2025/26 David Moyes

[Jokerdan]

If you're right about that Dan then how do you explain Moyes not utilising young players when a. We were safe from relegation and b. When we had no chance of either going down or getting into Europe?

Moyes is Moyes , leopards don't change their spots. Moyes never develop young players.

Tongue firmly in cheek. I know it, you know it, we all know it. Just got out of bed on the wrong side this morning and wanted to provoke a reaction in someone.

And I guess you are the someone...but you aren't wrong, either...and neither are the others who may or may not have agreed with my 'take' on the DM tenure.

I just feel that we are really not going forward but stagnating into a 'comfortable' mid table team with an occasional Cup 'run' to placate the fans, something which is far from acceptable for a Club of our stature and history.

 

[Curtis]

@bicycleheader back from a lengthy ban post derby reaction.

As I said earlier in this thread months ago, he can go if he doesn't finish top half.

I thought things were looking promising but the run we went on after that Chelsea match has been horrific and he's done himself no favours.

Thanks for the season and a half from me but I am absolutely ready to move on.

I see that the Angus Kinnear thread is finally getting the attention it deserves. There are BIG QUESTIONS over that summer recruitment for me.

Everyone who hates Moyes wants to lay it at his feet but there were many other people who need to answer for those signing choices imo.

He signed off on the players Jake and he wasn't going to ever to utilize those players because he has an established track record of playing a squad of the same preferred players who are older like he did this season. He was the one who didn't prioritize a right back because he was okay with O'Brien playing there. He's become more rigid and unwilling to break from routines and he cost us Europe

Also Moyes is about always having some form of control over recruitment, it's the reason we don't have a DOF (unlike roma) and a transfer committee instead

 

[Marcus Kendall]

I'm not sure I agree with the whole 'modern football is a poor level' argument to be honest. It's different obviously, but I'm not sure it's worse, and let's be honest literally every generation in history has argued that it was better in the old days. The point is though, these are still very good teams in the context of the current world of football, we can't really ask teams to travel back into the past to play teams we deem to be of the right quality, you can only beat what's in front of you and facing teams who are finishing in the top 4 in the big 5 leagues is the level you'd always have expected to face in the second tier of European competition. It's probably worth remembering that UCD, Inter Bratislava, Fortuna Sittard and Rapid Vienna aren't exactly European powerhouses.

I'm 49 and I've watched football through the late 80s to now and I can confidently say football now is at its worst level and if you look at the traditional powerhouses in both club and International football they are far from their vintage best

 

[blue1948]

I have stop posting about this Dinosaur as it coming between me and my beauty sleep . Enough to say this is the least concerned in 75 years I have been in what comes next . Thanks Davey

 

[MACCA75]

I'm 49 and I've watched football through the late 80s to now and I can confidently say football now is at its worst level and if you look at the traditional powerhouses in both club and International football they are far from their vintage best

Had this debate many times.. whilst it’s true that the very top sides aren’t at their absolute best recently (certainly in the Prem), the overall standard in the Prem is much higher than it was say 20 years ago.

Chelsea finished 10th with genuine top talent like Palmer, Fernandes, Caicedo etc.. compare that to the Wigan/Bolton/Blackburn teams that finished top half with absolute cloggers like Savage, Bullard and Nolan in midfield.

Those level of players (along with many of ours - the Pembridge/Gemill types) just wouldn’t be getting anywhere close to mid table premier league sides these days.

 

[Little Ralphy]

I'm 49 and I've watched football through the late 80s to now and I can confidently say football now is at its worst level and if you look at the traditional powerhouses in both club and International football they are far from their vintage best

I think the Premier League is a perfect example of modern football.

Football in general has become more athletic (due to modern science), and the game is faster than it's ever been. There are far fewer poor players playing in the top flight now, and that means the gap between the top players and the bottom players is smaller than it's ever been.

So where you'd have Henry blitzing players, now most players are fast (just not Everton players). Same when you'd have a Drogba bullying defenders, now they are all physical, so it's a more even battle than it used to be.

Because the game is faster than it's ever been, and it's also more tactical, you see less players like Zidane etc. because they are not given the time and space they may have had previously. Most players are technically good now as well, so again the gap between the top and bottom is much smaller. They can all kill a ball dead and do skills.

In the Premier League it means the gap between the top teams and the bottom teams is smaller and it's turning in to a league like the Championship has been for years. This has been helped by the TV revenue dominating most club's revenue.
In other nations you'll still see one or two teams be able to easily dominate (as their revenues will dwarf everyone else in their league) and on a Global level those teams can compete, hence why the Champions league frightens our ## manager. But in the lesser European competitions, English sides have dominated this season because they likely dwarf those other clubs in terms of revenues etc. and therefore can afford better players, coaches etc.

