Current Affairs EU In or Out

[BlueToff]

I tend to blame the Tories for this.

They had a majority which they threw away.

They then negotiated a deal without working with the opposition parties to ensure it could get passed.

As the party of Government this mess mostly lies at their door.

Totally. But there has been no unified stance across the government/all parties. They've all conspired to this. It's dreadful and none of them - not one - should be allowed to get away with it.

 

[Hickson9]

I'm sorry but that's not true. They are all hungry for power and I would not trust any of them.

The World isnt black and white.

Thinking so is dangerous.

 

[BlueToff]

The BBC impartial? Jesus

Yes. They maybe, maybe, lean a little bit to the left, on occasion, but generally, yes. You compare them to Fox or CNN, for example.

Let me guess, I don't know your leanings but if you're left, you'll say the Beeb are right. And if you're right, you'll say they're left.

It's like footy fans, saying a referee is always against their team.

 

[Tin-Tin]

How can people not see the difference between a brexit deal or just crashing out without one. Are people that obsessed with Brexit that they are prepared to accept no deal?

 

[dead_soft]

This thread just shows that the vast majority on here have never negotiated a deal in their lives, or if they have then they had their trousers pulled down.......rule number 1, be prepared to walk away.......

In this situation walking away is a bad thing. I'd say in negotiations having done proper analysis of the situation and being aware what you can gain and lose is much more important. But, hey, you'd rather it be 'I can walk away and leave myself screwed'

 

[BlueToff]

But it will. This is a huge turning point for the country and what it's to become. You may be past caring, but it still matters so I'm glad plenty of people do still care and put effort in

The sky isn't going to fall in. The world isn't going to end. I'm sick of people acting like it will when we don't know. I'm sick of lies on both sides.

So yes, while I agree people have to care, and we have to try and get the best out of this, we've already gone on far too long and we're too far down the road. I don't even know where we're at now.

 

[Moomin]

Oh come on mate.

I'm sick of my Dad telling me the media are all against BJ and then my left-wing mates saying the media are all conspiring against Corbyn and remain etc.

It's untrue.

We have two of the biggest, most impartial broadcasters in the world in the form of BBC and Sky.

Forget the Merdoch rhetoric. They report the news. They have people on from both sides and it is covered equally.

You have left-wing print, and right-wing print. They each have their audiences. They each generally have the same amount of reach. Most people are smack bang in the middle.

So no, the media aren't to blame.

I was talking about written press.

Some of the stories written about Corbyn have been superb. A Czech and Russian spy, paying the bail money for an IRA suspect etc etc

 

[Hickson9]

Totally. But there has been no unified stance across the government/all parties. They've all conspired to this. It's dreadful and none of them - not one - should be allowed to get away with it.

There hasn't been some conspiracy. We simply have a minority Government and a Parliament that doesn't want the country to suffer the extreme damage of a no deal Brexit.

A second referendum or a general election (with no deal off the table until the election is over) are the only options we have to break the impasse.

 

[tsubaki]

He has been ready from the moment he stepped into no.10. All the soundbites, more police, more teachers, better hospitals and the pandering to the brexiteers. He's thrown everything out there and hopes something will stick with the public.

Indeed, but in a GE people will point out that he actually cut the number of cops in London (and sold off numerous stations, including the training facility that he now needs to train those cops he wants to recruit), that Labour proposed recruiting those cops in 2017, that his partys government (Gove and Cummings) brought in Free Schools and wasted billions that could have gone on teachers and repairing schools etc.

Getting in to a "who will spend the most on infrastructure" argument with Labour is not a battle he is likely to win.

 

[peteblue]

Tonight and tomorrow will give Boris the perfect excuse. He wanted and promised to leave on Oct 31st, this shower of self serving mp’s stitched him up and made it be delayed. He will walk any election......and have a clearout of deadwood.....

 

[random]

there was signs the EU would have to accept making concessions because they really don't want a no deal.

They don't want a no deal but there were absolutely no signs they were changing the deal no matter what spin was coming out of No 10.

The EU have a specific way of negotiating, they gave the remit to Barnier and his team, whatever he negotiates is what the 27 have agreed to go with.

Barnier is hardly likely to undermine his position by hinting at concessions, the deal is how it stands at the moment, BJ says the backstop is the major sticking point and all the noises from the EU are "give us a credible alternative" and unfortunately there isn't one.

 

[BlueToff]

How can people not see the difference between a brexit deal or just crashing out without one. Are people that obsessed with Brexit that they are prepared to accept no deal?

No. People aren't saying that.

But what does this latest delay achieve? F all.

The EU won't want no deal. The negotiators aren't idiots. It'll be bad for them. Not as bad as it would be for us, but the EU are self-serving too. And they can't afford a no-deal Brexit.

 

[dead_soft]

The sky isn't going to fall in. The world isn't going to end. I'm sick of people acting like it will when we don't know. I'm sick of lies on both sides.

So yes, while I agree people have to care, and we have to try and get the best out of this, we've already gone on far too long and we're too far down the road. I don't even know where we're at now.

But for some people it will. If Britain gets poorer and loses jobs, people lose livelihoods, and it leads to people leaving miserable lives and living longer. This isn't just some ideological battle for many of us, it is being faced with real issues that will seriously damage huge areas of the country and many people. This is reality. You may disagree how it will affect things, but for those of us who think it has a negative impact, it's serious.

 

[peteblue]

Indeed, but in a GE people will point out that he actually cut the number of cops in London (and sold off numerous stations, including the training facility that he now needs to train those cops he wants to recruit), that Labour proposed recruiting those cops in 2017, that his partys government (Gove and Cummings) brought in Free Schools and wasted billions that could have gone on teachers and repairing schools etc.

Getting in to a "who will spend the most on infrastructure" argument with Labour is not a battle he is likely to win.

Why ?, Boris can actually start spending the money as well as making promises, Corbyn can only make the same promises......

 

[BlueToff]

There hasn't been some conspiracy. We simply have a minority Government and a Parliament that doesn't want the country to suffer the extreme damage of a no deal Brexit.

A second referendum or a general election (with no deal off the table until the election is over) are the only options we have to break the impasse.

A poor choice of words from me. I know it wasn't a conspiracy. But they have all contributed to the mess.