2017/18 Kieran Dowell

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davek

Player Valuation: £80m
Yeah i think you're right. Best group of young players to come up through the ranks in last quarter of a century and Koeman isn't going to develop them for the long term good of the club. Sick of seeing average managers at Everton, can't we get an inspirational, progressive manager who can develop young players and get us playing attacking winning football?
It's very disappointing. Kenny and Dowell are as good as any that can be brought in and would be great alongside Davies to progress us for the next few seasons.

I see Kenny being loaned out too.
 

Philw

Player Valuation: £70m
Instead he's been told he's not quite good enough. Confidence destroyed.
If he's that weak minded and lacking in self confidence then he'll never make it anyway.

He'll be lying there at nights now thinking Forest is his level, confidence destroyed.
You think at 19 he thinks he's reached his peak, yet hasn't the confidence to recover from not being put straight into a team that (says it) wants to challenge for the top 4 before his 20th birthday??
 

Philw

Player Valuation: £70m
It's all a little bit academic this argument because he's on loan whether we like it or not! Just a couple of observations. Dowell is a no 10, if he's inconsistent it's because he often plays out on the right. When he's more central he's more involved, out on the right he can be isolated as can any wide player. But if we can't play a young player because their inconsistent then what have we been doing playing DCL or Lookman? DCL has hardly been the model of consistency in his performances. Some of that has to be down to the fact that he's not really being played in his best position. It's the same with Dowell. So for me this inconsistency argument is overstated particularly when Koeman splashed out £28 million on Bolassie who is the definition of inconsistent!

Koeman's handling of Dowell has been poor in my opinion. The lad played against Norwich, did well, Unsworth thought he was ready. What happened then - absolutely nothing. He was given no time off the bench for the first team, no involvement in the league cup. He wasn't sent on loan, he got disillusioned with Koeman. He spent some of last season working with Unsworth on closing down, working harder off the ball trying to improve on those things. He played in the U20 World Cup and won it with England. Had a great impact in pre-season, then binned off again by Koeman. He's the most talented youngster that we have and he hasn't had a SINGLE MINUTE of first team football from Koeman. I'd have a lot more faith that Koeman was serious about developing the lad if he'd have sent him on loan last season, given him some encouragement that if he did well he'd be involved in the first team squad this season. However that's not happened and Koeman's signed a washed up 31 year old and is about to splash 50 million on a set piece specialist to go along with a squad full of midfield dullards.

If Koeman had been willing to give him some game time then he would undoubtedly be better off staying at Everton. As it is there was no chance of that so I think the lad, who was desperate to go on loan, is better off at Forest but frankly I doubt that Koeman is doing it to develop him to play for Everton.
This post was going so well until the last line of the second paragraph. The kid is only 19. Why can't this year be the year he goes on loan and next year he can have a proper role in the first team, instead of being a bit part player? What's the rush, there's plenty of time. He's going to be developing for the next 4/5 probably, there's no need to think or want him to be getting regular/significant minutes for us yet. Patience is key with him and all the young lads. They are for the future, for 2/3 years down the line and more.
 

TX Bill

Player Valuation: £70m
I'm made up Dowell's gone out on loan. Far better to play regularly in a decent footballing team in the Championship than, at best, to sit on the bench at Goodison.

He's a real takent, but he's too good for the U23's but not quite ready for the first team. From the posts made by some you'd think loaning out fringe young players to teams at a level just below us was a new idea dreamed up by Rhino and Koeman purely to hold Dowell's development back, whereas, in reality, it's an approach favoured by pretty much all the top teams.
Just stop it. Stop it right there.

There will be none of that rational thought and analysis on here. At all !!!

Do you understand me?
 

