Current Affairs EU In or Out

[Ruairi77]

Why ?....

Due to the history of British rule, it's unlikely the Republic would ever have entered into a borderless common trade zone with the UK on it's own.
I believe that a lot in the Republic voted to give up articles 2 and 3 of the constitution as the growth of the European common market made isolationist policies less desirable.
Using the EU as a common third party seems to have been the key to eliminating an militarized border as well as a trade border.
It is my fear that Brexit will lead to a reinstatement of a trade border which will, in time, lead to a reinstatement of a militarized border.
I hope I'm wrong.

 

[ToffeeTim]

Due to the history of British rule, it's unlikely the Republic would ever have entered into a borderless common trade zone with the UK on it's own.
I believe that a lot in the Republic voted to give up articles 2 and 3 of the constitution as the growth of the European common market made isolationist policies less desirable.
Using the EU as a common third party seems to have been the key to eliminating an militarized border as well as a trade border.
It is my fear that Brexit will lead to a reinstatement of a trade border which will, in time, lead to a reinstatement of a militarized border.
I hope I'm wrong.

Freedom of movement, freedom of employment, freedom of voting rights between UK and ROI were enshrined well before the EU in the 1947 Ireland act. There won't be any "hard" border again. The 47 act will simply function as before.

That is unless the EU seek to enforce tariffs and boundary checkpoints.....

Also, if I was a betting man ( which I'm not), I'd lump on ROI not being in the EU in 10 years time.

 

[SteveSC]

Some EU tosser today claimed the EU was responsible for bringing peace to Northern Ireland. This was all despite the fact he'd stepped foot in the country for the first time recently and spent an hour here.

As we say in Belfast, "catch yersell on mate"

So i googled his comments.

Only one new paper or website seems top pick up the comment which is the daily express. Sky, the bbc nor any of the major news outlets cover it.

Only one politician Ms Dodd seemed offended or construed it the way you and Pete did and well the journo for the daily express ( not sure of their leanings)

Unless there's other media sources that are as outraged as her and the express i have yet to see much reaction on his comments.

Nothing in any of the other UK news outlets from what i can see or the Irish media.

Is it possible Dodd overreacted and misheard what he was getting at?
And then the daily express took her comments and ran with it and you guys plus the comments people on the article are over blowing it.

I don't think for a minute he believes that but he knew they were involved somehow but weas a bit off.

 

[SteveSC]

Freedom of movement, freedom of employment, freedom of voting rights between UK and ROI were enshrined well before the EU in the 1947 Ireland act. There won't be any "hard" border again. The 47 act will simply function as before.

That is unless the EU seek to enforce tariffs and boundary checkpoints.....

Also, if I was a betting man ( which I'm not), I'd lump on ROI not being in the EU in 10 years time.

Are you referring to the Republic of Ireland ACT 1948 or the subsequent British one called the Ireland ACT 1949 based around the Republics act of 48?

Or is there another one for NI?

 

[peteblue]

Due to the history of British rule, it's unlikely the Republic would ever have entered into a borderless common trade zone with the UK on it's own.
I believe that a lot in the Republic voted to give up articles 2 and 3 of the constitution as the growth of the European common market made isolationist policies less desirable.
Using the EU as a common third party seems to have been the key to eliminating an militarized border as well as a trade border.
It is my fear that Brexit will lead to a reinstatement of a trade border which will, in time, lead to a reinstatement of a militarized border.
I hope I'm wrong.

I’m glad you mentioned history. Perhaps you might now look up the UK Ireland Common Travel Area which existed after Ireland’s independence and 50 years before we both joined the EU. The militarised borders resulted because of the troubles and no other reason. The U.K. and Ireland have always had a common trade zone. Brexit may result in a trade border, but that is up to the EU and Ireland, the U.K. have already stated they will not put one in. So, how did the EU bring peace to NI again ?......

 

[peteblue]

Considering Westminster had to rebuild our country throughout a 30 year terror campaign, the token vanity projects the EU have produced are a drop in a bucket.

We don't like people trying to bluff us. And I find people who threaten an end to the peace to further their own political agenda disgusting tbh. The worst culprit of the lot being the cretin Peter Hain who seems like he's trying to encourage paramilitaries back onto the street to back up his agenda.

Indeed, and this guy Verhofstadt is just the sort of cretin to use NI to get his way regarding the EU project......

 

[Ruairi77]

Freedom of movement, freedom of employment, freedom of voting rights between UK and ROI were enshrined well before the EU in the 1947 Ireland act. There won't be any "hard" border again. The 47 act will simply function as before.

That is unless the EU seek to enforce tariffs and boundary checkpoints.....

Also, if I was a betting man ( which I'm not), I'd lump on ROI not being in the EU in 10 years time.

I'd lump on the UK still being in the EU in 10 years
I wasn't alive pre EU/EEC but I grew up with a pretty nasty border about 20 miles away (as I'm sure, did you). I believe both Ireland and the UK being members of the EU helped that border to become non existent. I voted for the GF agreement partly because I felt both countries were part of a bigger project and the EU was helping us to work together.

 

[hullefc]

So i googled his comments.

Only one new paper or website seems top pick up the comment which is the daily express. Sky, the bbc nor any of the major news outlets cover it.

Only one politician Ms Dodd seemed offended or construed it the way you and Pete did and well the journo for the daily express ( not sure of their leanings)

Unless there's other media sources that are as outraged as her and the express i have yet to see much reaction on his comments.

Nothing in any of the other UK news outlets from what i can see or the Irish media.

