Current Affairs Coronavirus Thread - Serious stuff !!!

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tsubaki said:
... which is pretty circular logic given that you'd said we wouldn't see that if the border wasn't an issue.

I don't want to fall out with anyone either, but the way that the lockdown was breached was so obvious and so blatant that I am not sure that saying it happened is sufficient grounds for people to be outraged by it.
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But its all down to the English? Thats what you said.

Like I am 100% certain that folk from England went to Wales, and vice versa, its almost impossible not to in the border areas. Like I used to work in the Forest of Dean. Literally, town to town to town is England to Wales to England.

edit. On the same road.
 
COYBL25 said:
Mate, you are one of the most sensible, sound posters on here, but this " it`s all the fault of the English " is just nuts.
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Where did I say it was "all the fault of the English"?

I said the big problem with what had happened was that the shops in Wales were open whilst the ones in England were closed, causing people from England to cross the border, shop and spread disease.

This is how the thing spreads, by people in social contact and if you are going to lock down (as both Drakeford and Johnson did, at different times) you cannot have a situation where one area near another one has much different conditions because people will go to where the lower restrictions are.

I mean, does anyone have fundamental objections to the idea that people from Chester would drive ten minutes to Broughton to go shopping when that is the only place nearby thats open?
 
roydo said:
Pretty much there.

The vast majority of on line deliveries in North and Mid Wales will be by folk living in England. Less so in the South of Wales.

Just one example.
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Not really - "all the fault of the English" would mean this is all the fault of the English, which is not something I said.

What I said was that by giving people the opportunity to cross from a lockdown into less strict conditions, the disease was spread. It spreads anyway as the result of social contact, but by making social contact more likely it spreads more.
 
tsubaki said:
Where did I say it was "all the fault of the English"?

I said the big problem with what had happened was that the shops in Wales were open whilst the ones in England were closed, causing people from England to cross the border, shop and spread disease.

This is how the thing spreads, by people in social contact and if you are going to lock down (as both Drakeford and Johnson did, at different times) you cannot have a situation where one area near another one has much different conditions because people will go to where the lower restrictions are.

I mean, does anyone have fundamental objections to the idea that people from Chester would drive ten minutes to Broughton to go shopping when that is the only place nearby thats open?
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tsubaki said:
because the welsh lockdown ended before the English one did - Welsh shops, restaurants and pubs were open and English people did go to them (even though they weren't allowed)
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You said it here too :oops:

Not one single news outlet, even the ones that normally bash the government are reporting that English people are too blame.

You also mention Welsh people crossing the border to go to shopping centres in England during the firebreak, how are the English to blame for Welsh people breaking their own rules ??
 
tsubaki said:
Not really - "all the fault of the English" would mean this is all the fault of the English, which is not something I said.

What I said was that by giving people the opportunity to cross from a lockdown into less strict conditions, the disease was spread. It spreads anyway as the result of social contact, but by making social contact more likely it spreads more.
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tsubaki said:
the lockdown worked; the problem was that Wales opened whilst England was closed and so a lot of people came to shop and spread diseases. If Johnson had done what Drakeford did when he did it, neither country would be in the state it’s in
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tsubaki said:
again, it did work - the problem was the bigger country next to us not doing the same thing earlier and as a result panicking itself into a longer lockdown than the Welsh one
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Take your pick.
 
roydo said:
Semantics, and you know it.

The first target you lobbed in the cross hairs when it emerged that Welsh cases were rising, was England.
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Not semantics - "all the fault of" is a clear statement, and one that wasn't made.

With regards to the second bit, the target I lobbed in the crosshairs was the fact that the Welsh lockdown ended whilst the English one hadn't, and that as a result of the markedly different conditions people from England came into the now open Welsh shops (and restaurants, pubs etc) and spread the disease. Given that (in the North over the past 30 days) rates per 100000 people are much worse in the two border counties there is surely something to be looked at there.
 
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