John Stones transfer saga

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He's gone isn't he.

If it's any less than 35M get your boo's ready for fraudster kenwright and his gang of merry carpet baggers. Anybody who still supports them or makes excuses for them after this is a disgrace.

If it's that price, EFC will have had £70M this summer to buy players with when added to the tv cash.

So far we've seen £4M go out the door.

This summer will see the Everton owners keep hold of around £40M - if we say that a total spend of £30M will be spent on fees and wages.

They have to be taken to task on that and they have to state what's happening at this football club, whereby a massive amount of cash is coming in and not going out.
 
Just get him sold and lets start buying players.

This summer really has to be the ultimate underlining of how rank Everton's owners are: they get £35M in through the door to hand to the manager like every other PL club, but they keep hold of it themselves and allow Chelsea to dictate our destiny.

Ok then: sell him and move on.

That's the way we roll at Everton, I'm afraid. There is no such thing as moving onto firmer footing with 'cash injections' from external sources like the tv deal. It disappears down the black hole along with any potentially top class players we unearth.

The problem is Dave that Chelsea are well aware of our method, just as City were all those years ago for Lescott. It's funny people attacking Martinez for not selling Stones and spending the money are the same people who had a go at Moyes for taking too long to sell Lescott.

The reality is that Chelsea know they have us over the barrel regarding Stones, as we are unable to spend until they give us the money. Why would they give us 35 million before the season starts when we allow ourselves to be portrayed as desperately as we are in the press. If I were Chelsea I'd offer 27 rising to 30 next and test our bottle out.
I'm not having a go at you, but there is no way Chelsea are going to pay us the 35 million any time soon so that plan is a bit flawed.

It annoys me beyond words. I know some will say we have held a strong stance but we really haven't. Martinez likes Moyes before him has tried to hold firm publically but has been undermined by the board who are clearly contemplating the deal. Like Moyes before him he has been sold down the river. What worries me is there was a marked change in Moyes after the Lescott affair and I really worry about Martinez suffering the same affects.

A strong board would have put this to bed a long time ago. They would have got behind their manager and made it very clear that Stones was not for sale. They'd have prepped every hack in the business that there is no way we are selling our best players and that Stones is part of an exciting group of player (Barkley, Lukaku, Deulofeu) who we have worked hard to bring through together. That he is under contract for 4 years and he will see that contract out. That when Mourinho said "all they need to say is he's not for sale" rather than him calling our bluff, we'd call his and say "he's not for sale" publically and privately to the press.

Then we would have gone out and bought Van Dijk (or whoever) and a creative number 10 player before clubs start over charging us. If then later in the window we fancied doing business with Chelsea we would re-enter negotiations, on our terms having no requirement for the money to buy players, from a position of strength.

It pains me to say it but this is what Liverpool's board did with Sterling. Unfortunately our board must be prepping the press we would consider offers of upwards of 30 million. In that context Chelsea are not going to willingly give us 35 as an act of charity. The question is, what are we going to do when they offer 28, which when we sell to Barnsley is 25. And Celtic sensing our weakness demand 15 for van Dijk, and Manchester United want 12 for Evans. Or Swansea quote 25 for Williams?
 
The problem is Dave that Chelsea are well aware of our method, just as City were all those years ago for Lescott. It's funny people attacking Martinez for not selling Stones and spending the money are the same people who had a go at Moyes for taking too long to sell Lescott.

The reality is that Chelsea know they have us over the barrel regarding Stones, as we are unable to spend until they give us the money. Why would they give us 35 million before the season starts when we allow ourselves to be portrayed as desperately as we are in the press. If I were Chelsea I'd offer 27 rising to 30 next and test our bottle out.
I'm not having a go at you, but there is no way Chelsea are going to pay us the 35 million any time soon so that plan is a bit flawed.

It annoys me beyond words. I know some will say we have held a strong stance but we really haven't. Martinez likes Moyes before him has tried to hold firm publically but has been undermined by the board who are clearly contemplating the deal. Like Moyes before him he has been sold down the river. What worries me is there was a marked change in Moyes after the Lescott affair and I really worry about Martinez suffering the same affects.

A strong board would have put this to bed a long time ago. They would have got behind their manager and made it very clear that Stones was not for sale. They'd have prepped every hack in the business that there is no way we are selling our best players and that Stones is part of an exciting group of player (Barkley, Lukaku, Deulofeu) who we have worked hard to bring through together. That he is under contract for 4 years and he will see that contract out. That when Mourinho said "all they need to say is he's not for sale" rather than him calling our bluff, we'd call his and say "he's not for sale" publically and privately to the press.