So I don't personally believe the level is worse, I think it's higher than it's ever been, but it's hit a level where athleticism is far more dominant than it ever was, and tactical input from managers is far more detailed than before. So the game is a different watch to what it used to be.

 

[Ray Atteveld's Kit]

He signed off on the players Jake and he wasn't going to ever to utilize those players because he has an established track record of playing a squad of the same preferred players who are older like he did this season. He was the one who didn't prioritize a right back because he was okay with O'Brien playing there. He's become more rigid and unwilling to break from routines and he cost us Europe

Also Moyes is about always having some form of control over recruitment, it's the reason we don't have a DOF (unlike roma) and a transfer committee instead

That form usually involves his brother and no doubt some financial incentives...

 

[Lanolin]

I'm 49 and I've watched football through the late 80s to now and I can confidently say football now is at its worst level and if you look at the traditional powerhouses in both club and International football they are far from their vintage best

Don't want to veer too far off topic but seeing as the standard of pretty much every sport in the world is universally accepted as having got better, and people are running faster, jumping higher etc, it would be really weird if the most popular and played sport of them all was somehow bucking the trend and getting worse. To stay on topic, there is certainly a possibility that having a manager who came into the game in a different era and doesn't appear to have adapted his methods since isn't helping us move forward as a club.

 

[MACCA75]

I think the Premier League is a perfect example of modern football.

Football in general has become more athletic (due to modern science), and the game is faster than it's ever been. There are far fewer poor players playing in the top flight now, and that means the gap between the top players and the bottom players is smaller than it's ever been.

So where you'd have Henry blitzing players, now most players are fast (just not Everton players). Same when you'd have a Drogba bullying defenders, now they are all physical, so it's a more even battle than it used to be.

Because the game is faster than it's ever been, and it's also more tactical, you see less players like Zidane etc. because they are not given the time and space they may have had previously. Most players are technically good now as well, so again the gap between the top and bottom is much smaller. They can all kill a ball dead and do skills.

In the Premier League it means the gap between the top teams and the bottom teams is smaller and it's turning in to a league like the Championship has been for years. This has been helped by the TV revenue dominating most club's revenue.
In other nations you'll still see one or two teams be able to easily dominate (as their revenues will dwarf everyone else in their league) and on a Global level those teams can compete, hence why the Champions league frightens our ## manager. But in the lesser European competitions, English sides have dominated this season because they likely dwarf those other clubs in terms of revenues etc. and therefore can afford better players, coaches etc.

So I don't personally believe the level is worse, I think it's higher than it's ever been, but it's hit a level where athleticism is far more dominant than it ever was, and tactical input from managers is far more detailed than before. So the game is a different watch to what it used to be.

Yep. What I said but articulated 100 x better!

 

[Kevsleftpeg]

I think the Premier League is a perfect example of modern football.

Football in general has become more athletic (due to modern science), and the game is faster than it's ever been. There are far fewer poor players playing in the top flight now, and that means the gap between the top players and the bottom players is smaller than it's ever been.

So where you'd have Henry blitzing players, now most players are fast (just not Everton players). Same when you'd have a Drogba bullying defenders, now they are all physical, so it's a more even battle than it used to be.

Because the game is faster than it's ever been, and it's also more tactical, you see less players like Zidane etc. because they are not given the time and space they may have had previously. Most players are technically good now as well, so again the gap between the top and bottom is much smaller. They can all kill a ball dead and do skills.

In the Premier League it means the gap between the top teams and the bottom teams is smaller and it's turning in to a league like the Championship has been for years. This has been helped by the TV revenue dominating most club's revenue.
In other nations you'll still see one or two teams be able to easily dominate (as their revenues will dwarf everyone else in their league) and on a Global level those teams can compete, hence why the Champions league frightens our ## manager. But in the lesser European competitions, English sides have dominated this season because they likely dwarf those other clubs in terms of revenues etc. and therefore can afford better players, coaches etc.

So I don't personally believe the level is worse, I think it's higher than it's ever been, but it's hit a level where athleticism is far more dominant than it ever was, and tactical input from managers is far more detailed than before. So the game is a different watch to what it used to be.

This Arsenal team is absolutely rubbish compared to the invincibles.

 

[Marcus Kendall]

Had this debate many times.. whilst it’s true that the very top sides aren’t at their absolute best recently (certainly in the Prem), the overall standard in the Prem is much higher than it was say 20 years ago.

