Current Affairs EU In or Out

[peteblue]

I'm afraid I disagree. Brexit is viewed in these countries as a movement that is very much on 'their side'. They've set up enemies as the 'liberal elite'. People like George Soros in Hungary, Merkel and the EU. All of these idiots think Brexit is a wonderful thing and supportive of their ideology. They think that if Britain and America can go down that road, it makes it perfectly okay for them to follow. This was all predicted, and discounted as project fear, btw.

Hold on Bruce, is your argument now that we shouldn’t have voted Brexit because East European countries would turn into racist right wing nut jobs.......

 

[Foot Long Hot Dog]

I have to be honest here, I haven’t a clue what you are on about and I imagine you don’t really know what you’re on about either.....

I’ve explained it once and you swerved it with whataboutery. I know exactly what I’m on about thanks.

 

[Joey66]

I notice you didn't comment on the study I posted several pages ago showing that refugees have been a boost to every single one of the 15 western European countries studied, both culturally and economically. Instead there's this underlying narrative that these sub-humans are flocking to our cherished lands and destroying them. It's shameful.

Again Bruce I agree with you they work, and contribute , but I still ask the question does their contribution cover the amount on of pressure, and extra cost on public services of our country, and cost wise - other countries outside the USA, Australia, New Zealand etc - you try to move there free movement wise .....
James O'brien on LBC peddling the myth of the new payment to become citizens in the UK a mere £65 how outrageous etc - til a German Lady came on settled here for forty years told him to behave she had applied easily online last night for all her family, and compared to other EU countries it was so simple - She herself thought it was a very good thing for the future - as control of immigration into the UK could now be checked.......
by the way the numbers applying is up on what was first thought were in the UK - which I am not allowed about at last a system will be in place in the future of controlled immigration and migration when Brexit is finalised - we have a skill shortage , and controlled immigration is far better than Free Movement in the present set up of the EU!

 

[Joey66]

What Merkel did in terms of her allowing Germany to take in a large number of refugees has nothing to do with the Italian ire, that’s her domestic issue. Italy’s issue is that they feel they are bearing the brunt of the migrant crisis due to their geographic position, the same as Greece. The words being spoken by Salvini are sinister, talk of ‘mass cleansing street by street’, forcing a census of Roma and the deportation of non Italians, it’s not even well disguised, it’s pure fascism.

There’s an incredibly frightening seemingly Worldwide right wing uprising at the minute. You listen to Trump dehumanising people by calling them an infestation, we’ve got the Laxley Lennon bigots over here shouting about ‘our streets’, the far right in both Germany and Italy spouting fascist ideologies. This issue isn’t about the EU it’s about the West’s foreign policy coming home to roost after a decade plus of pummelling the Middle East in the name of democracy has created both terrorist uprisings and a massive displacement of people, who are trying to escape it. The Wests response has been a far right ‘keep them out’ backlash.

Personally I hear some of the language being used of late, that has somehow become normalised in the post truth Trump era, and I find it absolutely abhorrent. Child concentration camps ffs, what was the idiot thinking of?

So thats why shes struggling to hold on to power.....

 

[Bruce Wayne]

Hold on Bruce, is your argument now that we shouldn’t have voted Brexit because East European countries would turn into racist right wing nut jobs.......

I'm saying that every right wing nut job has used Brexit to support their position.

 

[Blue Juice]

People aren't still actively supporting Brexit are they?

 

[Foot Long Hot Dog]

Again Bruce I agree with you they work, and contribute , but I still ask the question does their contribution cover the amount on of pressure, and extra cost on public services of our country, and cost wise - other countries outside the USA, Australia, New Zealand etc - you try to move there free movement wise .....
James O'brien on LBC peddling the myth of the new payment to become citizens in the UK a mere £65 how outrageous etc - til a German Lady came on settled here for forty years told him to behave she had applied easily online last night for all her family, and compared to other EU countries it was so simple - She herself thought it was a very good thing for the future - as control of immigration into the UK could now be checked.......
by the way the numbers applying is up on what was first thought were in the UK - which I am not allowed about at last a system will be in place in the future of controlled immigration and migration when Brexit is finalised - we have a skill shortage , and controlled immigration is far better than Free Movement in the present set up of the EU!

A skills shortage that will be exacerbated by Brexit mate, as we’re creating an environment in this country that is being perceived in the EU as hostile.

Migrants haven’t only been filling skilled positions they’ve been filling plenty of unskilled roles, that British nationals either weren’t prepared to fill or due to geographical reasons weren’t there to fill.

We have always had the option of controlling migration we’ve just chosen not to administer it. It’s a complete myth that’s been bought by the populous that it’s an EU issue.

If people come here and can’t support themselves either with their own cash or via employment then they can be deported after 3 months under EU law. In exactly the same way as a tourist could be who outstayed their holiday visa period in any country around the globe. If they’ve found gainful employment and can therefore support themselves and are thus contributing to the economy they can stay, it’s that simple. What is wrong with that as a basic principle? I simply don’t get. If our economy grows and needs more employees then the EU migrants can come and fill the positions and thus enhance our economy in the process.