Then we would have gone out and bought Van Dijk (or whoever) and a creative number 10 player before clubs start over charging us. If then later in the window we fancied doing business with Chelsea we would re-enter negotiations, on our terms having no requirement for the money to buy players, from a position of strength.

It pains me to say it but this is what Liverpool's board did with Sterling. Unfortunately our board must be prepping the press we would consider offers of upwards of 30 million. In that context Chelsea are not going to willingly give us 35 as an act of charity. The question is, what are we going to do when they offer 28, which when we sell to Barnsley is 25. And Celtic sensing our weakness demand 15 for van Dijk, and Manchester United want 12 for Evans. Or Swansea quote 25 for Williams?

All Everton managers under Kenwright's reign will be hired because they can be trusted to go along with the policy of propping up the board. Martinez is just a better coach than Moyes as far as I'm concerned.

But yes, the way to go here would have been to go about our business and get our own players in and let others worry about whether we would sell Stones to them, not the other way around. That's what a club run on the level would do with £35M coming into the coffers: they'd use that to sit pretty.

Chelsea obviously know that the £35M coming in to Everton is not being used for player acquisition though - they know they are dealing with a board desperate to siphon off a massive amount this summer away from team spending.

IMO, the deal was done weeks ago with Stones at boardroom level. Is Martinez in on that? Who knows. I suspect not. He cant be happy with this.
 
All Everton managers under Kenwright's reign will be hired because they can be trusted to go along with the policy of propping up the board. Martinez is just a better coach than Moyes as far as I'm concerned.

But yes, the way to go here would have been to go about our business and get our own players in and let others worry about whether we would sell Stones to them, not the other way around. That's what a club run on the level would do with £35M coming into the coffers: they'd use that to sit pretty.

Chelsea obviously know that the £35M coming in to Everton is not being used for player acquisition though - they know they are dealing with a board desperate to siphon off a massive amount this summer away from team spending.

IMO, the deal was done weeks ago with Stones at boardroom level. Is Martinez in on that? Who knows. I suspect not. He cant be happy with this.

Well yes, he has always recruited managers who tend to toe the party line and don't require lots of money. While Kenwright went on about the FA Cup in true theatrical style I imagine Martinez's willingness to work under financial constraints while toeing the line was really what made his eyes light up.

Well whatever the 35 million is used for, they can see we are looking increasingly desperate for it. The fact we are not signing a replacement before Stones goes stinks of desperation. In that context they are unlikely to pay 35 million any time soon. Why not make us sweat?

On the question I would suspect not as well. If it was done though, there is a question of why it hasn't gone through? I suspect the Chelsea board have an acknowledgement from Kenwright he is willing to sell. I worry for Martinez in all of this. It's one thing expecting your manager to operate on a shoe string budget, or sell players, but it's another to take the control away from them and do it without their consent.

For Moyes I think the Lescott affair was a big turning point. We'd just been to an FA Cup Final and had the bets defensive partnership in the country. He was let down by Kenwright and the "we'll take this to the boardroom" comment from Hughes. It was humiliation. I never really felt Moyes recovered from that and basically spent most summers angrily sulking with no trust of Kenwright. People can queery his response but it would be stupid to misrepresent the causes of this. I wish he'd have broken ranks with Kenwright publically mind.

I worry that it will be a huge turning point for Martinez. To date he has kept a large amount of control over the situation. We lost Fellaini but he was quite happy with that as I think he'd have preferred McCarthy anyway. We moved on Jelavic and Heitinga so he could afford Lukaku. Clearly his plan was to develop a young core of players, give them game time and hope they become world beaters.
Selling Stones is not just losing a centre half but it's breaking with the method Martinez has tried to develop. Selling him "on the cheap" for 30 million would be a huge kick in the teeth for Martinez and I do wonder what impact it will have longer term.
 
We will probably go through managers, but we will always have that smug, phoney egomaniac in charge.

It might be the fact that Chelsea have turned his head, we will never know the truth as per usual. Can't say I blame the lad, he has a chance of winning stuff and playing in the CL, somethign he will never get at Everton.

I was looking forward to renewing my interest in football again this season, don't think I can be bothered with it anymore, it's not worth the interest.
 
Well yes, he has always recruited managers who tend to toe the party line and don't require lots of money. While Kenwright went on about the FA Cup in true theatrical style I imagine Martinez's willingness to work under financial constraints while toeing the line was really what made his eyes light up.

