Current Affairs Coronavirus Thread - Serious stuff !!!

[Bruce Wayne]

Correct. And that's the obvious proviso - not every situation is the same. There are differences in the success or failings in every country. The report does discuss the damage of lockdown and the damage of a continual cycle of lockdown has in countries. Interestingly, it suggests that where there is high instance of covid-19, less stringent measures have largely no effect because it's too prelevant in communities.

It seems to me, with some degree of expertise although I'm certainly no expert in the matter, that early intervention of lockdown to halt the virus; coupled with traditional public health measures have worked (hands, face, space, cost benefit analysis, measures appropriate to budget and culture, resource before restriction and a degree of codesign (or understanding of need) with public has been most successful.

I can sympathise to an extent, as while there have undoubtedly been mistakes made, it's also evident that across Europe, governments of hugely varying political standpoints and with varying approaches to the pandemic, have all suffered broadly similar outcomes. The Netherlands was another relatively open country, and I believe they're suffering the 3rd most infections in Europe at the moment. The obvious big country outlier is Germany, who have, and continue to do remarkably well.

I'm happy to be corrected, but I recall Witty saying at the start of this that there will be a cycle of restrictions-easing-restrictions pretty much until a vaccine is produced, which seems precisely what is happening.

 

[maccavennie]

So easy isn’t it.

It was a bunch of daft kids desperate to get on camera and act the big man. No doubt the cameras were there set at 9PM to get the scenes from convert square.

All it takes is that one video and the usual bile starts from people.

Most of the city was dead last night but you’re not going to hear about that are you?

Your spot on mate that "most" of the city was quiet last night as the majority of people are doing their best to follow the guidelines.

Problem is, it only takes a small amount of people to not give a flying one (like the videos above) and that affects every one of us.

I have decided to start my own task force anyway.

maccas marvels :

Instead of water cannons (I can't afford to hire one) I'll just lob bottles of water at people who I think aren't taking this pandemic seriously. I've been practicing chucking bottles from my bathroom window into my kids paddling pool and have a 63% success rate.

 

[Jebus_lives]

I can sympathise to an extent, as while there have undoubtedly been mistakes made, it's also evident that across Europe, governments of hugely varying political standpoints and with varying approaches to the pandemic, have all suffered broadly similar outcomes. The Netherlands was another relatively open country, and I believe they're suffering the 3rd most infections in Europe at the moment. The obvious big country outlier is Germany, who have, and continue to do remarkably well.

I'm happy to be corrected, but I recall Witty saying at the start of this that there will be a cycle of restrictions-easing-restrictions pretty much until a vaccine is produced, which seems precisely what is happening.

Completely missed TTI from my initial list

There seems to be an opinion that liberal or left leaning countries 'do well' which is not necessarily the case. You cannot separate public health from politics, but you almost have to set aside the belief that one ideology will prevail over another. There is evidence to say what definitely doesn't work - populism seems to be particularly poor, but that's no surprise.

Public health, which is in line with Witty, said that there would be cycles of lockdown and ease, but again, there is nuance within that. If you flatten or contain, then manage outbreaks, that is far less restrictive than regional/national lockdown.

 

[Joey66]

I can sympathise to an extent, as while there have undoubtedly been mistakes made, it's also evident that across Europe, governments of hugely varying political standpoints and with varying approaches to the pandemic, have all suffered broadly similar outcomes. The Netherlands was another relatively open country, and I believe they're suffering the 3rd most infections in Europe at the moment. The obvious big country outlier is Germany, who have, and continue to do remarkably well.

I'm happy to be corrected, but I recall Witty saying at the start of this that there will be a cycle of restrictions-easing-restrictions pretty much until a vaccine is produced, which seems precisely what is happening.

The guy Sie Patrick Vallance who had 1/2 a million shares in the vaccine if successful will make a load of money forgetting to declare an interest ?
It's a shambles by Tory idiots who have put £s before health .........they call it the NHS track & trace while private subcontractors have made a complete Harry Hallls of it costing us 10 billion ........that was the key element to best this pandemic.......

 

[NilSatisOptimum]

Closing schools is a ridiculous policy. Cant believe there are people out there support it. The country has lost the plot.

I am thoroughly fed up

It's more to do with the the schools are safe mantra that people are baulking at, anyone with an ounce of this common sense knows they are not, and anywhere where people congregate indoors from multiple household is of high risk from, everyone would have to be practicing barrier nursing with aseptic technique to manage the risk. Coupled with absolutely nothing remotely near enough has been done for the NHS to resume a normal service, as well as offering a satisfactory response to the pandemic... We are in the age of the educated idiot, thanks Tony Blair...

 

[Bruce Wayne]

Completely missed TTI from my initial list

There seems to be an opinion that liberal or left leaning countries 'do well' which is not necessarily the case. You cannot separate public health from politics, but you almost have to set aside the belief that one ideology will prevail over another. There is evidence to say what definitely doesn't work - populism seems to be particularly poor, but that's no surprise.