Is it possible Dodd overreacted and misheard what he was getting at?
And then the daily express took her comments and ran with it and you guys plus the comments people on the article are over blowing it.

I don't think for a minute he believes that but he knew they were involved somehow but weas a bit off.

There is a debate going on in the European parliament about Brexit. As the island of Ireland is one of the issues, they are debating what to do about borders. Northern Ireland will probably have special status that will keep it in the EU with the 4 freedoms and under the jurisdiction of the ECJ.
There will be no border on the Island of Ireland but there will be one in the North to check goods coming in from the rest of the UK. Those goods may well have to pay a tariff if they're is no agreement between the EU and the UK. There will be checks in the North of Ireland on EU citizens that may want to enter the rest of the UK if the UK government has immigration controls on EU citizens. as they can freely move into Ireland from the rest of Europe.

The debate has been going on since Monday.
Edit. The Tories get enraged about anything the EU does or does not do. See Gove making a pigs ear of himself over the export of pigs to China.

 

[SteveSC]

There is a debate going on in the European parliament about Brexit. As the island of Ireland is one of the issues, they are debating what to do about borders. Northern Ireland will probably have special status that will keep it in the EU with the 4 freedoms and under the jurisdiction of the ECJ.
There will be no border on the Island of Ireland but there will be one in the North to check goods coming in from the rest of the UK. Those goods may well have to pay a tariff if they're is no agreement between the EU and the UK. There will be checks in the North of Ireland on EU citizens that may want to enter the rest of the UK if the UK government has immigration controls on EU citizens. as they can freely move into Ireland from the rest of Europe.

The debate has been going on since Monday.

I don't want to sound i am being a smart ass but i know and i'm not sure how my quoted comments apply to your post.

Don't get me wrong what you typed is pretty good but again not sure how it applies.

I am from Ireland but i live in the US but i keep up with European and Irish affairs. That being said his comments were news to me because i hadn't read anywhere were anyone was upset about his speech until i googled it and it seemed one media outlet and one MEP from NI seemed to take offense.

 

[peteblue]

I'd lump on the UK still being in the EU in 10 years
I wasn't alive pre EU/EEC but I grew up with a pretty nasty border about 20 miles away (as I'm sure, did you). I believe both Ireland and the UK being members of the EU helped that border to become non existent. I voted for the GF agreement partly because I felt both countries were part of a bigger project and the EU was helping us to work together.

So you’ve only known the EU, yet even though Ireland and the U.K. put in place common travel and trade zones before the EU existed, you believe that the EU are responsible for the peace. Earlier I was attacked for suggesting that the EU is brainwashing the young......

 

[Ruairi77]

I’m glad you mentioned history. Perhaps you might now look up the UK Ireland Common Travel Area which existed after Ireland’s independence and 50 years before we both joined the EU. The militarised borders resulted because of the troubles and no other reason. The U.K. and Ireland have always had a common trade zone. Brexit may result in a trade border, but that is up to the EU and Ireland, the U.K. have already stated they will not put one in. So, how did the EU bring peace to NI again ?......

There were trade deals in place but there was a customs border in place between Dundalk and Newry from 1923 to 1993, there was a military presence at the same point from the early 70's till around 2005
So post 2005 was pretty much the first time since independence that there was no customs/military border between Dundalk and Newry

 

[SteveSC]

So you’ve only known the EU, yet even though Ireland and the U.K. put in place common travel and trade zones before the EU existed, you believe that the EU are responsible for the peace. Earlier I was attacked for suggesting that the EU is brainwashing the young......

Stop being a drama queen. I never "attacked" you over that comment.

Did i suggest that its a conspiracy theorist view and a bit outrageous yes but attack haha!!

Pete you are something else. You can never see anyone else point of view and when you deem something is personal you get bent out of shape but then you subtly or not so subtly insult that person and "attack" (seen as you like that word) with your anti EU rhetoric.

Also stop trying put words in peoples mouths either that or you misinterpret a lot

In my posts in other posts and well now Ruairis post you are doing that.

 

[Ruairi77]

So you’ve only known the EU, yet even though Ireland and the U.K. put in place common travel and trade zones before the EU existed, you believe that the EU are responsible for the peace. Earlier I was attacked for suggesting that the EU is brainwashing the young......

Im 40, but thanks

 

[peteblue]

So i googled his comments.

Only one new paper or website seems top pick up the comment which is the daily express. Sky, the bbc nor any of the major news outlets cover it.

Only one politician Ms Dodd seemed offended or construed it the way you and Pete did and well the journo for the daily express ( not sure of their leanings)

Unless there's other media sources that are as outraged as her and the express i have yet to see much reaction on his comments.

Nothing in any of the other UK news outlets from what i can see or the Irish media.

Is it possible Dodd overreacted and misheard what he was getting at?
And then the daily express took her comments and ran with it and you guys plus the comments people on the article are over blowing it.

I don't think for a minute he believes that but he knew they were involved somehow but weas a bit off.

The same people claim credit for peace in Europe, forgetting the efforts of many allied countries, NATO, and the standing armies of the US and the U.K. in Germany. But no, it was all down to the EU.......of course when the Yugoslav wars broke out, again it was NATO and not any EU commission that brought peace......

 

[Ruairi77]

So you’ve only known the EU, yet even though Ireland and the U.K. put in place common travel and trade zones before the EU existed, you believe that the EU are responsible for the peace. Earlier I was attacked for suggesting that the EU is brainwashing the young......

Seems like you could do with learning a bit more about the border