Current Affairs EU In or Out

[bring back the catt]

That could be applied to any administration. It seems to have been consigned to history just how bad the policies were under Cameron. Brexit is a catchall distraction that many are taking advantage of, including Trump ffs. I've mentioned earlier that regardless of the result those who make money would continue to do so and they're pullingvthe strings as ever.

Too many are confusing patriotism for racism.
What is wrong with wishing to maintain ones heritage?
Many people in more stabilised countries around the world are frightened that the dilution of their heritage will ultimately lead to dissolution of their national identity. The worry is, if that happened, then they will all become just the same as the countries where the people are attempting to leave. Where is the sense in that
All that would do is make every country become the same as the country which people don't want to live in.

I am a patriot, and I am not a racist, and firmly believe in an INTEGRATED multinational society.
I have innumerable friends situated around our fair Isles who are of differing origins and beliefs, and they are more afraid this will happen than I am, as most (like Mr. Moshiri), had to leave their homelands due to religious fanaticism.

And that, magicjuan, is where you correctly state, that with uncertainty regarding future safeguards relating national security, the manipulation of power and wealth will only become stronger.
That, in turn, would create an even larger barrier between those who 'have', and the majority who' don't have'.
Why? because that is what the wealthy want, and that is where the wealthy wish to take us, and that is where the wealthy wish us to be. Unsure, and vulnerable, and too often fighting amongst ourselves, and distracting us from what is being done to achieve this, as covertly as they can.

 

[bring back the catt]

I think the free movement of goods, services, ideas, culture and people is a very good thing, yes.

There is nothing wrong with the ideology of all you mention. They flounder, however, when there aren't proper and workable controls in place to ensure they will not be taken advantage of.
The unscrupulous are not confined to the categories of the poor or uneducated though, as more wealth is denied by those with wealth.
The damage the latter category create is far more damaging, as it encourages resentment and promotes dissension.

 

[dandydan]

I still can't see 1) what it is about free movement of people you are so against, and 2) what will change in the future.

The points you made against movement of people were all debunked by @Bruce Wayne, and I'm sure you knew most of what he wrote before he posted it. Increased risk of terrorism? It's scare-mongering at its worst.

Free movement of people has made Sweden the rape capital of the western world.

 

[obc]

EU OUT!

of course I live in Mercosur country.

 

[Seanjd]

Free movement of people has made Sweden the rape capital of the western world.

The Swedish police record each instance of sexual violence in every case separately, leading to an inflated number of cases compared to other countries.[231][234][238]Sweden also has a comparatively wide definition of rape.[231][232][233] This means that more sexual crimes are registered as rape than in most other countries.[232] For example, in 2005 Sweden reformed its sex crime legislation and made the legal definition of rape much wider,[231][239][240][241] which led to a marked increase in reports.[242][243]

This, along with the % of EU nationals being lower in Sweden than in the UK, for example, suggests that you are wrong.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

There is nothing wrong with the ideology of all you mention. They flounder, however, when there aren't proper and workable controls in place to ensure they will not be taken advantage of.
The unscrupulous are not confined to the categories of the poor or uneducated though, as more wealth is denied by those with wealth.
The damage the latter category create is far more damaging, as it encourages resentment and promotes dissension.

With respect, that's the kind of statement I expect to hear from our politicians because they're never held to account for anything they say. They're allowed free reign to say what they like because no-one has the diligence to ask them to prove it.

So I'll ask you as I asked Orchard previously. Where is the evidence for what you say? I would much rather talk in facts and evidence than rhetoric.

 

[bring back the catt]

With respect, that's the kind of statement I expect to hear from our politicians because they're never held to account for anything they say. They're allowed free reign to say what they like because no-one has the diligence to ask them to prove it.

So I'll ask you as I asked Orchard previously. Where is the evidence for what you say? I would much rather talk in facts and evidence than rhetoric.

Absolutely correct, Bruce. Too much conjecture etc.
However, any evidence I may or may not possess is totally confidential.
Anybody can make a quite damning statement without means of proof, which is incorrect. Just as I know anybody can make a statement stating they are unwilling to show evidence in order to duck a contentious issue, which is also incorrect. But it would be better, for me I grant you, if I did not adhere to your request.
What I would say is, as I am unwilling to endorse my post with fact, would it be more appropriate if my original post was deleted from this thread.
Also, my apologies for taking so long to reply.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

Absolutely correct, Bruce. Too much conjecture etc.
However, any evidence I may or may not possess is totally confidential.
Anybody can make a quite damning statement without means of proof, which is incorrect. Just as I know anybody can make a statement stating they are unwilling to show evidence in order to duck a contentious issue, which is also incorrect. But it would be better, for me I grant you, if I did not adhere to your request.
What I would say is, as I am unwilling to endorse my post with fact, would it be more appropriate if my original post was deleted from this thread.
Also, my apologies for taking so long to reply.

Oh no, that won't be necessary. We're just a bunch of blokes chewing the fat after all Oh, and no need to apologise for the speed of reply, we all have lives so no one is held to account on here.

 

[bring back the catt]

Oh no, that won't be necessary. We're just a bunch of blokes chewing the fat after all Oh, and no need to apologise for the speed of reply, we all have lives so no one is held to account on here.

Thank you for your understanding.

 

[Joey66]

Free movement of people has made Sweden the rape capital of the western world.

Yes on a TV debate the other night a well paid job in Sweden is a six hour day great pay too!

 

[JimmyJeffers]

Free movement of people has made Sweden the rape capital of the western world.

jesus christ! Haven't looked at this thread in a while then get hit with this! Have a word with yourself

 

[Aqui1a]

It's funny how Sweden is always the country being used as a tool for thinly-veiled racism, isn't it..? I've noticed this sort of language is rife within the rabid, dangerous and very much non-self-aware alt-right movement. I desperately hope Trump loses so this 'movement' finally starts to recede back into obscurity.

 

[dandydan]

The Swedish police record each instance of sexual violence in every case separately, leading to an inflated number of cases compared to other countries.[231][234][238]Sweden also has a comparatively wide definition of rape.[231][232][233] This means that more sexual crimes are registered as rape than in most other countries.[232] For example, in 2005 Sweden reformed its sex crime legislation and made the legal definition of rape much wider,[231][239][240][241] which led to a marked increase in reports.[242][243]

This, along with the % of EU nationals being lower in Sweden than in the UK, for example, suggests that you are wrong.

Oh thanks for that. I mean there's no way a police force might be tempted to cover up such a thing, right? If they did the press would surely expose it!
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/775235c8-b834-11e5-bf7e-8a339b6f2164.html?siteedition=uk#axzz4IUNaiKpn
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/01/12/world/europe/swedish-police-coverup-sexual-assault.html?_r=0
http://www.spectator.co.uk/2016/01/...ks-by-migrant-men-swedens-record-is-shameful/

Top tip of the day. Question everything!

 

[dandydan]

It's funny how Sweden is always the country being used as a tool for thinly-veiled racism, isn't it..? I've noticed this sort of language is rife within the rabid, dangerous and very much non-self-aware alt-right movement. I desperately hope Trump loses so this 'movement' finally starts to recede back into obscurity.

You never knew the alt right existed until crooked Hilary mentioned it.

 

[dandydan]

jesus christ! Haven't looked at this thread in a while then get hit with this! Have a word with yourself

Google is your friend.
Try to question what you have been told.