Current Affairs EU In or Out

In or Out

  • In

    Votes: 688 67.9%
  • Out

    Votes: 325 32.1%

  • Total voters
    1,013
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Yesterday's man Duncan Smith can threaten all he wants but it wont get him far. It's like he's shouting in an empty room and just taking one foot out of his mouth to be replaced by the other.

Citizens rights - there has been no concrete proposals about what rights EU citizens will have after Brexit. Not only is the Home Office sending people back to their country even though it breaks EU laws - UK treatment of foreign nationals 'could colour' MEPs’ view on Brexit - Amber Rudd has been found in breach of UK law by deporting people against the rulings of the courts, If Amber Rudd can't explain why she defied the courts, she should go. No wonder the EU negotiators are perplexed by what the UK wants on Citizen's rights.

Financial settlement - as long as the UK are in the EU, including during the transition period. There has been no information to say what May offered but reported that it was £20 billion. Well she'll be at odds with Johnson, Gove and Rees Mogg who continue to claim that the EU cost the UK the EU £17.5 billion per year (£350 million per week). No wonder the EU sit there bemused b when a Tory government person opens their mouth. What it is like behind closed doors can only be gauged by the EU's reaction.

The island of Ireland - under the Good Friday Agreement there is free movement of goods, capital, services and people throughout the island, as cross border institutes show. EU citizens, whether that be in the north of the island - Irish passport holders - or the south can reside anywhere on the island. As EU citizens they come under the jurisdiction of the European Court of Justice. In relation to the ECJ the Northern Ireland Act 1998 makes reference to the ECJ in scrutiny of Bills.

Scrutiny and stages of Bills


Reconsideration where reference made to ECJ.

The May government has not put forward any concrete proposals to deal with the border issue. They haven't put forward any concrete proposals to deal with Irish citizen rights of those residing in the north of the island. They haven't explained to the UK population when they will amend the Northern Ireland Act to take out the role of the ECJ.

It is plainly wrong for anyone in the government to say that the ECJ will not have jurisdiction over the UK as they will in the north of the Ireland. As it is plainly wrong to claim that when the UK leaves the EU it will not be part of the single market or customs union - as they will in the north of the island of Ireland. It is becoming increasingly clear that the island of Ireland will have special status and the Tories silence on this reality - gaining more and more ground within the EU as the only viable option to preserve the Good Friday Agreement as it stands - is down to needing the DUP politically, who are venomously against such a special status deal as they were/are against the Good Friday Agreement. The Tories ambiguity on this issue is driven by their political survival.

Iain Duncan Smith: Brexit. Why the Government must prepare for no deal now.

Yesterday's man Duncan Smith is oblivious to these realities. And incredibly says about the CBI - "Instead of listening to the bleating of the CBI, we should recognise that further delay is not in our favour". I thought the Tories wanted to take back 'control' because 'that is what business is telling us' and 'we listen to business'. That is unless business -CBI -are not on message. The Institute of Directors wants access to the EU through EFTA while the City wants 'passporting rights' for access to the EU - even if it needs paying for. Yesterday's man will claim they are all 'bleating' for their own sectional interests.

"In conclusion, any agreement must not bind future Governments. While, clearly, any UK Government will wish to cooperate with the EU as an ally, areas of foreign policy, such as defence, border control, judicial authority, agriculture, fisheries, environment, energy, trade policy must be fully returned to the UK. A series of binding side deals would be unacceptable".

But most of what Duncan Smith talks about, will not imply to the north of the island of Ireland as there are cross border institutes. His silence on this and contradictory mutterings show he obviously doesn't know his backside from his elbow. He shoots from the hip in an attempt to sound tough instead it just makes him look weak and full of wind.

The Tories are in a mess and the open civil war over Brexit will damage them politically. They are on borrowed time.
 
Yesterday's man Duncan Smith can threaten all he wants but it wont get him far. It's like he's shouting in an empty room and just taking one foot out of his mouth to be replaced by the other.

