Current Affairs EU In or Out

In or Out

  • In

    Votes: 688 67.9%

  • Out

    Votes: 325 32.1%
  • Total voters
    1,013
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GrandOldTeam said:
The method of polling is of course very significant, I think a combination helps and perhaps an algorithm applied against those methods.

Personally I think social media is one of the worst indicators.

I think no matter what you do, there's always a very significant silent majority.
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Indeed, just look at the poll on the top of the page.....
 
JEBUS_LIVES said:
From what I can gather, this is factored into account in the algorithms. But the evidence suggested that it was a much better, better I think being the operative word, way of indication of voting.

The pollsters that used social media analysis, were the ones that predicted Trump and Brexit, while traditional pollsters did not - although the fact that both were incredibly close seemed to be completely overlooked in the media analysis.
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I think social media is particularly vulnerable to the silent majority sentiment being lost.

I think most of the population has common sense, and most won't waste their time shouting into a vacuum. That, and social media 'rewards' those who shout loudest and it's just a platform for validation from those the person selects as having like-minded views.

Their historical record is a good guide - so on Brexit;

56229
 
Bruce Wayne said:
That isn't just anecdotal, there has been quite a bit of research on the matter (Geert Hofstede the main author in this space), and yes, people in London (or Oxford or Manchester) have more in common with people in Berlin and Barcelona than they do people in Wigan. May put her stake in the ground when she derogatorily referred to such people as 'citizens of nowhere'.
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Wasn't knocking it Bruce its just the way it is, i can see the attraction of London especially for younger people it's got lots going for it .
Manchester outside of the centre has more in common with Wigan mate than Barcelona mate don't believe the propaganda it's still a Big mill town at heart.
 
abelard said:
And of course, for approaching ten years, the government has done nearly everything possible to lend credibility to nativist sentiments, well beyond even the obvious outrages like hostile immigration.

Don't want people to think it's plausible that the country is 'full'? Then stop pumping the real estate market full of laundered overseas cash and BOE-invented inquidity just to keep boomer home-owners and the banks profitably rent-seeking.

Don't want people to think immigrants are driving down wages? Then perhaps stop deliberately suppressing them.

I always find it surprising how little effort some of our champions of free movement devote to understanding this; much easier, I suppose, to idly daydream about doing away with democracy altogether.
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It's a considered policy of division.

Going back to the earlier example from Ben Bradley - he has historically:

  • Suggested 'unemployed scroungers' be given vasectomies
  • Lied about council using money to get Indian residents to cold call constituents
  • Suggested that youths should be battered by police for 'hanging around town centres' while supporting policies that force council's to sell off libraries, parks and community spaces to fund cuts.
  • Suggested public sector workers were greedy and should 'put up or move on'.
There is a significant portion of 'liberal' middle class voter that is willing to decry treatment of immigrants but not decry the treatment of the UK working class. It's not much different than the Conservative mindset of the deserving and undeserving poor.
 
Bruce Wayne said:
Stop picking on me or I'll put you on ignore :whip:
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haha Wigan's not that bad.

Try growing up in a Canadian wasteland like I did... those are truly grim.

Places like Wigan usually have fabulous architecture and heritage, and great potential public spaces. They could be wonderful places to live with better transit links and a bit of investment and love.

They could be so easily improved if we (as a country, not picking on you specifically!) just took our ideological blinders off, and it's beyond exasperating that even after Brexit we still aren't listening or taking them seriously (because we assume they are remote backwater outposts passed over by civilisation and overrun by incoherent barbarians who deserve misery they get because they won't stop eating crisps instead of brussels sprouts).

Almost everywhere in Britain save London and a handful of university towns was a better place to live ten years ago.

If we want to address the factors that led to Brexit, we can start by acknowledging responsibility for this, and doing something meaningful about it.
 
JEBUS_LIVES said:
It's a considered policy of division.

Going back to the earlier example from Ben Bradley - he has historically:

  • Suggested 'unemployed scroungers' be given vasectomies
  • Lied about council using money to get Indian residents to cold call constituents
  • Suggested that youths should be battered by police for 'hanging around town centres' while supporting policies that force council's to sell off libraries, parks and community spaces to fund cuts.
  • Suggested public sector workers were greedy and should 'put up or move on'.
There is a significant portion of 'liberal' middle class voter that is willing to decry treatment of immigrants but not decry the treatment of the UK working class. It's not much different than the Conservative mindset of the deserving and undeserving poor.
Click to expand...

Because, as pointed out in the research I shared yesterday, migrants tend to be more educated than the native population (in every western country, not just here), and so migrants are more likely to reflect those middle class urbanites than the 'deplorables' in Wigan (sorry Wigan).
 
Bruce Wayne said:
That isn't just anecdotal, there has been quite a bit of research on the matter (Geert Hofstede the main author in this space), and yes, people in London (or Oxford or Manchester) have more in common with people in Berlin and Barcelona than they do people in Wigan. May put her stake in the ground when she derogatorily referred to such people as 'citizens of nowhere'.
Click to expand...
Aside from the fact that Wigan is in Greater Manchester - there is a unity across the North West in cultural identity that stems from a deeply ingrained love of pies and pastries.

That bond will never be broken!
 
Bruce Wayne said:
Because, as pointed out in the research I shared yesterday, migrants tend to be more educated than the native population (in every western country, not just here), and so migrants are more likely to reflect those middle class urbanites than the 'deplorables' in Wigan (sorry Wigan).
Click to expand...
And why are they at odds? Because middle class liberals feel that educated people are more deserving of support than those that aren't?

That is a failure of the UK education system.
 
abelard said:
Almost everywhere in Britain save London and a handful of university towns was a better place to live ten years ago.

If we want to address the factors that led to Brexit, we can start by acknowledging responsibility for this, and doing something meaningful about it.
Click to expand...

Nothing to do with EU and everything to do with electing a right wing Tory government
 
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