It’s been demonised as something that it isn’t, the Farage ‘breaking point’ posters and the Leave campaigns ‘there’s millions of Turks coming’ creating fear and xenophobic reactions. What’s most interesting is the fact that the areas with the most opposition to immigration are largely those with the fewest actual migrants. So what are they frightened of?
Polish supermarkets? Islam? What is it? I don’t get it.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

Again Bruce I agree with you they work, and contribute , but I still ask the question does their contribution cover the amount on of pressure, and extra cost on public services of our country, and cost wise - other countries outside the USA, Australia, New Zealand etc - you try to move there free movement wise .....
James O'brien on LBC peddling the myth of the new payment to become citizens in the UK a mere £65 how outrageous etc - til a German Lady came on settled here for forty years told him to behave she had applied easily online last night for all her family, and compared to other EU countries it was so simple - She herself thought it was a very good thing for the future - as control of immigration into the UK could now be checked.......
by the way the numbers applying is up on what was first thought were in the UK - which I am not allowed about at last a system will be in place in the future of controlled immigration and migration when Brexit is finalised - we have a skill shortage , and controlled immigration is far better than Free Movement in the present set up of the EU!

All evidence suggests it does Joe, with some left over. Just because other countries have immigration processes, doesn't make it right. I've said it what must be close to a hundred times already now, but we have in this country actual evidence to show the comparison between immigrants we control (non-EU) and EU migrants that come here under free movement. Pick any metric you like Joe. Which of those two groups do you think perform better?

 

[orchard]

People aren't still actively supporting Brexit are they?

I don't know mate, it depends on whether you count sealioning as active.

 

[Connor]

This is something, hey.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

This is something, hey.

A decent journalist would have said, okay Nigel, what does a good Brexit mean? and then not let up until the slippery toad had actually pinned his detailed colours to the mast.

 

[peteblue]

So our EU masters of the universe have retaliated to Trumps tariffs by slapping on £2.4bn of their own, thereby giving Trump the perfect excuse now to put tariffs up on ‘mostly’ German cars. German car makers are already anticipating the move and adjusting projected profits accordingly. Shares in EU car manufacturers are falling. If the Eu continue with their stubborn position regarding Brexit then the German motor industry will be in for a bad 2019.....

 

[Joey66]

All evidence suggests it does Joe, with some left over. Just because other countries have immigration processes, doesn't make it right. I've said it what must be close to a hundred times already now, but we have in this country actual evidence to show the comparison between immigrants we control (non-EU) and EU migrants that come here under free movement. Pick any metric you like Joe. Which of those two groups do you think perform better?

Obviously the controlled ones outside the EU - as they have credentials, and paperwork to go through - the will be anomalies with any system , but here's an example for you with Free movement it's so unpredictable from the EU - Tony Blair told parliment to be reassured when Poland had the chance to take us up on it instead of us getting a years grace no need stated Blair only 7-10,000 will arrive - 70-80 000 arrived in that year, that is why uncontrolled immigration is so unpredictable,and open to abuse by employers in our country to low paid workers gang masters also why do jobs get advertised in the EU and not in our Job centres first?.....

 

[Joey66]

A skills shortage that will be exacerbated by Brexit mate, as we’re creating an environment in this country that is being perceived in the EU as hostile.

Migrants haven’t only been filling skilled positions they’ve been filling plenty of unskilled roles, that British nationals either weren’t prepared to fill or due to geographical reasons weren’t there to fill.

We have always had the option of controlling migration we’ve just chosen not to administer it. It’s a complete myth that’s been bought by the populous that it’s an EU issue.

If people come here and can’t support themselves either with their own cash or via employment then they can be deported after 3 months under EU law. In exactly the same way as a tourist could be who outstayed their holiday visa period in any country around the globe. If they’ve found gainful employment and can therefore support themselves and are thus contributing to the economy they can stay, it’s that simple. What is wrong with that as a basic principle? I simply don’t get. If our economy grows and needs more employees then the EU migrants can come and fill the positions and thus enhance our economy in the process.

It’s been demonised as something that it isn’t, the Farage ‘breaking point’ posters and the Leave campaigns ‘there’s millions of Turks coming’ creating fear and xenophobic reactions. What’s most interesting is the fact that the areas with the most opposition to immigration are largely those with the fewest actual migrants. So what are they frightened of?
Polish supermarkets? Islam? What is it? I don’t get it.

Well if we are leaving the EU instead of squabbling in the house of commons and get a better elected Lords who have caused all this crap we should be sending a message out to other big countries we are open for business soon, and show the confidence not disdain of it being on a knife edge of not happening a proper Brexit saving more money in the WTO where the EU put tariffs on us.......

 

[Bruce Wayne]

Obviously the controlled ones outside the EU - as they have credentials, and paperwork to go through - the will be anomalies with any system

That isn't what happens Joe (and I've said this an awful lot of times). EU migrants are more likely to have a degree and a job than non-EU migrants. They're typically younger with fewer dependents, and as a result have less demand for public services such as schools and hospitals. I know it sounds counter-intuitive as we have no control over EU migration, but that is what the evidence shows.

As a reasonable man who is surely driven by evidence rather than dogma, are you now willing to change your mind?