TX Bill

Player Valuation: £70m
On a side note, a friend of mine here is a Forest supporter and I let him know that his team was getting quite a player as many Evertonians didn't want him out on loan. He's looking forward to having him help the club.
 

johnnydawg68

Chairperson, People's Front of Saint Domingo
Certain posters in this thread were implying that the Championship is not of a high enough standard for a player to grow. Point is that Lookman disproves that. Unsworth has said that Dowell needs to be playing regularly at that level, just as Lookman did.
I'm on the fence about that. I don't know that it suits Dowell or drives him forward but we'll see.
 

johnnydawg68

Chairperson, People's Front of Saint Domingo
Yeah i think you're right. Best group of young players to come up through the ranks in last quarter of a century and Koeman isn't going to develop them for the long term good of the club. Sick of seeing average managers at Everton, can't we get an inspirational, progressive manager who can develop young players and get us playing attacking winning football?
As I said earlier this is a job to him and a short term one at that. He better damn well win something.
 

PeregrineT

Player Valuation: £30m
? Read my posts again mate.
So you think so highly of Dowell you think he is a mental 8 year old, and he cant handle playing in the championship as it has now destroyed his ego?

"He'll be lying there at nights now thinking Forest is his level, confidence destroyed."
 

CRIMHEAD

Player Valuation: £60m
It's very disappointing. Kenny and Dowell are as good as any that can be brought in and would be great alongside Davies to progress us for the next few seasons.

I see Kenny being loaned out too.
Except for Sigurdsson, Barkley, Rooney, Lookman, klassen...shall I go on?

He's a championship level player right now, which is why he's going there to play. Just like all sorts of greats like your main man Ross Barkley.
 

Layne

Player Valuation: £70m
So gets a start against a league one side and doesnt get mentioned in any of the three match reports I've read, like you wouldn't know he played unless you looked at the team sheets.
So much for being better than everyone we've ever owned.
 
I'm made up Dowell's gone out on loan. Far better to play regularly in a decent footballing team in the Championship than, at best, to sit on the bench at Goodison.

He's a real takent, but he's too good for the U23's but not quite ready for the first team. From the posts made by some you'd think loaning out fringe young players to teams at a level just below us was a new idea dreamed up by Rhino and Koeman purely to hold Dowell's development back, whereas, in reality, it's an approach favoured by pretty much all the top teams.
But how many of those teams do it to sell the player on rather than develop them for the first team?

City and Chelsea in particular have both got good academies yet haven't had a player come through to regularly start in the first team for years.

Koeman clearly didn't think Dowell was either ready/his type of player and if that is the case as you say he's better off in loan than on the bench all season. But tbh I'm skeptical that it is with a plan of bringing him back to the team next season. Perhaps I'm just bitter about Koeman loaning out Deulofeu!
 

Woolly Blue

Player Valuation: £70m
But how many of those teams do it to sell the player on rather than develop them for the first team?

City and Chelsea in particular have both got good academies yet haven't had a player come through to regularly start in the first team for years.

Koeman clearly didn't think Dowell was either ready/his type of player and if that is the case as you say he's better off in loan than on the bench all season. But tbh I'm skeptical that it is with a plan of bringing him back to the team next season. Perhaps I'm just bitter about Koeman loaning out Deulofeu!
He's 19 ffs !

City and Chelsea have far more depth to their squads than we do. If he has a good season at Forest and shows he's ready for the first team here then I'm sure he'll be in the squad next season. If he struggles at Forest, or doesn't show enough, then who knows what'll happen.

I suspect part of the reason Koeman sent Geri out on loan was he knew Barcelona were likely to exercise their option and he didn't see the point in giving him game time here if he wasn't going to be around.
 

Billy Dean

Player Valuation: £70m
He's 19 ffs !

City and Chelsea have far more depth to their squads than we do. If he has a good season at Forest and shows he's ready for the first team here then I'm sure he'll be in the squad next season. If he struggles at Forest, or doesn't show enough, then who knows what'll happen.

I suspect part of the reason Koeman sent Geri out on loan was he knew Barcelona were likely to exercise their option and he didn't see the point in giving him game time here if he wasn't going to be around.
This is my main issue with loaning out good young players, the tendency to judge them if they don't tear it up.
 
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