Current Affairs EU In or Out

[Clint Planet]

This is dreadful, but we are all different mate. Don't paint every leave supporter with the same brush otherwise you become no better than the racists .........

Pete, I've always had time for you because, even though we often disagree, your views aren't framed by prejudice and an unwillingness to see what's actually going on. You look at events with open eyes and and open mind and even if you interpret it differently to me, you're not a hate-monger - and I respect you for that.

 

[Old Blue 2]

do we live in a parliamentary democracy or not?
the judges verdict was the only logical one.

Go read the post of mine you have quoted again, and check out my post on page 780.

To answer your above two sentences:
1. If you think we live in a parliamentary democracy, think again. We live in an elected dictatorship, where the party with the overall majority calls the shots (unless a particular issue is of such a nature that an 'open' vote is declared by a party or parties).
2. The Judges's verdict was not the only logical one...

 

[Whistlin' Dixie]

do we live in a parliamentary democracy or not?
the judges verdict was the only logical one.

Democracy starts and stops with the electorate. Not MP's voted in by them.

 

[peteblue]

Glad to see you acknowledging - unlike Pandy - that it goes on. I never said it wasn't an issue beforehand - just that it has escalated since brexit because certain meatheads obviously feel empowered by the vote.

So far brexit has gained us an increase in "British people embarrassing the nation with their moronic tosserishness," a loss of respect abroad and a nosedive in the value of the Pound. Still waiting for the "Taking back control" (of, erm, summat or other....) and the Jam and scones on Formby Beach on a sweltering July day.

It works both ways though Clint. I have an opinion of why we should leave, and I fully believe it. Another 17.4 Million people have their views, but we have all been painted as either racists, idiots, not knowing what we are doing, little englanders, or uneducated morons. Well I'm none of those, and millions more are probably not either. Respect has to be a two way street......

 

[roydo]

We live in an elected dictatorship, where the party with the overall majority calls the shots

Er, doesnt every democracy do that?

 

[mightymoyes]

Go read the post of mine you have quoted again, and check out my post on page 780.

To answer your above two sentences:
1. If you think we live in a parliamentary democracy, think again. We live in an elected dictatorship, where the party with the overall majority calls the shots (unless a particular issue is of such a nature that an 'open' vote is declared by a party or parties).
2. The Judges's verdict was not the only logical one...

i agree with you on this point.
to listen to some of the rabid right wing press you'd think brexit was no longer happening. it is but just now there might be some over sight on the 3 simpletons johnson, davies and fox

 

[Old Blue 2]

They gave their expert, informed, impartial opinion that Parliament is the sovereign body in this land and so should not be subverted by a government who want to act on glorified - non-binding - opinion poll (even though said government has no idea how to do so).

It is rather troubling that a national newspaper should label them "Enemies of the People" on its front page for doing so. As if Murdoch and the Mail have "the people's" best interests at heart.

Can't you see what's going on here? This is Fascism.

Ah, you've changed from 'upholding the law of the land' to 'opinion' Which is exactly what they sdaid in their judgement: "...In our opinion..."

'Subverted'? It was a case of the Government, acting on the outcome of the referendum, proceeding with the business of untying the knots of the EU from us. All the Judges's opinion said was that it should be discussed (and no doubt voted upon) in Parliament first. The matter now enteres further legal submissions and judgement(s) on the next higher rung of the judicial chain. That's all.

 

[Clint Planet]

It works both ways though Clint. I have an opinion of why we should leave, and I fully believe it. Another 17.4 Million people have their views, but we have all been painted as either racists, idiots, not knowing what we are doing, little englanders, or uneducated morons. Well I'm none of those, and millions more are probably not either. Respect has to be a two way street......

I'm sorry, Pete, but noting that Brexit seems to have resulted in an increase in racist/xenophobic incidents is not to say that every brexiteer is like that. I do admit, though, to pointing it out with every hope that brexiteers feel ever so slightly sheepish and less inclined to want to leave the EU since I think it's a factor that must be weighed up in the pros and cons and I think it has come as quite a surprise to some.

 

[mightymoyes]

Democracy starts and stops with the electorate. Not MP's voted in by them.

sorry mate we dont live in a direct democracy.
i thought most of the brexiters (the non racists) voted out because they wanted parliament to be sovereign and not the EU. ironic theyre so upset the judges have declared parliament is sovereign in this case.

 

[Old Blue 2]

Er, doesnt every democracy do that?

Bingo, roydo! Got it in one!

And if I may say so, we do look quite sane compared to over-the-pond at the moment!!!

 

[Moomin]

Ok I'll spell it out (before I go to bed).

Where's the 'outrage' from the homosexual community? From the openly gay, pro-EU MP's? From Elton John? Where's the mass picketing of the paper from these peole, that's been reported in other papers or on Tv?

As I said. Those openly gay, pro EU MP's will be in that comic, promoting their tory idealogies once more, pretty soon.

Do you think the judges what hear the case in the supreme court will take any notice of what's written in some rag? Or will they take the pertinent facts into account? I'll go for the latter meself, and like them judges, won't concern meself with what some rag publishes - whether I agree with them about leaving the EU or not.

Mate, keep your homophobic views to yourself please.

 

[Clint Planet]

Democracy starts and stops with the electorate. Not MP's voted in by them.

That simply isn't true. The electorate choose MPs who then get on with legislating and governing - and even that's an vastly-oversimplified version of reality.

 

[dandydan]

You're embarrassing yourself now, Dandy-Pandy. Stop, for heaven's sake! Have some dignity.

[Nobody called me a n****** yesterday so racism must be a myth, etc.....blah...blah........]

Ok m8.

 

[The Esk]

2. The Judges's verdict was not the only logical one..

It was entirely logical and substantiated by case law and statute. - Zamora, Burma Oil Co, the Case of Proclamations and others, the Bill of Rights and of course, the ECA 1972.

 

[dandydan]

I dont think its quite that mate, but in my experience, some, and it is a small some, feel emboldened to make comments, to me, a delivery driver, that I havnt heard until recently.

Not at me, I hasten to add, but about lads who do the same job.

Find it quite ugly.

Should parliment block brexit then it'll really get nasty.