Current Affairs Donald Trump POS: Judgement cometh and that right soon

[mezzrow]

I don't think so

I honestly don't know, Prev. Bernie's advantage is that he was clearly an outsider to the "ruling class" and represented the views of his voters in Vermont, which honestly lies pretty far outside the American mainstream. His great advantage is that he was the most honest guy running. We have to guess whether Trump or Hillary would do what they said they would (guess who lost that?), but Bernie wasn't "sophisticated" enough in the glossy media packaging sense to load you up with the BS. Bernie was a mainstream Socialist in the tradition of UK socialism. He wasn't running in the UK, though.

Yet, Vermont just elected themselves a Republican governor. Do we contradict ourselves?

Every day.

 

[Prevenger17]

I honestly don't know, Prev.

It's impossible to say, of course. But I don't think that saying he would have fared better than Hillary would be much of a stretch

 

[Mountfield1985]

Sorry, misread your post. Aye, Sanders would have been ripped apart by the Republican campaign, but what's new? He's a tough old boot and was far more tapped into a deep-rooted desire for change than Hillary. He wouldn't have lost the likes of Wisconsin, that's for sure

Possibly mate.

Though when elections are swung in states like Florida, and the punishment for losing would be Donald Trump, I think it would have been an irresponsible move to nominate a socialist.

So sad the way it has turned out.

 

[abelard]

I honestly don't know, Prev. Bernie's advantage is that he was clearly an outsider to the "ruling class" and represented the views of his voters in Vermont, which honestly lies pretty far outside the American mainstream. His great advantage is that he was the most honest guy running. We have to guess whether Trump or Hillary would do what they said they would (guess who lost that?), but Bernie wasn't "sophisticated" enough in the glossy media packaging sense to load you up with the BS. Bernie was a mainstream Socialist in the tradition of UK socialism. He wasn't running in the UK, though.

Yet, Vermont just elected themselves a Republican governor. Do we contradict ourselves?

Every day.

A Republican in Vermont is barely recognizable to Republicans anywhere else in the country though... Vermonters don't really see their local politics in national tribal terms

 

[mezzrow]

It's impossible to say, of course. But I don't think that saying he would have fared better than Hillary would be much of a stretch

I do. You don't how many Hillary voters wouldn't vote for Bernie. Bernie did lousy with black and Latino voters, for example. For some reason, he got no resonance there.

My wife's Latino hairdresser and her whole family basically voted for Trump, for example. She volunteered that some weeks ago. It was about law and order issues, afaik. This is a different kind of place, like I said.

 

[JLW]

What has that got to do with me?



and here is the thing. You have proven my point, you are buying up the media lies just like they want you to. Or at least the face of it all.

donald trump talks about illegal immigrants, you talk about families with 'wrong paperwork'. He mentions criminals, you mention minority communities. See the difference here? It is a generalisation of the point that is being driven by the media that all this is going to happen yet these minorities voted for him? From what i can tell from everything trump has said, anyone legally in america is fine, any criminal who shouldn't be here will be deported. But let me guess, i am also a racist for saying that? I am basing that thought on what he has said to the country, but because i don't buy into this lie that he is deporting anyone who isn't white it makes me a racist as well?


Oh and Obama did the exact same thing!!!!!! But that isn't part of the argument here is it? Doesn't get used negatively against Obama, only trump.

Great point mate, like myself you will be deemed a racist for not agreeing with the mainstream media of what they are trying to portray about Trump!

He's deporting illegals but yes they choose not to put that important little word in there reports. The fact that he got elected means there's a lot more people of all different colour/creed/religion that voted for him! Just white votes wouldn't have been enough.

 

[Prevenger17]

I think it would have been an irresponsible move to nominate a socialist.

I think it's that sort of thinking that the DNC shot themselves with. They misread the appetite for change, and very undemocratically foisted the anti-change candidate on to democrat voters. It was a cataclysmic failure of courage

 

[Prevenger17]

My wife's Latino hairdresser and her whole family basically voted for Trump, for example. She volunteered that some weeks ago. It was about law and order issues, afaik. This is a different kind of place, like I said.

I would bow to your empirical wisdom in that respect. My main beef was with how the DNC just handed the nomination to Hillary, there must have been better candidates, even if not Sanders.

 

[Mountfield1985]

I think it's that sort of thinking that the DNC shot themselves with. They misread the appetite for change, and very undemocratically foisted the anti-change candidate on to democrat voters. It was a cataclysmic failure of courage

I agree, but it's very easy to say in hindsight. At the time, it would have been a massive gamble.

 

[Ashtonian]

Firstly, he lost every demographic about from white men and women. Minorities across the board voted Clinton.

Don't think the overall topic has much room for debate so leave it there. But the line i have quoted from yourself mate.

One little bug i have with what you say, how do i put it into words?

He won.

Which again kinda supports my argument here, about believing the media.

So if trump lost the White men and women vote, as well as the minority vote, that does kind of limit who could have possibly have voted for him, and yet he won?

In a fair election as well. SO i would be interested in hearing how Trump won the presidency without having the support from any demographic and losing the vote to them all?

 

[mezzrow]

A Republican in Vermont is barely recognizable to Republicans anywhere else in the country though... Vermonters don't really see their local politics in national tribal terms

Granted, I believe you know Vermont politics far better than I do. And Republicans in Vermont are not like Republicans in Georgia.

Not that that would relate to any Federalism discussion, but that's another matter.

Still, I think that the same forces that forced Hillary into the nomination and forced Bernie out were the same forces America rejected with the Trump vote. He was the only candidate from outside the system. It's a moot point. The party structure of the GOP couldn't stop Trump, while the Democratic politburo could and did stop Bernie.

Old curmudgeons like me would say there's a lesson there...

 

[mezzrow]

i would be interested in hearing how Trump won the presidency without having the support from any demographic and losing the vote to them all?

 

[Prevenger17]

I agree, but it's very easy to say in hindsight.

I said it at the time tbf.

I don't think it was a small thing, and it was enough for Debbie Schultz to have to resign. Between the coverage the Democratic nomination received and the favoritism showed by the DNC throughout the entire process, you'd swear there was only one candidate in the whole process. There are plenty of reservations to be had. People almost apologetically acknowledge that she is in the pocket of so many companies and special interests, and intend to vote for her anyway.

 

[Ashtonian]

admittedly that is over my head i think. what does that mean?

 

[Mountfield1985]

Don't think the overall topic has much room for debate so leave it there. But the line i have quoted from yourself mate.

One little bug i have with what you say, how do i put it into words?

He won.

Which again kinda supports my argument here, about believing the media.

So if trump lost the White men and women vote, as well as the minority vote, that does kind of limit who could have possibly have voted for him, and yet he won?

In a fair election as well. SO i would be interested in hearing how Trump won the presidency without having the support from any demographic and losing the vote to them all?

Sorry that should have read "he lost every demographic apart from white men and women"

Typo.