Current Affairs EU In or Out

In or Out

  • In

    Votes: 688 67.9%
  • Out

    Votes: 325 32.1%

  • Total voters
    1,013
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Not that it makes a blind bit of difference as people who are definitely not idiots have already made up their mind and will not listen to any kind of evidence on the matter, but yet another paper highlighting the enormous value migrants bring to the economy, to individual firm performance and to communities as a whole.

https://publicpolicy.wharton.upenn.edu/issue-brief/v6n7.php

and the authors discuss the paper here - http://knowledge.wharton.upenn.edu/article/economic-debate-immigration-reform/

“What the research is showing is that there’s a pattern that goes something like this: A group of migrants starts moving into a certain place, and eventually they are going to form a cluster. Those migrants aren’t isolated from their homes, so they communicate back and forth, they bring ideas, they bring skill, they bring some of their own money,” he said.

“But what’s not talked about is that a few years later, companies from [these migrants’] home countries actually follow them into that place and set up factories and retail stores and research centers, and they make productive capital investments,” he noted. “Those factories employ not only immigrants, they also employ more Americans than immigrants. That pattern of migration being followed by foreign investment, by capital that comes into the U.S., is not talked about, but it’s a very common pattern.”
 
They were voted in by the people - if the people vote Corbyn in I would accept it.......

I wouldn’t, I’d take it to court, run a media effort to say that those who voted for him were too young, didn’t know what they were voting for, were anti-semites and demand that the election was rerun.....that’s the way we roll these days.......
 
I wouldn’t, I’d take it to court, run a media effort to say that those who voted for him were too young, didn’t know what they were voting for, were anti-semites and demand that the election was rerun.....that’s the way we roll these days.......

Yeah it's a shame we can't vote to leave or join Europe every four or five years isn't it? As that would make those two scenarios remotely comparable and not simply look like a stupid post.
 
Not that it makes a blind bit of difference as people who are definitely not idiots have already made up their mind and will not listen to any kind of evidence on the matter, but yet another paper highlighting the enormous value migrants bring to the economy, to individual firm performance and to communities as a whole.

https://publicpolicy.wharton.upenn.edu/issue-brief/v6n7.php

and the authors discuss the paper here - http://knowledge.wharton.upenn.edu/article/economic-debate-immigration-reform/

“What the research is showing is that there’s a pattern that goes something like this: A group of migrants starts moving into a certain place, and eventually they are going to form a cluster. Those migrants aren’t isolated from their homes, so they communicate back and forth, they bring ideas, they bring skill, they bring some of their own money,” he said.

“But what’s not talked about is that a few years later, companies from [these migrants’] home countries actually follow them into that place and set up factories and retail stores and research centers, and they make productive capital investments,” he noted. “Those factories employ not only immigrants, they also employ more Americans than immigrants. That pattern of migration being followed by foreign investment, by capital that comes into the U.S., is not talked about, but it’s a very common pattern.”

I wonder how doctors and lawyers and academics' feelings on outsourcing and immigration might change if they didn't have their prohibitively time-consuming and expensive provincial credentials to protect them?

Not that I doubt your study, but it's easy to pride ourselves on our detachment when it's other peoples' displacement bringing us abstract margainal gains.
 
I wonder how doctors and lawyers and academics' feelings on outsourcing and immigration might change if they didn't have their prohibitively time-consuming and expensive provincial credentials to protect them?

Not that I doubt your study, but it's easy to pride ourselves on our detachment when it's other peoples' displacement bringing us abstract margainal gains.

EU migrants are more likely to be graduates.
 
EU migrants are more likely to be graduates.

That doesn't really explain it away though. EU and especially EU15 Migration is a relatively small percentage of the total. And unlike with the EU, immigrants from non-EU countries tend be overqualified and underemployed relative to their UK counterparts. The Uber driver with the Engineering PhD is more than just a stereotype, and it's this sort of de facto professional class protectionism that I'm referring to.

We stand a better chance of preserving the values we cherish if we try a little bit harder to empathise with those who disagree (however irrational they might seem) rather than reaching for self-flattering bromides like: they are all "idiots have already made up their mind and will not listen to any kind of evidence"
 
I wonder how doctors and lawyers and academics' feelings on outsourcing and immigration might change if they didn't have their prohibitively time-consuming and expensive provincial credentials to protect them?

Not that I doubt your study, but it's easy to pride ourselves on our detachment when it's other peoples' displacement bringing us abstract margainal gains.

I'm fed up of the conversation that treats european citizens as economic instruments.
 
There probably should have been one in the 90's that would have stopped all this happening in the first place when it started becoming more than the EEC. I'm not a fan of referendums I just want the people to vote with more idea about what they are voting for, that way people can't say they were not warned or did not understand it.
We would have voted OUT in the 1990's - TBF I hated Thatcher, but under pressure she went to the EU and threatened them that our paying in budget was far to high etc etc - and got a massive rebate - only for Tony Blair to give most of it back - never mind the four freedoms, that came in later treaties not voted for by the way - just the cost of it all in that era, and the red tape rules that hampered us in business in those days - hence the tory party has more objections on the EU than Labour - Don't forget we entered the trading block of about 7 European countries under Ted Heath without a referendum paying way over the top mas then General De Gaulle prevented us from joining from the start - hence the high price of joining referendums followed as the price of food went high - and the reported mountains of stockpiled food which were then known as mountains were reported - The French by the way have always done well out of the Farming subsidy - our farmers started of well hedgerows ripped out etc as the more food produced the more they got paid if the countries needed it or not - we had butter mountains, wheat mountains, etc etc - hence the call for us to leave then in the 1970's which I voted to stay in thinking it was just teething problems......
The EEC in which we joined morthed in a two parliment wasteful polictical EU with treaty's being invoked without consulting the UK public more poorer countries joining contributing next to nothing - hence the 2016 Referendum the UK public voted out..... here's the contribution list-
Oh by the way the little Isle of man is not in the EU ..............

graph_total_payments_466x485.gif
 
I wouldn’t, I’d take it to court, run a media effort to say that those who voted for him were too young, didn’t know what they were voting for, were anti-semites and demand that the election was rerun.....that’s the way we roll these days.......
Yes we are in danger of being a Banana Republic - not accepting democrocy ........
 
Yes we are in danger of being a Banana Republic - not accepting democrocy ........

Still a boring and feeble argument Joey. Nothing changes by giving people a final say on a deal. That is democracy. Banana republics dictate terms, guess what? We are being dictated terms on what will happen, that most people, including the leave voters don't want.

If you truly believe in the reasons and benefits to leave, once we know the terms it should be child's play for your side to reinforce that this is the best way forward for the country. No?
 
Still a boring and feeble argument Joey. Nothing changes by giving people a final say on a deal. That is democracy. Banana republics dictate terms, guess what? We are being dictated terms on what will happen, that most people, including the leave voters don't want.

If you truly believe in the reasons and benefits to leave, once we know the terms it should be child's play for your side to reinforce that this is the best way forward for the country. No?[/QUOTE
people in majority disagree with you = democrocy.......
17.4 million votes for Leave and 16.1 million votes for Remain. 72% turn out......
 
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