Citizens rights - there has been no concrete proposals about what rights EU citizens will have after Brexit. Not only is the Home Office sending people back to their country even though it breaks EU laws - UK treatment of foreign nationals 'could colour' MEPs’ view on Brexit - Amber Rudd has been found in breach of UK law by deporting people against the rulings of the courts, If Amber Rudd can't explain why she defied the courts, she should go. No wonder the EU negotiators are perplexed by what the UK wants on Citizen's rights.

Financial settlement - as long as the UK are in the EU, including during the transition period. There has been no information to say what May offered but reported that it was £20 billion. Well she'll be at odds with Johnson, Gove and Rees Mogg who continue to claim that the EU cost the UK the EU £17.5 billion per year (£350 million per week). No wonder the EU sit there bemused b when a Tory government person opens their mouth. What it is like behind closed doors can only be gauged by the EU's reaction.

The island of Ireland - under the Good Friday Agreement there is free movement of goods, capital, services and people throughout the island, as cross border institutes show. EU citizens, whether that be in the north of the island - Irish passport holders - or the south can reside anywhere on the island. As EU citizens they come under the jurisdiction of the European Court of Justice. In relation to the ECJ the Northern Ireland Act 1998 makes reference to the ECJ in scrutiny of Bills.

Scrutiny and stages of Bills


Reconsideration where reference made to ECJ.

The May government has not put forward any concrete proposals to deal with the border issue. They haven't put forward any concrete proposals to deal with Irish citizen rights of those residing in the north of the island. They haven't explained to the UK population when they will amend the Northern Ireland Act to take out the role of the ECJ.

It is plainly wrong for anyone in the government to say that the ECJ will not have jurisdiction over the UK as they will in the north of the Ireland. As it is plainly wrong to claim that when the UK leaves the EU it will not be part of the single market or customs union - as they will in the north of the island of Ireland. It is becoming increasingly clear that the island of Ireland will have special status and the Tories silence on this reality - gaining more and more ground within the EU as the only viable option to preserve the Good Friday Agreement as it stands - is down to needing the DUP politically, who are venomously against such a special status deal as they were/are against the Good Friday Agreement. The Tories ambiguity on this issue is driven by their political survival.

Iain Duncan Smith: Brexit. Why the Government must prepare for no deal now.

Yesterday's man Duncan Smith is oblivious to these realities. And incredibly says about the CBI - "Instead of listening to the bleating of the CBI, we should recognise that further delay is not in our favour". I thought the Tories wanted to take back 'control' because 'that is what business is telling us' and 'we listen to business'. That is unless business -CBI -are not on message. The Institute of Directors wants access to the EU through EFTA while the City wants 'passporting rights' for access to the EU - even if it needs paying for. Yesterday's man will claim they are all 'bleating' for their own sectional interests.

"In conclusion, any agreement must not bind future Governments. While, clearly, any UK Government will wish to cooperate with the EU as an ally, areas of foreign policy, such as defence, border control, judicial authority, agriculture, fisheries, environment, energy, trade policy must be fully returned to the UK. A series of binding side deals would be unacceptable".

But most of what Duncan Smith talks about, will not imply to the north of the island of Ireland as there are cross border institutes. His silence on this and contradictory mutterings show he obviously doesn't know his backside from his elbow. He shoots from the hip in an attempt to sound tough instead it just makes him look weak and full of wind.

The Tories are in a mess and the open civil war over Brexit will damage them politically. They are on borrowed time.

Well I hope you are happy.....
 
The pound has tanked, growth has slowed, foreign investment has dried up, the banking sector are actively planning to relocate jobs to the EU, inflation is up, disposable income is being squeezed, consumer spending is slowing.......yeah none of it Pete.

The latest polls show that if there was another vote tomorrow Remain would win. If that vote came in 2/3 years time - when over 2m youngsters would be added to the electoral role since June 2016, and over 1m leave voters would be in the ground, Remain would walk it.

