple as saying, 'let's have racial equality' - that's the point. None of this is possible without structural and systematic changes. However, the main aim of the UK side of this movement is quite simply asking for equality. There are various suggestions of how this can be achieved.

How would you recommend we go about making black lives matter?

Are you being deliberately obtuse?

Can you link me to the UK BLM movement website then?

*waits*

Oh, and;

 
I agree 100% with this. My old man always used to say ' dont mix politics with sport' . A few of my mates voted tory, I voted labour, thats their choice and respect their choice. We never argue about it, disagree yes, but we all come together on match day and give 100% support to Everton.

Football has always been political. Politics is why we have 3pm kick offs. The far right use football as a recruiting tool, so the left, especially in Merseyside and Manchester, have always had to get involved too. Who makes the shirts, who sponsors the club, who owns the club, it is all political. We cannot take politics out of football and we should not try to.
 
can you please quote properly

errr you didn’t specify that she was only allowed to talk about the U.K. You must need that essay, I’ll get one for BLM and one for BLM UK

I’m sure she’ll thrilled that privileged male wants black woman to justify herself

How progressive

The conversation you initially replied to was about the UK.

You still haven't got any answers have you?
 
Are you being deliberately obtuse?

Can you link me to the UK BLM movement website then?

*waits*

Oh, and;



There isn't one so I'm not sure what you are waiting for?

That is one part of the black lives matter protest. Before you replied I'd edited my post to say that there are various thoughts on how we go about this. The Black Lives Matter movement is a collection of thousands of different people with different aims. In the same way the gay pride movement was, or socialism is. There are various different viewpoints as to how we achieve stated aims within those groups.

The Premier League is clearly not supporting defunding the police, nor are the corporations supporting this, which should highlight the banner is Black Lives Matter not one particular organisation. Movement not organisation. Or do you think everyone who says black lives matter supports every aim?
 
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