Current Affairs EU In or Out

In or Out

  • In

    Votes: 688 67.9%

  • Out

    Votes: 325 32.1%
  • Total voters
    1,013
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Jebus_lives said:
Stating what you want and hope for is not what you should expect from a negotiation.

Areas of compromise, commonality and mutual benefit have not been mentioned. There isn't really a 'simple trade deal' when you have to unravel 40 years worth of integration.

What sovereignty are we willing to give up for example - every trade deal reduces a countries Sovereignty, but we don't know what the UK is willing to compromise on.

Fishing, another contentious area - again, where are we willing to compromise, what is acceptable to the UK?

Everything is demanding, defensive and EU phobic in our dealings to the point where we are willing to spite ourselves to not be willing to find middle ground.
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Yeah I agree with a lot of that. I would add that negotiation and compromise is a two way thing. In truth we know very little about what has been discussed so far and what concessions either side have made.

But that doesn't change the fact that the bit of your original post that I highlighted was an incorrect statement.
 
Hickson9 said:
In a time of a global pandemic and the worst economic hit in the history of the country, we are about to sever all trade agreements with the entire continent we are a part of.

It is a disaster.
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Yeah. You can't help feeling Johnson dug a massive hole for himself, not to mention the country, by insisting early on that there will be no extension to the transition period. Given the financial, health and logistical nightmare brought about by the covid pandemic, both here and around Europe, it just made sense to be able to park Brexit to concentrate on the more immediate demands.

We're now in a situation whereby we are 3 weeks away from the deadline, and not only are we still in negotiations, but logistically we clearly aren't ready for the reality of Brexit, whether we have a deal or not.
 
Barnfred 55 said:
Yeah I agree with a lot of that. I would add that negotiation and compromise is a two way thing. In truth we know very little about what has been discussed so far and what concessions either side have made.

But that doesn't change the fact that the bit of your original post that I highlighted was an incorrect statement.
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Whatever makes you happy.
 
Barnfred 55 said:
Yeah. You can't help feeling Johnson dug a massive hole for himself, not to mention the country, by insisting early on that there will be no extension to the transition period. Given the financial, health and logistical nightmare brought about by the covid pandemic, both here and around Europe, it just made sense to be able to park Brexit to concentrate on the more immediate demands.

We're now in a situation whereby we are 3 weeks away from the deadline, and not only are we still in negotiations, but logistically we clearly aren't ready for the reality of Brexit, whether we have a deal or not.
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It makes sense from every aspect other than the internal Tory political aspect, which unfortunately is the one that dominates all others.
 
Barnfred 55 said:
Yeah. You can't help feeling Johnson dug a massive hole for himself, not to mention the country, by insisting early on that there will be no extension to the transition period. Given the financial, health and logistical nightmare brought about by the covid pandemic, both here and around Europe, it just made sense to be able to park Brexit to concentrate on the more immediate demands.

We're now in a situation whereby we are 3 weeks away from the deadline, and not only are we still in negotiations, but logistically we clearly aren't ready for the reality of Brexit, whether we have a deal or not.
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What would be the point?
 
Jebus_lives said:
What would be the point?
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Maybe none as regards the trade deal. Who knows really?. They could negotiate for years and not come to an agreement. But even if it just gave more time to sort out some of the logistics of Brexit. We seemingly here new things almost ever day about this and that not being ready.
 
Barnfred 55 said:
Maybe none as regards the trade deal. Who knows really?. They could negotiate for years and not come to an agreement. But even if it just gave more time to sort out some of the logistics of Brexit. We seemingly here new things almost ever day about this and that not being ready.
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We wan't to take back control... Part of taking back control is not relying on EU laws. The Government have had plenty of time to put arrangements in place - if they aren't ready it's on them. And if businesses, and a country, which overwhelmingly put it's trust in this Government to bring certainty and prosperity aren't getting the advice they need from Government other than 'get ready!' then it's on them too.
 
Barnfred 55 said:
Well do so then :)

Why are you asking me I'm not on the negotiations team?.
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Because they represent your interests and mine. I've no idea, but then I couldn't see the point.

What do you want - what would your advice to the negotiating team be?

Take back control of our laws - which ones?

More fleet of foot - to do what?

Trade globally - on what terms?

Free ourselves to be Sovereign - so what parts of it are we giving up as part of our trade deals?

What is our actual strategy other than to moan 'we want this and the EU are bullying us because they won't give us what we want?'

The floor is yours...
 
Jebus_lives said:
We wan't to take back control... Part of taking back control is not relying on EU laws. The Government have had plenty of time to put arrangements in place - if they aren't ready it's on them. And if businesses, and a country, which overwhelmingly put it's trust in this Government to bring certainty and prosperity aren't getting the advice they need from Government other than 'get ready!' then it's on them too.
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Nobody is saying it isn't on them. They re the government so it stops with them. It's why I used the actual words "Johnson has dug a hole for himself"

But the fact is they aren't ready. For whatever reason, or whoevers fault, the country isn't ready so I'm saying it would have been better to have delayed the transition period.

If you don't agree that's your call.
 
Barnfred 55 said:
Nobody is saying it isn't on them. They re the government so it stops with them. It's why I used the actual words "Johnson has dug a hole for himself"

But the fact is they aren't ready. For whatever reason, or whoevers fault, the country isn't ready so I'm saying it would have been better to have delayed the transition period.

If you don't agree that's your call.
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He was voted in overwhelmingly to 'get Brexit done'. It'll get done one way or the other...

Promises of an 'oven ready deal' and a 'great deal with the EU' and 'failure of statecraft' make it sound easy so no need to make preparations now...

Not even sure why we are even talking about 'preparations' when they should've been made as part of the WA knowing the clock was ticking - perhaps hubris got the better of the Government.

Either way - we all knew what we voted for and we all want Brexit done, so no need for kicking the can further and being subject to EU laws beyond December...rejoice
 
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