Current Affairs Donald Trump POS: Judgement cometh and that right soon

[Ruairi77]

You never answered the Question, just came back with your own question

This started because I asked you a question which you responded to with your own question. I then did the same and you called me out.
you're an idiot (I'll take a ban if it's warranted, it'll be worth it)

 

[Yoda]

No the Union is the North who fought against slavery. Obviously it is impossible to tell if every man supported slavery. However a good way to see that it was absolutely a reason that many fought for is to read the secession documents from each state. They don't really hide that continuing slavery was something they wanted to fight for

Come on seriously, the average flag waving man fought for keeping slavery? Certain leadership people yeah, but the MAN, no way!!

 

[Pittsburgh Footy]

Come on seriously, the average flag waving man fought for keeping slavery? Certain leadership people yeah, but the MAN, no way!!

I think you should come over here, rent a car and drive through large swaths of the US, mate.

It'll be an eye-opener

 

[Yoda]

Yoda - when do you think most Confederate statues were built?

Hint: most were in the 1900s, and there was a reason for them to exist that wasn't about simply remembering fallen soldiers and states rights

Without going to google I wouldn’t know, but I do know it’s a deep ingrained part of US history, don’t need to be a nerdy historian to know that. But I’m pretty sure the so called winners should not be able to tear down and desecrate the history of the southern people

 

[TheBigIguana]

Come on seriously, the average flag waving man fought for keeping slavery? Certain leadership people yeah, but the MAN, no way!!

Were the Americans in the revolution fighting for the ideas in the Declaration of Independence? It too was written by leadership but my guess is the common man, or at least a good portion of them, believed in it. I feel the same applies here

 

[TheBigIguana]

TBH the biggest indicator of whether they supported slavery or not is what they did after they'd lost - ie: pretend that they hadn't, enforce segregation - often at the end of a rope - and spend the next hundred years making it illegal to even marry outside of ones race.

Yeah people act like the end of Slavery was the end of racism. Now people act like the Civil Rights act ended it. Neither are true

 

[Yoda]

I think you should come over here, rent a car and drive through large swaths of the US, mate.

It'll be an eye-opener

Don’t want to go over this again, but I’ve basically spent 10 years of my life in the USA, I have spent no less then 1 month each year in the country over the last 30 yrs,
My miles rewards would shame everyone. Got some great friends from all over your country

 

[dholliday]

This is not true. A historical remnant would be something like a battlefield or the house where Lee surrendered to Grant. A statue of Lee is not the same thing

It would depend how old these statues were, and for what purpose they were built, and what they now represented.

I've no problem calling these statues something else if not historical remnants, it's a minor semantic argument.

Rather have a more conservative rep supporting my argument, but I suppose you’re the best backup I’ve got

I'm not anyone's backup in that sense, matey. I'm often in disagreement with many on here, but I like to believe I'm able to think neutrally (like a historian, researcher or scientist would) so hopefully am able to see both arguments. So sometimes you'll make a good point and I'll 'back you up' on that, but other times you'll make a weak argument and I'll call you out on that too.

I've learnt something new these last couple of days, honestly didn't know much about what support for the confederates might mean. Our fellow blues have put in solid arguments, I'm inclined to side with that for now. But it would be useful to hear from conservative US blues.

@mezzrow
@TX Bill
@ItsOKImAPilot

There's no such wish. Remembering confederate history is very important.
Honouring it is not.

Fair distinction.

 

[TheBigIguana]

It would depend how old these statues were, and for what purpose they were built, and what they now represented.

I've no problem calling these statues something else if not historical remnants, it's a minor semantic argument.





I'm not anyone's backup in that sense, matey. I'm often in disagreement with many on here, but I like to believe I'm able to think neutrally (like a historian, researcher or scientist would) so hopefully am able to see both arguments. So sometimes you'll make a good point and I'll 'back you up' on that, but other times you'll make a weak argument and I'll call you out on that too.

I've learnt something new these last couple of days, honestly didn't know much about what support for the confederates might mean. Our fellow blues have put in solid arguments, I'm inclined to side with that for now. But it would be useful to hear from conservative US blues.

@mezzrow
@TX Bill
@ItsOKImAPilot





Fair distinction.

What @Ruairi77 said is basically my point. The statues on the battlefield that say this unit was positioned here I can live with. A Lee statue commomerating him in the middle of Richmond is not ok. It's honoring someone for rebellion and support of enslavement of Africans

 

[Ruairi77]

If you're not living in the states and want a better idea of race relations and why the confederate flag might be such a lightning rod, check out 13th on Netflix.

 

[Yoda]

What @Ruairi77 said is basically my point. The statues on the battlefield that say this unit was positioned here I can live with. A Lee statue commomerating him in the middle of Richmond is not ok. It's honoring someone for rebellion and support of enslavement of Africans

I’ll take that anyday if you’re flexible enough to agree, disagree it’s the blinkered “no matter what is said” person makes me despair

 

[Yoda]

"Ripping down statues" doesn't erase history.

It just presents a path to no longer idolize/romanticize it

This is important when a very large group of people think about it as a way that represents oppression[/QUOTE
I want to expand on this point!
Here you are advocating destroying statues,monuments etc, yes?
If you read in here some of my history, I have a total dislike, utter contempt for the religion and ideology of Islam. To the point I’m getting pressed to being rascist, even though Islam is not a race!

But if someone said to me let’s destroy all statues, monuments relating to Islam, I’d be the first to oppose and insist they are kept for the respect of the people who believed in it and for future generations to visit and have their opinions on, right or wrong.

It should never be up to a group of people to decide what should stand and what should be destroyed.

To be honest you sound like a university lecturer in your views

 

[roydo]

What @Ruairi77 said is basically my point. The statues on the battlefield that say this unit was positioned here I can live with. A Lee statue commomerating him in the middle of Richmond is not ok. It's honoring someone for rebellion and support of enslavement of Africans

Merica confuses me, so please bear that in mind with this random question. Been reading about the confederate flag being a symbol that gets mixed reviews, so to speak, and a statue of General Lee.

So, and apologies if this sounds trite and/or offensive, but would the 1970s/80s TV version of The Dukes of Hazard be seen in a different light these days? (Confederate flag/General Lee being the car) Much like some sit coms in 1970s UK would not see the light of day today.

 

[Yoda]

This started because I asked you a question which you responded to with your own question. I then did the same and you called me out.
you're an idiot (I'll take a ban if it's warranted, it'll be worth it)

What question? At least someone on the mods board have said they will ban you. So go on

 

[Pittsburgh Footy]