Current Affairs EU In or Out

In or Out

  • In

    Votes: 688 67.9%

  • Out

    Votes: 325 32.1%
  • Total voters
    1,013
Status
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Foot Long Hot Dog said:
Sucking out millions for their own gains? Explain how that works?

Remaining in the EU wasn’t based on a great affection for the institution, it needs reform, no doubt. However the weight of reasons for staying as part of it and driving change from within made it the more pragmatic decision. The picture painted for why we should Leave was always based on fantasy and lies imo, and they gave no tangible credible benefits for leaving. It was emotive claptrap.
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The EU certainly need reform but we wouldn't have a hope of 'driving change from within'. The EU Parliament has no power and very little influence. Its just a talking shop and a 'sop' to democracy. The real power is with the unelected Commission and all the decisions are behind closed doors and influenced by vested interests. In any event, the future is already mapped out, as it has been for the last 50 years, and no individual country will be able to drive change. The biggest mistake the EU made was to introduce the euro without the necessary checks and balances. The reason they did this wasn't that they were desperate for an EU currency, it was to get everyone in. Once in, it would be almost impossible to leave. We have Gordon Brown to thank for keeping us out. The euro is the EU's Achilles heel. It won't survive if there's another recession.
 
roydo said:
Unless the ECB/EU sets budgets and monetary policy centrally, and applicable all member states, it will fail at some point. No doubt about it.
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This is what Macron wants and he is dead right that it is needed. Its what should have been done at the start. However, Germany don't want it though they may be forced into it if the euro looks like imploding
 
Methuselah said:
This is what Macron wants and he is dead right that it is needed. Its what should have been done at the start. However, Germany don't want it though they may be forced into it if the euro looks like imploding
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Yep. Single currency only works with a central bank and a central economic policy, a'la USA.
 
roydo said:
Unless the ECB/EU sets budgets and monetary policy centrally, and applicable all member states, it will fail at some point. No doubt about it.
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it needs everything a state needs in order to become a state, otherwise ever closer union is just an excuse for the likes of Verhofstadt and Barnier to spend their entire lives coining it in without actually doing anything
 
Meanwhile, in centrism-land:

Britain’s former trade commissioner in Brussels, Lord Mandelson, is making common cause with hardline anti-EU Tories, saying that Theresa May’s latest Brexit blueprint would lead to “national humiliation” and leave the country in a worse position than if it turned its back on the entire European economic system.

In an extraordinary intervention that shows that even the most ardent Remainers in parliament find the plans unacceptable, Labour peer Mandelson says they would deliver “the polar opposite of taking back control”, and would mean “the EU would ultimately call the shots, not just now but indefinitely”.

Writing in the Observer – as a new Opinium poll shows support for the Tories has haemorraghed and backing for Ukip has soared since the plans were agreed by the cabinet 10 days ago – Mandelson writes: “Britain, in effect, would be entrapped and the more you think through the implications the more the whole thing looks less like a soft Brexit than a national humiliation.

....

On Saturday night, the pro-Remain Labour MP Chuka Umunna said there was no way even the most pro-EU Labour supporters of a soft Brexit would back May’s plans. “There is no Labour Remainer who would support May’s Chequers deal or prop up her sorry excuse for a government – full stop,” he said.
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They really are the single most useless group of politicians in the country; even May and her acolytes are better than them.
 
Methuselah said:
This is what Macron wants and he is dead right that it is needed. Its what should have been done at the start. However, Germany don't want it though they may be forced into it if the euro looks like imploding
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Because Germany knows it will have to pay for it, and that is not what the EU and single currency is for as it’s the mechanism to allow unfettered German exports and growth......
 
Methuselah said:
The EU certainly need reform but we wouldn't have a hope of 'driving change from within'. The EU Parliament has no power and very little influence. Its just a talking shop and a 'sop' to democracy. The real power is with the unelected Commission and all the decisions are behind closed doors and influenced by vested interests. In any event, the future is already mapped out, as it has been for the last 50 years, and no individual country will be able to drive change. The biggest mistake the EU made was to introduce the euro without the necessary checks and balances. The reason they did this wasn't that they were desperate for an EU currency, it was to get everyone in. Once in, it would be almost impossible to leave. We have Gordon Brown to thank for keeping us out. The euro is the EU's Achilles heel. It won't survive if there's another recession.
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The only thing Gordon Brown did that actually helped us.......
 
Jeremy Corbyn has called on the government to step aside if it cannot deliver "something approaching an intelligent relationship with Europe" and has said that Labour is "ready" for a general election.

The Labour leader also criticised the Prime Minister for failing to clarify her approach to Brexit , before adding that he would vote against any deal that damages living standards, industry, trade or jobs.

When asked whether he and Mrs May could co-operate on a soft Brexit in the wake of the Chequers agreement, Mr Corbyn said: "She hasn't closed off any of the other options, because within three days of saying that, she goes to meet Donald Trump and then talks about trade arrangements with the USA.

"The USA does not want any European standard of regulation on products or workers' rights and working conditions, they want something very, very different.

"She is not making it very clear what she actually wants at all and the White Paper, I suspect, will unravel as quickly as the Chequers cabinet agreement did."

Mr Corbyn added: "If the government cannot deliver something approaching an intelligent relationship with Europe in the future then quite honestly I think the issue is better dealt with by having a general election to elect a government that can and will both work for jobs and living standards in this country, and have an intelligent relationship with Europe."
 
orchard said:
Jeremy Corbyn has called on the government to step aside if it cannot deliver "something approaching an intelligent relationship with Europe" and has said that Labour is "ready" for a general election.

The Labour leader also criticised the Prime Minister for failing to clarify her approach to Brexit , before adding that he would vote against any deal that damages living standards, industry, trade or jobs.

When asked whether he and Mrs May could co-operate on a soft Brexit in the wake of the Chequers agreement, Mr Corbyn said: "She hasn't closed off any of the other options, because within three days of saying that, she goes to meet Donald Trump and then talks about trade arrangements with the USA.

"The USA does not want any European standard of regulation on products or workers' rights and working conditions, they want something very, very different.

"She is not making it very clear what she actually wants at all and the White Paper, I suspect, will unravel as quickly as the Chequers cabinet agreement did."

Mr Corbyn added: "If the government cannot deliver something approaching an intelligent relationship with Europe in the future then quite honestly I think the issue is better dealt with by having a general election to elect a government that can and will both work for jobs and living standards in this country, and have an intelligent relationship with Europe."
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Is he being serious? We're what, six months from Article 50 being triggered and he wants to call a general election that'll suck up a large chunk of that? The man's bonkers. He should have done his job better if he really believed that, both during the referendum itself and then during the 2 years or so since then.
 
Bruce Wayne said:
Is he being serious? We're what, six months from Article 50 being triggered and he wants to call a general election that'll suck up a large chunk of that? The man's bonkers. He should have done his job better if he really believed that, both during the referendum itself and then during the 2 years or so since then.
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Tbf we should have done our job better and not elected/enstrusted a bunch of incompetents.
 
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