Current Affairs EU In or Out

In or Out

  • In

    Votes: 688 67.9%
  • Out

    Votes: 325 32.1%

  • Total voters
    1,013
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So there I have what? The Governments of the day have deliberately kept staffing below that which is required for as long as I can remember. Why do you think there was all the fuss about passports in 1980? Why,more recently, about the staffing in HMRC, and other Government Departments. It's got nothing to do with the EU, but you somehow manage to turn it into an EU issue.

I'm happy to discuss things with you, but when you simply wish to plough the EU furrow come what may...

We were talking about the current customs controls, which work fine and dandy, being replaced with a UK Government run system, which you say will deliberately under staff it.

And you are presumably fine with that. or did you not consider the issue when making your decision to vote leave?
 
Let's recap the conversation:
You: It’ll be project fear when some dodgy South American meat is transited through Europe and illegally brought through a U.K. port before being distributed throughout the country and causing a mass food incident
Me:Nothing new to see here.
There's been dodgy stuff in various meat products for a long time. Don't you ever watch the news...?
You: Like what
Me:
First paragraph: https://www.euractiv.com/section/ag...ganisations-expose-misleading-meat-labelling/

Or this one: https://www.globalmeatnews.com/Arti...port-slams-misleading-meat-industry-practices
The first paragraph under the sub-heading 'Contaminated'.


First point: we have imported meat from South America for decades, Argentina being a prime example. Never looked at the side of a corned beef tin?
Second point: Nothing new, because of what I have written in the previous line to this.
Third point: You asked for examples with your phrase 'Like what'
Fourth point: I gave examples.
Fifth point: You talk about protection from outside the EU. I refer you to my first point, above.

Right, let me take you to school with regards to your 1st point, Argentine meat.

Yes I’m well aware that both Brazil and Argentina are mass exporters tothe EU for their beef products. But how they do that:
1) only certain establishments in those countries can export meat. An establishment is a company that produces the product. To enable them to gain approval to meet the requirements to become an establishment then their plant must meet the hygiene requirements set out and in EU 852/853 & 854 2004 and ensure they comply with HACCP practices. They are audited regularly by the EU to ensure compliance to these regulations

2) when they export to the EU their product is supported by a health Certificate which is signed by aVet in Argentina to ensure that it was those products leaving the country and under strict controls (i.e. if frozen that the temperature was sufficient when leaving)

3) on arrival in the EU the goods can only arrive through a Border Inspection Post, not all ports have a BIP and these are regularly audited by the EU. Authorised BIPs can be found on 2009/821/EC.

4) the importer must submit the health certificate, which was signed by the vet, to a vet in a BIP along with a Common Vet Entry Document which is submitted via a EU database called TRACES. This system records the movement of the goods through the EU and results from of official checks by the vet in accordance with 97/78/EC plus sampling results, including failure

5) if that product fails at any port in Europe then all other ports are immediately aware via TRACES and will be more vigilant. If the product fails following sampling then the establishment from which the product arrives is placed on the Article 24 list and any products they originating from that establishments are unable to gain entry into the EU until 10 satisfactory samples have been taken from the next 10 imports, these can be at any BIP within the EU.

So you can see the tight controls and animal and human protection that is currently in place. Once we leave we have none of these controls and the ability to get spoiled meat increases massively. Importers can transit the goods through Ireland for example, place them on a RORO ferry to Holyhead and then before you know it there on the shelves. This is small compared to Dover considering that is the link to world trade via Europe.

I’ve just finished another meeting, lasting 9 hours today with representatives from DEFRA, FSA and HMRC. The threat is real and everyone is in a state of worry, 8 months out and we have no plan how to deal with any of the above mentioned points never mind additional infrastructure to put in place.

So please pipe down on information you have literally no clue on apart from quoting some stupid irrelevant articles
 
So there I have what? The Governments of the day have deliberately kept staffing below that which is required for as long as I can remember. Why do you think there was all the fuss about passports in 1980? Why,more recently, about the staffing in HMRC, and other Government Departments. It's got nothing to do with the EU, but you somehow manage to turn it into an EU issue.

I'm happy to discuss things with you, but when you simply wish to plough the EU furrow come what may...

