Current Affairs EU In or Out

In or Out

  • In

    Votes: 688 67.9%
  • Out

    Votes: 325 32.1%

  • Total voters
    1,013
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craig oliver in his book unleashing demons said that the remain campaign had no answer to the immigration situation that the leave campaign was focusing on.

TBF the Remain campaign legitimised a lot of that by banging on about immigration too - Tom Watson went around saying we could restrict EU migration, for instance.

If they’d emphasised the benefits most people recognised- ie: that they themselves could easily go on holiday to the EU, go and live in Spain or France, marry some ridiculously attractive Greek goddess without problems and so on then immigration wouldn’t have been half the problem it was.
 
TBF the Remain campaign legitimised a lot of that by banging on about immigration too - Tom Watson went around saying we could restrict EU migration, for instance.

If they’d emphasised the benefits most people recognised- ie: that they themselves could easily go on holiday to the EU, go and live in Spain or France, marry some ridiculously attractive Greek god without problems and so on then immigration wouldn’t have been half the problem it was.

Who could you possibly mean?

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TBF the Remain campaign legitimised a lot of that by banging on about immigration too - Tom Watson went around saying we could restrict EU migration, for instance.

If they’d emphasised the benefits most people recognised- ie: that they themselves could easily go on holiday to the EU, go and live in Spain or France, marry some ridiculously attractive Greek goddess without problems and so on then immigration wouldn’t have been half the problem it was.
Yeah I’ve always thought this. Think though that the subject had become so toxic that they felt taking that route would cause a total implosion. Instead they helped foster the growing resentment by not taking a hardline opposition. Their message was muddled at best
 
Yeah I’ve always thought this. Think though that the subject had become so toxic that they felt taking that route would cause a total implosion. Instead they helped foster the growing resentment by not taking a hardline opposition. Their message was muddled at best

To be fair the remain campaign went with what had worked previously for them with the Scottish referendum, where they used a 'fear factor' to win and thought the tactic would carry over and would work again with the brexit vote.

They did have a significant lead in the opinion polls when they called the referendum, and there is a theory* that undecided voters normally stick with the mean (what they know) rather than vote for the unknown, so taking those two things into account, plus their experience of the Scottish Referendum they were confident of a win.

I think you are correct in what you said though.


*the theory has a 'name' - will try to find out/remember what the actual correct terminology is
 
Is it even legal for a Government to pass a bill that allows them to do something illegal?

Bloody activist lawyers stopping them from reneging on a bill they themselves signed barely a year ago. Who do these unelected cranks think they are stopping us from taking back control and being held accountable for our own actions? :rant:
 
Is it even legal for a Government to pass a bill that allows them to do something illegal?
Hence the resignation of Jonathan Jones. Guessing Boris will cry off PMQs tomorrow. Thought of him being cross examined by one of the countries leading lawyers over a legal matter that the Governments own lawyer wants no part of. Itll be a bloodbath
 
To be fair the remain campaign went with what had worked previously for them with the Scottish referendum, where they used a 'fear factor' to win and thought the tactic would carry over and would work again with the brexit vote.

They did have a significant lead in the opinion polls when they called the referendum, and there is a theory* that undecided voters normally stick with the mean (what they know) rather than vote for the unknown, so taking those two things into account, plus their experience of the Scottish Referendum they were confident of a win.

I think you are correct in what you said though.


*the theory has a 'name' - will try to find out/remember what the actual correct terminology is

There are probably a number of cognitive biases at play though that lean in favour of leaning. Firstly, and I count myself among their number, very few of us really understand the EU and how it truly impacts our life, so we resort to simplified heuristics that allow us to make emotional, snap judgements. Leave did this by suggesting that the EU were always deciding things on our behalf, and there was absolutely nothing we can do about it. It's twaddle, of course, but we see Pete roll it out even now, so it's been hugely effective.

Secondly, this version of events was largely believable because the media, and especially the tabloid media, have spent years blaming Brussels for all manner of things that have thus been 'imposed' upon Britain. This is why if you ask many people about the EU, bendy bananas are still cited with great regularity.

Thirdly, loss aversion was a major factor in the immigration argument. As I've mentioned before, there is a strong belief among social conservatives that immigrants and ethnic minorities (probably women too tbh) have taken status and power that was previously theirs, and that remaining in the EU would see this influence diminish even further. Couple this with the endowment effect that you see when people get all misty eyed about supposedly traditional British things, such as Rule Britannia, that the 'liberal elite' are trying to take away from them.

Chuck all those together and it really wasn't an economic decision at all, but rather a social decision that was centered around power, influence, and respect.
 
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