Public health, which is in line with Witty, said that there would be cycles of lockdown and ease, but again, there is nuance within that. If you flatten or contain, then manage outbreaks, that is far less restrictive than regional/national lockdown.

I read an article yesterday that rather than left/right was looking more at collectivist/individualist countries, and perhaps understandably the more collectivist countries have tended to do better, hence why generally speaking Asia has tackled this better than Europe. As you say, obviously there's nuance within such general themes but if we're looking to compare like with like that's perhaps a decent axis to do so on.

 

[ToffeeTim]

It's more to do with the the schools are safe mantra that people are baulking at, anyone with an ounce of this common sense knows they are not, and anywhere where people congregate indoors is of high risk, everyone would have to be practicing barrier nursing with aseptic technique to manage the risk. Coupled with absolutely nothing remotely near enough has been done for the NHS to resume a normal service, as well as offering a satisfactory response to the pandemic...

No one is going to convince kids are better off at home than in school. As I said, the argument baffles me and there is zero evidence I've seen schools are dangerous.

We are ruining our kids chances. It makes me feel almost ashamed.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

The guy Sie Patrick Vallance who had 1/2 a million shares in the vaccine if successful will make a load of money forgetting to declare an interest ?
It's a shambles by Tory idiots who have put £s before health .........they call it the NHS track & trace while private subcontractors have made a complete Harry Hallls of it costing us 10 billion ........that was the key element to best this pandemic.......

Patrick Vallance was formerly head of drug discovery at GSK Joe, so will almost certainly have got those shares as part of his remuneration while employed by them. Given that he has no input into any vaccine procurement undertaken by the government, it's perhaps wise for you to stop reading the most definitely not right-wing good old socialist newspaper the Telegraph.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

No one is going to convince kids are better off at home than in school. As I said, the argument baffles me and there is zero evidence I've seen schools are dangerous.

We are ruining our kids chances. It makes me feel almost ashamed.

We'll probably end up just giving them all As like we did in the summer

 

[tsubaki]

there is a lot of money behind this “Great Barrington Declaration” crap, it’s everywhere being pushed by the people who are usually wrong about everything

 

[Jebus_lives]

I read an article yesterday that rather than left/right was looking more at collectivist/individualist countries, and perhaps understandably the more collectivist countries have tended to do better, hence why generally speaking Asia has tackled this better than Europe. As you say, obviously there's nuance within such general themes but if we're looking to compare like with like that's perhaps a decent axis to do so on.

We shouldn't. It's comparing apples and oranges. We should look at what drives behavior and non compliance in each population and incentivize adherence to it. Resource before restriction.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

We shouldn't. It's comparing apples and oranges. We should look at what drives behavior and non compliance in each population and incentivize adherence to it. Resource before restriction.

It's inevitable to an extent though isn't it? Whenever you look to understand how your own place is doing, you look elsewhere for comparisons. Like you say, you'd hope that those actually running this take a more nuanced approach, but I'm not surprised that the general public look at other countries to support whatever cause they have.

 

[NilSatisOptimum]

No one is going to convince kids are better off at home than in school. As I said, the argument baffles me and there is zero evidence I've seen schools are dangerous.

We are ruining our kids chances. It makes me feel almost ashamed.

Education element is entirely separate from the virus, sending anyone into confined space even with face mask and bottle of hand sanitizer will not make it much better as we are finding out. Anyone is of higher risk going indoors with other multiple households, always have been always will.
Work colleague gets a call yesterday, child sent home Covid case in class bubble entire year all sent home to isolate, the two siblings and yes same household in different school years are allowed and expected to be in school, it's a joke!

 

[Jebus_lives]

It's inevitable to an extent though isn't it? Whenever you look to understand how your own place is doing, you look elsewhere for comparisons. Like you say, you'd hope that those actually running this take a more nuanced approach, but I'm not surprised that the general public look at other countries to support whatever cause they have.

It is inevitable. Everyone wants to see how the neighbours are doing.

You should look at what is working and why absolutely, but simple comparison of say NZ vs Sweden isn't really helpful. Not is Sweden vs UK.

But if you look at the countries performing badly, they have fairly common traits, as do the countries performing well.

 

[ToffeeTim]

Education element is entirely separate from the virus, sending anyone into confined space even with face mask and bottle of hand sanitizer will not make it much better as we are finding out. Anyone is of higher risk going indoors with other multiple households, always have been always will.
Work colleague gets a call yesterday, child sent home Covid case in class bubble entire year all sent home to isolate, the two siblings in different school years are allowed and expected to be in school, it's a joke!

What is really a joke, is waking up to hear the NI assembly have decided to close schools for an extended break.

We'll have to agree to disagree I'm afraid. There is no such thing as 100% safety in any walk of life, but there is no evidence of schools being dangerous. Of course there will be positive cases in schools just like any other sector, but the idea we then should close every school makes no sense to me. Parents deserve better, kids deserve better. There is no support for this other than on twitter.