Match Thread Everton v Manchester United - Preview, Match Report and MotM Poll

[ToffeeDan]

Obviously I am biased about the decision going against us but I still can't see where the Clear and Obvious application of the laws demanded an offside call to refuse a goal

Take one thing at a time.

Was GS fouled?

Was he active?

Did he interfere?

Did Maguire play the ball?

Was De Gea affected by GS?

And in what order does all this mess require the laws to be applied


In other words

Was it a penalty?

Is getting out of the way of the ball still active (when, for example, not touching a through ball and (say) putting your hands in the air to signal non participation when you know you are obviously offside is NEVER ruled as active)

Is GS in the line of sight of a keeper who is not correctly positioned to save a shot (it's hardly a matter for a referee to decide if a keeper has made a mistake)

 

[maccavennie]

Also, big shout out to Michael Keane for that shot leathered right into the family enclosure.

Was that when he was trying to do a crossfield ball 2nd half?

Before the game started and the players were doing their final drills, just before he walked off he tried a shot from about 40 yards out and absolutely ballooned it into the street end. As soon as he hit it he knew. It was a donkeys effort and turned and walked away as if it wasn't him

 

[evisublue]

I don’t disagree with you, but if it was that cut and dry, you’d have thought Carlo or the players would have protested it. None of them did.

For me, it’s one of the many comings together you see in Football where a defender attempts to block a shot, fails and the follow through takes the player. The officials probably looked at it as, it’s not prevented a goalscoring opportunity, it’s not hindered the player shooting as the coming together was afterward.

Perhaps if the players protested at all, they might have got it reviewed.

Ironically, the foul resulted in Siggy being on his arse and ended up costing us a goal.. Don't think he's in the position he ended up in if Wan-Bissaka doesn't wipe him out.

 

[blueconverse]

Hope cavanagh gets arse worms

 

[Tipp blue]

Here's part of a report from Liverpool v Spurs last season, swap the players names to those from today and ask how different it was.. the ref for this game was Moss who was VAR today.
"When Dele Alli plays the ball forward there is no doubt that Kane is in an offside position, but he does not receive it from that pass. Liverpool defender Dejan Lovren made a deliberate, but poor, attempt to play the ball. As he made contact with the ball that essentially creates a new phase of play and Kane is now onside"
Here's the full article https://www.espn.com/soccer/blog/es...tottenham-have-had-two-penalties-at-liverpool

 

[Amw79]

Was that when he was trying to do a crossfield ball 2nd half?

Before the game started and the players were doing their final drills, just before he walked off he tried a shot from about 40 yards out and absolutely ballooned it into the street end. As soon as he hit it he knew. It was a donkeys effort and turned and walked away as if it wasn't him

Yeah, early in the second half. Under no pressure, properly hammered it cross-field right into the family enclosure.

It went over the line 20 yards away from the nearest blue shirt.

 

[maccavennie]

DCL.

Great performance.....very Graeme Sharp like.

I actually typed the exact same thing before and deleted it K as I knew it would be quite a bold statement to make.

But he was very Sharp like today, was very physical, won every ball, brought others into play and mote importantly when he did lay it off, he didn't admire the pass and stand there, he was straight into an arc and heading into the danger zone.

I thought it was a bad miss at 1st (the one on one after 5 minutes) but it was a top drawer save. He led the line superbly though, deserved to be on the winning side.

 

[MiserableBlue]

I agree with aspects of the second point because as you said the game isn't going to be replayed and the decision cannot be overturned - it's history now.

Nevertheless, the situation we have now where officiating in this country, including VAR, is inconsistent at best and certain clubs almost certainly still benefit...

... from a bias (concious or unconscious) will remain the precedent if people sit on their hands and do not make a fuss. Personally, I do not like the status quo!

Before the game, we were talking about how German fans are very vocal and active about decision in the game, and they will make their feelings heard.

I wish there was more of that here.

Agree with points here

I personally don't think its outright corruption, probably more an unconscious bias towards certain other clubs/teams.

As regards the level of officiating, you could go back decades and make valid points against lots of officials. So how would we want standards to improve? What kind of measures should be undertaken?

I think being a referee is pretty much a lose/lose kind of career. Damned all the time, and certainly not helped by some referees who think/thought the match is all about them.

What do the Germans do? What kind of measures are introduced as a result?

 

[evertony]

Literally nobody other than you I've seen is claiming a foul.

You’re not looking hard enough then

 

[maccavennie]

Yeah, early in the second half. Under no pressure, properly hammered it cross-field right into the family enclosure.

It went over the line 20 yards away from the nearest blue shirt.

Yep it was shocking wasn't it! I didn't know if that was the worst or Walcotts ball 2nd half (I was direct in line) where

A) there was no Everton player even close to getting it
B) There were 2 utd players in the path of the pass
C) even if he had evaded the 1st player (which he didn't) it was so under hit it would have pea rolled to the 2jd utd player anyway
D) B & C don't even count because of A

 

[larbert toffee]

To be fair, Keane loves dogs...

He loves his own dogs I'll give you that one.

 

[Ballly]

what a s...t end to a s..t week! agenda "get the red devils into CL at any cost" in full effect it seems

 

[TheBigIguana]

All the rules experts on twitter can do one. They're all arguing that when a guy is in the field of vision it impacts decision making so it is offside. And maybe the rule should be interpreted that way. But it isn't. The rule is interpreted very narrowly all the time. Players are in the general area of passes and crosses all the time, which impacts the decision making of defenders, and it is rarely if ever given offside. But in this moment we are supposed to go from the narrow interpretation to the broadest possible one? That's absolute horse crap.

 

[PhilM]

What do the Germans do? What kind of measures are introduced as a result?

Back in 2018, the Bundesliga introduced Monday night games for television reasons, which fans’ groups vehemently disagreed with on a number of levels.

They organised many protests and it was scrapped. Only recently, they’ve tried to introduce it as there’s been further protests from the fans.

This was the Frankfurt game last week...

In unison, the club and fans organised for a stand to be completely empty, whereas other clubs have done similar things: stayed away; disruption of games.

They believe in something, so they do something about it: just look at the ongoing issues with the Hoffenheim owner from numerous fan groups.

With regards to officiating here, we’ll I’d start by dismantling parts of the PGMOL, so it’s not the self-protecting, egoistical union (private club) it is now.

It’s currently a closed shop that nigh-on regulates itself, hence why officials are retained even though they’re consistently below an acceptable standard.

If there was accountability and transparency, I suspect they’d get their act together pretty darn quickly: VAR shown in grounds; audio not secretive.

 

[meagher94]

Don’t think I’ve ever felt this disheartened with football.