Absolute cobblers....the pound is where it needs to be, exports are going through the roof, employment is growing, foreign investment continues, the banking sector may open some small offices in the EU and the rest is just talking ourselves down....

As for your latest polls....

Wells%20piece%201-01.png


https://yougov.co.uk/news/2017/06/15/majority-favour-pushing-brexit-many-are-tempted-so/
 
lol

in just four words, the utter insanity of Brexit

Don't be silly now. The Prime Minister was setting out a framework and helping to readjust the temperature of the talks by effectively talking directly to the heads of the other EU nations. From a global perspective she will have come over as putting both a generous and open offer to the EU. The 'detail' falls behind it.......she would have been talking for about five years putting across the detail, because unless she tells you every last point someone will say "we need more detail".....
 
Absolute cobblers....the pound is where it needs to be, exports are going through the roof, employment is growing, foreign investment continues, the banking sector may open some small offices in the EU and the rest is just talking ourselves down....

As for your latest polls....

Wells%20piece%201-01.png


https://yougov.co.uk/news/2017/06/15/majority-favour-pushing-brexit-many-are-tempted-so/
The pound has tanked to a level where it really doesn't need to be, and you have the temerity to call 'cobblers'? lol

Exports have increased due to the tanked currency, but we have a trade deficit ffs, and therefore inflation is touching 3%.

Your selective poll selection wasn't one that asks the simple question, given the chance again which way would you vote, and those polls currently have Remain ahead. You also swerved the simple facts around the country's demographics should there be another vote in 2/3 years time.

Stop press: Labour have just refused to rule out a 2nd referendum......
 
Don't be silly now. The Prime Minister was setting out a framework and helping to readjust the temperature of the talks by effectively talking directly to the heads of the other EU nations. From a global perspective she will have come over as putting both a generous and open offer to the EU. The 'detail' falls behind it.......she would have been talking for about five years putting across the detail, because unless she tells you every last point someone will say "we need more detail".....

The vote to leave was well over a year ago Pete. Why has it taken the government so long to even get to a 'mission statement'? I don't think it's asking much here for the people who campaigned for this to be at a slightly more advanced stage than platitudes, don't you?
 
The vote to leave was well over a year ago Pete. Why has it taken the government so long to even get to a 'mission statement'? I don't think it's asking much here for the people who campaigned for this to be at a slightly more advanced stage than platitudes, don't you?

Let me take a stab:

"Brexit Means Brexit! And the details will just sort themselves out, if only you lot would stop fussing so much."
 
The pound has tanked to a level where it really doesn't need to be, and you have the temerity to call 'cobblers'? lol

Exports have increased due to the tanked currency, but we have a trade deficit ffs, and therefore inflation is touching 3%.



The international trade expert strikes again. :D

The deficit is increasing all the time but possibly the most worrying feature recently is that trade with non Eu countries is only decreasing. We are becoming increasingly reliant on trade with the EU the further we get into this Article 50 timeline.
 

What May said and the reality.

"I am clear that the guarantee I am giving on your rights is real. And I doubt anyone with real experience of the UK would doubt the independence of our courts or of the rigour with which they will uphold people’s legal rights".

EU nationals deportation letters an 'unfortunate error', says May
Home Office mistakenly sent up to 100 letters to EU citizens telling them to leave UK or face removal

The rigour with which Tory politicians uphold the rule of Law.

"The Home Office ignored judges on three occasions to deport asylum seeker Samim Bigzad. It’s hard to overstate the significance of this."

No wonder the EU negotiators don't believe what the Tories say when faced with what is happening.
 
The vote to leave was well over a year ago Pete. Why has it taken the government so long to even get to a 'mission statement'? I don't think it's asking much here for the people who campaigned for this to be at a slightly more advanced stage than platitudes, don't you?
problem being Bruce, May didn't want to leave as many in parliament didn't, so no real desire to get on with it, they have let the EU set the agenda instead of themselves and quite frankly look a shambles.
 
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