Current Affairs EU In or Out

In or Out

  • In

    Votes: 688 67.9%

  • Out

    Votes: 325 32.1%
  • Total voters
    1,013
Status
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Ruairi77 said:
The UK made concessions in order to join the single market. They can choose, as they are doing, to end this deal and the concessions which are part of it. This would suggest to me that they are sovereign. They have the ultimate say on what happens to their country.
Massachusetts can not choose to exit the USA, it is not Sovereign. The USA can choose to exit NAFTA. It is sovereign.
Every country makes concessions to one extent or another in the name of global trade. It is a question over who has the ultimate control over these concessions. In the case of the UK, it's clear that they have the ultimate say and there fore are sovereign.
If the EU as a block, forbid them to end the deal and leave, they would not be sovereign.
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These 'concessions' of which you speak were understood to be giving up elements of sovereignty. I think the loss of control of immigration is a bit more than a 'concession'.......
 
If you own the home you live in, you have say over who comes and goes.
If you own the home but rent it out, you dont have that say but you're still the home owner.
You can choose to move back in and control who visits at any point.
 
Ruairi77 said:
If you own the home you live in, you have say over who comes and goes.
If you own the home but rent it out, you dont have that say but you're still the home owner.
You can choose to move back in and control who visits at any point.
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Welcome home......
 
Ruairi77 said:
Unlike the Trump stuff, I've no major beef with anyone who wants to leave the EU. I wouldn't have voted that way myself but can understand why one might. I just don't think the UK lost it's sovereignty. It made massive concessions but never gave up it's sovereignty.
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I all of South America could enter the USA without your say so you may take a slightly different position......
 
Seanjd said:
As the people of Britain decided that we are leaving the EU, I think it is fair that they also decide how it is done. Many people have learned many things about the EU since the referendum which they didn't know beforehand. I know I have. On certain issues, minds have been changed and people have been convinced either way. We are left now with a Prime Minister who has been chosen by her party, not by the people, to make ultimate decisions about an issue which is not only incredibly divisive but was also so close in result.

For example - I would guess that many who voted were not totally clued up about the link between free movement and the single market. I bet lots of people who voted to end free movement didn't know that it also meant we would not be able to access the single market. So why not ask the people to vote on whether leaving the EU means also leaving the single market - or perhaps the public have changed their mind about weighing up the pros and cons of the free movement/single market issue. Other countries have had referendums on similar.
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Guessing how and why people voted doesn't do it for me. We voted to leave, nothing further to add. Other countries have indeed have referendums, eg France and Ireland , but the EU didn't like the result so they were forced to do it again until the "correct" decision was arrived at. The more I look at the EU the more I am reminded of George Orwell's 1984 and Animal Farm.
 
bluecol said:
Guessing how and why people voted doesn't do it for me. We voted to leave, nothing further to add. Other countries have indeed have referendums, eg France and Ireland , but the EU didn't like the result so they were forced to do it again until the "correct" decision was arrived at. The more I look at the EU the more I am reminded of George Orwell's 1984 and Animal Farm.
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Agree with you about much of that but I am interested in why people vote the way they do. I have a lot of faith in them and by understanding this we can better learn what is ok about the country and what needs to be changed.

It's pretty obvious to me that a lot of people in the country feel left behind or with few prospects and they accordingly voted for change.

Also to ignore their feelings on immigration would be a mistake as they will be seeing something genuine there and not just be being racist
 
Frankly I cant be bothered about finer points of definitions of sovereignity but it's seems pretty obvious to me that we can't do what we want in a wide variety of areas under the EU which is why I voted leave.
 
JonS said:
Agree with you about much of that but I am interested in why people vote the way they do. I have a lot of faith in them and by understanding this we can better learn what is ok about the country and what needs to be changed.

It's pretty obvious to me that a lot of people in the country feel left behind or with few prospects and they accordingly voted for change.

Also to ignore their feelings on immigration would be a mistake as they will be seeing something genuine there and not just be being racist
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At the same time, however, it is important to take into account and not ignore factors things like media bias. If you look, for example, at major news outlets and which side of the debate they endorsed, the circulation for papers backing the leave campaign was far higher than the remain. The same can be said about how the media support different political parties and the impact that has. Look at the conservatives today and Labour with a certain Rupert Murdoch paper in '97.
 
JonS said:
Agree with you about much of that but I am interested in why people vote the way they do. I have a lot of faith in them and by understanding this we can better learn what is ok about the country and what needs to be changed.

It's pretty obvious to me that a lot of people in the country feel left behind or with few prospects and they accordingly voted for change.

Also to ignore their feelings on immigration would be a mistake as they will be seeing something genuine there and not just be being racist
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You would think, then, that we would have seen a change of government by now as government has FAR greater impact on people's lives in this country than the EU does.
 
bluecol said:
Guessing how and why people voted doesn't do it for me. We voted to leave, nothing further to add. Other countries have indeed have referendums, eg France and Ireland , but the EU didn't like the result so they were forced to do it again until the "correct" decision was arrived at. The more I look at the EU the more I am reminded of George Orwell's 1984 and Animal Farm.
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That isn't true. Ireland voted twice on whether to accept the Treaty of Nice or not. The first time, they voted against. Amendments were made to reflect the concerns of the Irish people and the population voted for in the second referendum, which meant that Ireland didn't have to join the common defence policy. Surely this shows that the EU accept certain stipulations of it's members?

You will also find that Sweden and Denmark voted against joining the Euro through a referendum and so didn't have to.
 
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