Chelsea finished 10th with genuine top talent like Palmer, Fernandes, Caicedo etc.. compare that to the Wigan/Bolton/Blackburn teams that finished top half with absolute cloggers like Savage, Bullard and Nolan in midfield.

Those level of players (along with many of ours - the Pembridge/Gemill types) just wouldn’t be getting anywhere close to mid table premier league sides these days.

It's all opinions but Bullard and Nolan were better than you're giving them credit for

 

[Marcus Kendall]

I think the Premier League is a perfect example of modern football.

Football in general has become more athletic (due to modern science), and the game is faster than it's ever been. There are far fewer poor players playing in the top flight now, and that means the gap between the top players and the bottom players is smaller than it's ever been.

So where you'd have Henry blitzing players, now most players are fast (just not Everton players). Same when you'd have a Drogba bullying defenders, now they are all physical, so it's a more even battle than it used to be.

Because the game is faster than it's ever been, and it's also more tactical, you see less players like Zidane etc. because they are not given the time and space they may have had previously. Most players are technically good now as well, so again the gap between the top and bottom is much smaller. They can all kill a ball dead and do skills.

In the Premier League it means the gap between the top teams and the bottom teams is smaller and it's turning in to a league like the Championship has been for years. This has been helped by the TV revenue dominating most club's revenue.
In other nations you'll still see one or two teams be able to easily dominate (as their revenues will dwarf everyone else in their league) and on a Global level those teams can compete, hence why the Champions league frightens our ## manager. But in the lesser European competitions, English sides have dominated this season because they likely dwarf those other clubs in terms of revenues etc. and therefore can afford better players, coaches etc.

So I don't personally believe the level is worse, I think it's higher than it's ever been, but it's hit a level where athleticism is far more dominant than it ever was, and tactical input from managers is far more detailed than before. So the game is a different watch to what it used to be.

Again there's plenty of things I agree with but Zidane would still be as brilliant now as he was then as the midfields he played against in his era were top notch athletes too

 

[Bluerover]

Had this debate many times.. whilst it’s true that the very top sides aren’t at their absolute best recently (certainly in the Prem), the overall standard in the Prem is much higher than it was say 20 years ago.

Chelsea finished 10th with genuine top talent like Palmer, Fernandes, Caicedo etc.. compare that to the Wigan/Bolton/Blackburn teams that finished top half with absolute cloggers like Savage, Bullard and Nolan in midfield.

Those level of players (along with many of ours - the Pembridge/Gemill types) just wouldn’t be getting anywhere close to mid table premier league sides these days.

I've been thinking about this a lot...

How many of the current squad would be picked ahead of the 80s team.

Even JP would not displace Nev.

They are mostly very poor, overpaid egotistical wasters with a handful of exceptions and it is really making me so angry to see the lack of care or effort let alone actual football ability.

 

[Marcus Kendall]

Don't want to veer too far off topic but seeing as the standard of pretty much every sport in the world is universally accepted as having got better, and people are running faster, jumping higher etc, it would be really weird if the most popular and played sport of them all was somehow bucking the trend and getting worse. To stay on topic, there is certainly a possibility that having a manager who came into the game in a different era and doesn't appear to have adapted his methods since isn't helping us move forward as a club.

universally accepted? By whom?

 

[Little Ralphy]

This Arsenal team is absolutely rubbish compared to the invincibles.

I do think that team was ahead of it's time as I remember when they came to Goodison and they were mostly absolute beasts.

But the captain of that team has said this.

Vieira Combined XI

Vieira explains his choices & names full XI​

Vieira did not hesitate when placing Rice into midfield ahead of former team-mate Gilberto Silva. He also selected Saka on the right flank instead of Freddie Ljungberg. The Arsenal legend also made adjustments in defence, choosing to replace Kolo Toure with Gabriel Magalhaes while keeping Sol Campbell in the back line. He also suggested Jurrien Timber could slot in at right-back.

"I think [David] Raya in goal for [Jens] Lehmann," he said. "Timber at right-back, I quite like him, he can get in the team as well. Toure and Campbell, I will change one of the two, I will keep Campbell and change Toure for Gabriel."

"Of course Ashley Cole, we’re not touching Ashley. Saka can get in the team on the right hand side over Freddie Ljungberg. Up front we’re not touching Thierry [Henry] and Dennis [Bergkamp]. Declan Rice for Gilberto and keep Robert Pires on the left."

Combined XI in full (4-4-2): Raya; Timber, Campbell, Gabriel, Cole; Saka, Rice, Vieira, Pires; Henry, Bergkamp.