I'm not though, why can't you see that? I'd be quite happy replacing them for a better system, are we going to get that ?
 
I’ve just finished another meeting, lasting 9 hours today with representatives from DEFRA, FSA and HMRC. The threat is real and everyone is in a state of worry, 8 months out and we have no plan how to deal with any of the above mentioned points never mind additional infrastructure to put in place.

And we have only been talking about Fray Bentos and Corned Beef.........

I said a few days after the result, we havnt really thought this through have we?
 
We will leave the EU in name only. May knows this. It's the only real solution at this moment in time given the preparation the government have done. A total waste of time, and so depressing given the real problems the UK faces.
 
And we have only been talking about Fray Bentos and Corned Beef.........

I said a few days after the result, we havnt really thought this through have we?

Nope, the reality hasn’t set to how much the EU support the health of our everyday life. They’ve stood up to the USA on the crap they put in their food, refused the chlorinated chicken.

Another thing people are probably unaware of is Chinese kitchenware, all the cheap plastic plates, cutlery, god containers etc etc is all subject to legislation now to ensure no melamine or polyamide leach into the food when it hits a certain temperature.

There’s some parts of the EU that I hate and it needs reform, I’m first to admit that but we’ve been sold a lie on brexit
 
+how much has the government achieved to enable preparedness to date?

Nothing, the consensus is no deal, so no computer systems to monitor all this type of traffic and back to pen and paper. This will then put more pressure on Local Authorities for staff, infrastructure etc plus a hit on trade due to delays in processing clearance.

8 months out and only now are they looking to “map” the import process out now. Should have been done 2 years ago and before the referendum was called to devise feasibility
 
Nope, the reality hasn’t set to how much the EU support the health of our everyday life. They’ve stood up to the USA on the crap they put in their food, refused the chlorinated chicken.

Another thing people are probably unaware of is Chinese kitchenware, all the cheap plastic plates, cutlery, god containers etc etc is all subject to legislation now to ensure no melamine or polyamide leach into the food when it hits a certain temperature.

There’s some parts of the EU that I hate and it needs reform, I’m first to admit that but we’ve been sold a lie on brexit

I wouldnt insult the intelligence of any one on here by pretending I had any idea about the stuff you are posting about, its clearly your field.

But it does chime with my main reason to vote remain; it aint that bad, and some pretty unattractive folk wanted to leave.
 
Nope, the reality hasn’t set to how much the EU support the health of our everyday life. They’ve stood up to the USA on the crap they put in their food, refused the chlorinated chicken.

Another thing people are probably unaware of is Chinese kitchenware, all the cheap plastic plates, cutlery, god containers etc etc is all subject to legislation now to ensure no melamine or polyamide leach into the food when it hits a certain temperature.

There’s some parts of the EU that I hate and it needs reform, I’m first to admit that but we’ve been sold a lie on brexit

Well I guess the good news is, the day after we actually leave, the number of parcels I have to deliver will be pretty low.

Oh, hang on. I get paid by the unit ffs.
 
We will leave the EU in name only. May knows this. It's the only real solution at this moment in time given the preparation the government have done. A total waste of time, and so depressing given the real problems the UK faces.

It is starting to look that way.

Subject to rules and legislation we no longer have any ability to shape.

And the irony is that it will have been the Brexit Ultras more than even the Remainers who brought about our "vassal" status, by demanding that Article 50 be invoked ASAP, with no plan other than what we can see here: delusional confidence that all evidence to the contrary, "it will all somehow be okay, because I'm in my sixties now and everything else always has ended up okay (for me)".

By the way, cheers for sharing, @nsno-chris!
 
Last edited by a moderator:
It is starting to look that way.

Subject to rules and legislation we no longer have any ability to shape.

And the irony is that it will have been the Brexit Ultras more than even the Remainers who brought about our "vassal" status, by demanding that Article 50 be invoked ASAP, with no plan other than what we can see here: delusional confidence that all evidence to the contrary, "it will all somehow be okay, because I'm in my sixties now and everything else always has been okay (for me)".

By the way, cheers for sharing, @nsno-chris!

No worries bud, unless otherwise instructed by the powers that be I’ll try and update when I get info
 
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