Well whatever the 35 million is used for, they can see we are looking increasingly desperate for it. The fact we are not signing a replacement before Stones goes stinks of desperation. In that context they are unlikely to pay 35 million any time soon. Why not make us sweat?

On the question I would suspect not as well. If it was done though, there is a question of why it hasn't gone through? I suspect the Chelsea board have an acknowledgement from Kenwright he is willing to sell. I worry for Martinez in all of this. It's one thing expecting your manager to operate on a shoe string budget, or sell players, but it's another to take the control away from them and do it without their consent.

For Moyes I think the Lescott affair was a big turning point. We'd just been to an FA Cup Final and had the bets defensive partnership in the country. He was let down by Kenwright and the "we'll take this to the boardroom" comment from Hughes. It was humiliation. I never really felt Moyes recovered from that and basically spent most summers angrily sulking with no trust of Kenwright. People can queery his response but it would be stupid to misrepresent the causes of this. I wish he'd have broken ranks with Kenwright publically mind.

I worry that it will be a huge turning point for Martinez. To date he has kept a large amount of control over the situation. We lost Fellaini but he was quite happy with that as I think he'd have preferred McCarthy anyway. We moved on Jelavic and Heitinga so he could afford Lukaku. Clearly his plan was to develop a young core of players, give them game time and hope they become world beaters.
Selling Stones is not just losing a centre half but it's breaking with the method Martinez has tried to develop. Selling him "on the cheap" for 30 million would be a huge kick in the teeth for Martinez and I do wonder what impact it will have longer term.
The Stones deal: for me, Martinez has been on board with this - it's just that he's not bargained for the delay. He's said from the off he'll do business late on but maybe felt the bidding process would start in the late £20Ms and quickly reach mid £30Ms - hence his frustration.

He's fallen into a trap here, because the board couldn't give a monkeys what Martinez's schedule is, they're more than happy to take this to the wire as it also means less of the incoming Stones cash is spent. It's win-win-win for the board: taking all the tv cash; selling Stones to fund incoming players; saving some of that cash for themselves.

This is what happens when you have a bunch of ruthless carpet baggers running a club.
 
Oh ffs I thought we were done with this rs.

If we sell stones I have no doubt we could sign 2 or 3 very good players, improve the squad overall and have a better season as a result.
Reckon a lot of our fans would take this.

What that'd say to me though is that, over the medium term, we have 0 ambitions of ever becoming a top club again in our current form.
Players of stones' quality are the difference and once they're gone they can't be replaced.
What are we gonna do, sign Varane?

Massive decision this and I think it'll tell us a lot about how our club sees itself over the next 5 years or so.
God I hope he stays.
 
Oh ffs I thought we were done with this rs.

If we sell stones I have no doubt we could sign 2 or 3 very good players, improve the squad overall and have a better season as a result.
Reckon a lot of our fans would take this.

What that'd say to me though is that, over the medium term, we have 0 ambitions of ever becoming a top club again in our current form.
Players of stones' quality are the difference and once they're gone they can't be replaced.
What are we gonna do, sign Varane?

Massive decision this and I think it'll tell us a lot about how our club sees itself over the next 5 years or so.
God I hope he stays.

It would also show that once again in the richest era of football when all other clubs including Newcastle, West Ham, palace, Leicester and everyone else are spending money the board will invest £0 and use player sales. Everyone gets excited about TV money we shouldn't as it never gets spent.
 
Tbf Martinez did say something along the lines of "it's good experience for John to be able to cope with outside interest and to have a big season (along with Ross and Rom)

That just says to me he won't go unless we are offered silly money which we all knew in the first place.
 
He shouldn't be for sale AT ANY PRICE this close to the start of the season. If Chelsea bid something stupid we can start negotiating from there in a years time.

I agree with this.

A month ago, take an offer you can't refuse.

There was time then to act sensibly in the market.

Today, with the season a mere 50 hours away, we can't afford the dispruption selling one of our two centre backs will bring.

And another thing.......what if we have a poor start to the season in the first four games before the window closes?

And we are loitering near or even in the bottom three?

I really think there will be real discontent in the stands at Goodison and the atmosphere will become poisonous if we sell a crucial member of the squad.

No, IMO the curtain should be brought down on this sorry saga right here and now.

Chelsea should be told we are not doing business right now and John should be told he is going nowhere this season but if he wants away next summer he can go.

Imagine Bobby (or whoever is in charge next summer, I don't think it will be Bob) had the money at the end of May and the whole summer to invest it.

That is what EFC need to be aiming at right now.
 
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