Current Affairs EU In or Out

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Bruce Wayne said:
It should also be remembered that AZ didn't even apply for EMA approval until January. They've been an utter shambles.
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They’ve been sloppy from top to bottom through all this as a pharma company and partner. It’s such a huge pity because Oxford is a great vaccine.

Maybe that’s the problem the Oxford vaccine, is to good and too big for AZ.

There was a dramatic turn around last summer in Oxford and who they would be teaming up with, I’ve heard a few political conspiracies on that. But I won’t go in them now or @peteblue will be chasing me around the forum with today’s daily Telegraph for the rest of the night.
 
Neiler said:
It relates to the UK in that UK plants are named in the EU contract as part of its supply chain and are not exporting as per contractual agreements. If the EU interpret their vaccine contracts differently tomorrow and stop exporting vaccine from the EU, the UK and you will obviously feel like you have a grievance with the EU, no point saying you wouldn’t. Thats why your spending have the day fretting over an export ban and saying how evil the EU is.
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If the EU wishes to ban the export of vaccines to the U.K., they already have the wherewithal to do so. And the U.K. has the wherewithal to ban the export of components to Pfizer. This is not the issue. The issue is one of stealing the manufacturing assets of a company and stealing the IPR in order to manufacture AZ product for the EU. That is illegal, unless they enact their ‘wartime’ clause, then suffer worldwide reputational vilification.

I am not fretting over any ban from the EU, because it looks like we are over the majority of any input from Europe and now have it in our own hands regarding the vaccines. In fact I love the idea of the EU doing precisely what you think they should do, because that will cement our withdrawal from this bureaucratic nonsense and will put a halt to Remainer voices. The U.K. and it’s people cannot lose here, the only ones that lose are the EU body itself and the poor souls in Europe who may lose their lives for the Political benefit of VDL and Macron......
 
Bruce Wayne said:
It should also be remembered that AZ didn't even apply for EMA approval until January. They've been an utter shambles.
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It was only approved here in its country of origin for emergency use on the 30th of December, general use was from jan 5th and roll out end of the month , the EU which has totally different licensing bodies said it was safe on the 29th of jan.
Not much in it really
 
peteblue said:
If the EU wishes to ban the export of vaccines to the U.K., they already have the wherewithal to do so. And the U.K. has the wherewithal to ban the export of components to Pfizer. This is not the issue. The issue is one of stealing the manufacturing assets of a company and stealing the IPR in order to manufacture AZ product for the EU. That is illegal, unless they enact their ‘wartime’ clause, then suffer worldwide reputational vilification.

I am not fretting over any ban from the EU, because it looks like we are over the majority of any input from Europe and now have it in our own hands regarding the vaccines. In fact I love the idea of the EU doing precisely what you think they should do, because that will cement our withdrawal from this bureaucratic nonsense and will put a halt to Remainer voices. The U.K. and it’s people cannot lose here, the only ones that lose are the EU body itself and the poor souls in Europe who may lose their lives for the Political benefit of VDL and Macron......
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Do you think In the scenario you suggest, the U.K. should stop importing vaccine from the EU morally then?

As you suggest the U.K. have more then enough vaccine being produced domestically and don’t need to import!
 
peteblue said:
I am unaware that they have even submitted it for approval.....
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The yanks have an order for 300 million once approved.
that fella with the glasses , Dr death that used to be on tv till Trump got rid of him was on the radio the other day says it's normal for approval to take longer over there and there was nothing abnormal about the time scale.
saying that would be surprised if the yanks used there own due to the current American first mantra and the power of there massive pharmaceutical companies.
 
edge said:
The yanks have an order for 300 million once approved.
that fella with the glasses , Dr death that used to be on tv till Trump got rid of him was on the radio the other day says it's normal for approval to take longer over there and there was nothing abnormal about the time scale.
saying that would be surprised if the yanks used there own due to the current American first mantra and the power of there massive pharmaceutical companies.
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To be fair to them the sent some of their AZ supply to Mexico and Canada last week, it was only sitting in a shelf in the states. That said it’s in their interest to have their closest neighbours doing well with their vaccine rollout!
 
Neiler said:
Do you think In the scenario you suggest, the U.K. should stop importing vaccine from the EU morally then?

As you suggest the U.K. have more then enough vaccine being produced domestically and don’t need to import!
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Not at all, I think contracts should be honoured. If the U.K. then decides to donate vaccines that legally belong to them elsewhere then fair enough. If the U.K. decides to inoculate its own population even quicker then that is a decision for the U.K.

This has the potential to ruin any future relationship between the U.K. and the Eu for the sake of saving the jobs of VDL and Macron.

But hopefully it will spur the U.K. on to put in place anything that the Eu could hold over us in the future and it will have the full backing of the U.K. population. Liz Truss is doing a great job signing up FTA’s around the world and most of the world will be happy trading with us. The focus for the U.K. will shift to the West, Asia and towards the Commonwealth. It will take time, but we can do it....
 
peteblue said:
Not at all, I think contracts should be honoured. If the U.K. then decides to donate vaccines that legally belong to them elsewhere then fair enough. If the U.K. decides to inoculate its own population even quicker then that is a decision for the U.K.

This has the potential to ruin any future relationship between the U.K. and the Eu for the sake of saving the jobs of VDL and Macron.

But hopefully it will spur the U.K. on to put in place anything that the Eu could hold over us in the future and it will have the full backing of the U.K. population. Liz Truss is doing a great job signing up FTA’s around the world and most of the world will be happy trading with us. The focus for the U.K. will shift to the West, Asia and towards the Commonwealth. It will take time, but we can do it....
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Am I right in that your position is that lawful right is absolute in interpretation of contract. You recognise the UK has a lawful right not to export any vaccine it feels is theirs and accept any vaccine import they believe is contractually theirs.

So if the EU interprets it’s contracts are in breach in supply, de facto you are happy enough in terms of equity of applied said principle that the EU has the right to stop exporting them.

Is there a land bridge between the UK AZ supply through Europe mate?

That’s a long way for us to get around to taking up that position of equality in a new normal.
 
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Found this on the contracts, throws a bit of light on the différance in the contacts.

The other reason lies in the differing nature of the contracts drawn up between AstraZeneca and these two buyers. It was the former Belgian PM and strongly Euro-federalist leader of the European Parliament's Brexit Steering Group, Guy Verhofstadt, who has spelt this out most clearly.

He examined the two contracts and observed: 'Unlike the EU, the UK contract has an additional article stating that AstraZeneca 'shall not enter into any agreement with any foreign government. . . That would by its terms conflict with AZ's obligation hereunder'.'

And Verhofstadt also pointed out: 'The EU contract is based on an 'estimated time schedule', full stop. In the British contract, by contrast, there is a precisely described procedure to guarantee a timely delivery of doses.'
Looks like the UK are in the front of the pack for the French made Valneva vaccine, after putting in £98 million up front, the chairman has said they took the risk to get it up and running and its only natural they get the vaccine first, Macron will be spitting feathers over that one.
 
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