Current Affairs EU In or Out

In or Out

  • In

    Votes: 688 67.9%

  • Out

    Votes: 325 32.1%
  • Total voters
    1,013
Status
Not open for further replies.
Joey66 said:
At least if we leave we will not fund an EU army -dont forget remainers in the polictical world laughed at Farage when he stated this was going to happen down the line......- Clegg and co were adamant it was not on...... bare faced lies.......
So when we leave we will not face a massive bill to fund a mickey mouse bureaucratic army mainly run by the French as other countries are sadly lacking in armies - Makron in France is struggling politically the french hate him........
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But it couldn’t when we were in it because we had a veto , then we left so no veto therefore now it could potentially happen , not to say it will .
 
Bruce Wayne said:
Where you see an empire, most right minded people see an alliance that is no different to Nato or its ilk. All this talk of empire is silly, and I suspect people in India would laugh at your notion that it was given up peacefully. Or are we brushing over the 2 million deaths as peaceful now?
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Of course it is different to NATO and the French President gave the game away when he talked of the EU being a sovereign power and needing an army. NATO is purely what it says on the tin, a military alliance. Why do you think the EU wants control of a ‘NATO light’ command ?......
 
Harryflashman said:
The U.K. or rather the British Empire also used to trade in slaves , execute trade unionists in the street , press gang people and the rest but that’s called progress all of those things now would be rightly condemned as is Russian expansionism.
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Russia isn’t expanding. Only the EU is expanding......
 
Harryflashman said:
But it couldn’t when we were in it because we had a veto , then we left so no veto therefore now it could potentially happen , not to say it will .
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Vetoes like @peteblue states are meaningless the tab would still be there to pick up for this stupid EU idea what's NATO for?......
it will be another layer of bureaucracy that we would be contributing too - we will be allies to them , but without the big bureaucratic bill - they will need headquarters, and staff tbh it may hasten world war 3 than stop it.........
 
peteblue said:
Do you seriously believe that the EU army would not be used if Luxembourg or the ROI objected. Do you think it would require 28 to agree, 25, 20, 25, 15 or 10, perhaps 5 ? So who will control it ? Defence is easy, if attacked everyone defends, or do they ? NATO works because the USA, UK, France have well defined forces, under the control of the bigger nations. Who would control the EU army, France ? or maybe Germany ?, what about Spain or even Luxembourg. If you trust any of those to order our armed forces into engagement then I’m sorry but I don’t.....
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Whoa there cowboy! :)

I agree with you that there is no need for an EU army and I wouldn't particularly want to see one. I also wrote in my post it would be the main ones (who contribute most to any army) that would be required to OK any action, so you would pressume that would be France, Italy, Spain and Germany. And in fairness I doubt countries like Belgium, Netherlands, Austria etc. would agree to be left out of any decision to go to war technically on their behalf without their permission.

Of course if we were in the EU still we would have a big say in the whole thing as along with France it would be the backbone of any force, so I would guess our generals would feature heavily in any planning and orders.

The good news is we won't be apart of it but there are downsides to, while we were an integral piece we could act like a giant handbrake on the whole thing and what they get involved with. Now we can only watch on.
 
peteblue said:
Do you seriously believe that the EU army would not be used if Luxembourg or the ROI objected. Do you think it would require 28 to agree, 25, 20, 25, 15 or 10, perhaps 5 ? So who will control it ? Defence is easy, if attacked everyone defends, or do they ? NATO works because the USA, UK, France have well defined forces, under the control of the bigger nations. Who would control the EU army, France ? or maybe Germany ?, what about Spain or even Luxembourg. If you trust any of those to order our armed forces into engagement then I’m sorry but I don’t.....
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You're making enormous leaps here Pete based upon very flimsy information.

edge said:
If a bully is threatened they will to revert to form and strike out.
Sooner talk to the Russians than wind them up , because it suits someone in Brussels to expand there infulence, for what , will any of these countries make the EU more prosperous , safer for the average EU citizen?
Anyway the Russians have the masters of the EU, Germany by the bollocks over energy so I wouldn't be looking at anything other than sabre rattling when it came to it anyway.
I have said repeatedly I would withdraw from nato , UN and just have an armed forces for home defense , we are for ever getting told we are not a world power anymore let's not act like one and let others sort themselves out without are input.
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This is perhaps part of the challenge with Brexit isn't it and why we're in such a pickle? Some people believe that we could be even more international outside of the EU, with Pete broadly falling into this camp, and then there are others who want us to be significantly less international outside of the EU (a Britain first mantra if you like), as above. The notion that there's a single, unifying 'will of the people' on this seems very wide of the mark.

peteblue said:
Russia isn’t expanding. Only the EU is expanding......
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The EU is expanding voluntarily. You'll be suggesting next that the expansion of NAFTA (or other trade blocs) is akin to an invasion. With respect Pete, this parroting of Hunt's line about the EU being equivalent to the Soviet Union is absurd, and former Soviet states rightly derided him for making the comparison. You're only making yourself look equally foolish by following him.
 
I seem to recall it was the Tory government of the 1990s that was most keen on the expansion of the EU eastwards and insisted it was included in the Maastricht Treaty. It seems this is now being blamed on Germany/France as everything else usually is by the anti-EU camp.

It should also be said that there is a queue of countries waiting to join the EU voluntarily. Its not some military-style expansion of EU territory as they like to depict it. The real 'Project Fear' comes from the pro-Brexit camp.
 
Mark O'Silver said:
I seem to recall it was the Tory government of the 1990s that was most keen on the expansion of the EU eastwards and insisted it was included in the Maastricht Treaty. It seems this is now being blamed on Germany/France as everything else usually is by the anti-EU camp.

It should also be said that there is a queue of countries waiting to join the EU voluntarily. Its not some military-style expansion of EU territory as they like to depict it. The real 'Project Fear' comes from the pro-Brexit camp.
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Indeed, it was Turkish migrants who were apparently going to flood the UK if we remained in the EU during the referendum, just as it was Polish/Romanian/insert other generic Slavic migrants who going to overrun the UK in 2004.

Express-cover-montage.jpg

The utter state of it.
 
Bruce Wayne said:
You're making enormous leaps here Pete based upon very flimsy information.



This is perhaps part of the challenge with Brexit isn't it and why we're in such a pickle? Some people believe that we could be even more international outside of the EU, with Pete broadly falling into this camp, and then there are others who want us to be significantly less international outside of the EU (a Britain first mantra if you like), as above. The notion that there's a single, unifying 'will of the people' on this seems very wide of the mark.



The EU is expanding voluntarily. You'll be suggesting next that the expansion of NAFTA (or other trade blocs) is akin to an invasion. With respect Pete, this parroting of Hunt's line about the EU being equivalent to the Soviet Union is absurd, and former Soviet states rightly derided him for making the comparison. You're only making yourself look equally foolish by following him.
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I would openly put Britain first, don't mind trading internationally so long as it's not trading blows in wars.
 
Mark O'Silver said:
I seem to recall it was the Tory government of the 1990s that was most keen on the expansion of the EU eastwards and insisted it was included in the Maastricht Treaty. It seems this is now being blamed on Germany/France as everything else usually is by the anti-EU camp.

It should also be said that there is a queue of countries waiting to join the EU voluntarily. Its not some military-style expansion of EU territory as they like to depict it. The real 'Project Fear' comes from the pro-Brexit camp.
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lol Nick Clegg no EU army even planned......
 
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