Current Affairs Coronavirus Thread - Serious stuff !!!

[RFUS]

The Daily Mail headline is disgusting but again it's classic Tory PR. Divide and conquer. Turn the public against the teachers and the teachers against the unions and we all forget the bungling of the pandemic that has lead to an estimated 60 thousand deaths in a few months.

I signed up to teach. The clue is in the name. I am not a soldier. I am not a hero. I do the job because I love helping kids learn like most teachers. But we can only do that if we're, you know, not dead.

 

[peteblue]

Transatlantic tensions over access to COVID-19 vaccines mount after Sanofi CEO says US is first in queue

French pharmaceutical company Sanofi is at the centre of a transatlantic row over access to its COVID-19 vaccines, after CEO Paul Hudson said the US would get “first access, because it was first to fund the research.”

sciencebusiness.net

There's a very ugly undercurrent of nationalism emerging throughout all of this. Very ugly.

I particularly like this bit...

” Equal access to a vaccine for all is non-negotiable,” French Prime Minister Édouard Philippe said on Twitter. In a further riposte, Philippe said he had “just reminded” Serge Weinberg, the chair of “this large, deeply French company” of the need clarify its position. “He gave me all the necessary assurances regarding the distribution in France of a possible Sanofi vaccine,” Phillipe said.”

“Equal access for all“, then it was “deeply French company and distribution in France“.....

 

[NilSatisOptimum]

Unlike doctors, nurses and the armed forces, teachers signed up to teach, not put their health and lives at risk.

Social distancing for kids in a school setting is completely impossible. We have a situation where the government won't let adults go a restaurant or pub because of the risks involved, yet are happy for a bunch of 5 year olds to mingle.

No, it's bollocks. The whole thing is bollocks. It's being driven by money, not science.

It would have made perfect sense if it were children in and around exams going back to school. Much more able to follow social distancing etc. But the very young ones, it's just being used as baby sitting service bto get mum and dad back to work, Government dont fool anyone. And now paying lip service to poor children now. Its humorous listening to Williamson...

 

[Bruce Wayne]

I particularly like this bit...

” Equal access to a vaccine for all is non-negotiable,” French Prime Minister Édouard Philippe said on Twitter. In a further riposte, Philippe said he had “just reminded” Serge Weinberg, the chair of “this large, deeply French company” of the need clarify its position. “He gave me all the necessary assurances regarding the distribution in France of a possible Sanofi vaccine,” Phillipe said.”

“Equal access for all“, then it was “deeply French company and distribution in France“.....

It's not great at all.

 

[Brisan123]

Really.

I think teachers are well aware that they work in an environment where they are surrounded by unhygienic, unwashed, germ infested beings on a daily basis.

Let’s not kid ourselves.

very rarely you will die of a common cold or a bit of diarrhea

 

[Tubey]

Really.

I think teachers are well aware that they work in an environment where they are surrounded by unhygienic, unwashed, germ infested beings on a daily basis.

Let’s not kid ourselves.

Oh yes, they've always been fully aware that a killer virus can get them at any time in the classroom, just like how a soldier can take a bullet or a doctor can catch ebola...

Get a grip fella, they aren't remotely similar occupations. We can't ask teachers to take that sort of risk - and for what, so mummy and daddy have a babysitter?

The disrespect and disregard towards the teaching profession throughout all this has been ridiculous.

 

[Tubey]

very rarely you will die of a common cold or a bit of diarrhea

I know teachers - they're not arsed about everyday illnesses (they work through them where most would stay off in fact), but as you say there's a world of difference between a heightened risk of catching a normal cold or norovirus or whatever and what COVID-19 currently is.

If you open schools, you may as well end the entire lockdown at the same time. Because it makes no sense to say a classroom of kids mingling and spreading the virus to homes is safe but everything else isn't.

 

[arminisgod]

From Peirced Organ (PS sorry for reading the mail but I did was my hands and eyes after)

Putting aside the recklessness of this move, which I fear is the same mistake made in 1918 when the world tried to return to normality too early after the first wave of the Spanish Flu only for the second wave to be massively more devastating.

This is my concern.

Can people stop comparing the 2 ffs.

A: they are completely different viruse
B: they didn't have a clue in 1918 how viruses spread.

 

[Barnfred 55]

The scale would be a major issue. It would consume significant resource, resource that would be pulled from other work streams.

Government also has embedded specialists and experts, and the budgets to bring in further support where required.

It is also unlikely a trawl through submissions from the public would result in something original, relevant and applicable, that considered all of the complexity, nuance and detail, that would not have already been considered by the experts and specialists.

I work for a Central Government Department in Whitehall.

I really have no idea if that last line was a wind up or not, but that whole post is exactly what I would expect to see from somebody in that position so I'll take it as read.

I appreciate the scale could be a problem at the bottom end, and there would be lots of inane things like keeping the local chippie open etc put forward. Maybe that could be farmed out, perhaps to local newspapers who could run a competition and all the dross could be weaned out. Only the best and brightest ideas would be put forward which would reduce the number being looked at by government people to maybe a hundred or so..

It's the idea that you just couldn't possibly learn anything that enrages me, and just confirms my point of view of central government departments. There's a reason why this sort of things works in private industry and given the governments performance so far in this crisis I would say you need all the help you can get.

 

[arminisgod]

You are posting some garbage this morning.

Part of a teacher's role is safeguarding children. Exposing them to a virus because they can't be adequately protected does not fall in line with that remit.

Aside from that, nobody should have their health put at risk to do their job, you're essentially telling teachers to put their lives on the line so kids can learn their ABCs.

Let's have a bit of perspective shall we? Most teachers are under 60 years old. The death rate of people who end up in hospital with COVID19 in people under 60 is 1%, now add in the people who haven't required hospital treatment...

it's hardly like they are being asked to go over the top is it?

 

[peteblue]

The scale would be a major issue. It would consume significant resource, resource that would be pulled from other work streams.

Government also has embedded specialists and experts, and the budgets to bring in further support where required.

It is also unlikely a trawl through submissions from the public would result in something original, relevant and applicable, that considered all of the complexity, nuance and detail, that would not have already been considered by the experts and specialists.

I work for a Central Government Department in Whitehall.

Scale shouldn’t be an issue. A sensibly organised on-line system, pre grouping similar suggestions etc etc and distributing to relevant departments/individuals should do the job.

I think you would be amazed at just what can be learnt when you break away from ‘group think’ and other ‘experts‘.

It might even help bridge the gap between those who think they know all the answers and those who have to deal with the consequences of government policy and processes....Just a suggestion mind......

 

[blulouie]

I thought that was a good idea but it would never be agreed to. They won't agree to move the holidays.

Under normal circumstances I would agree but it doesnt look like we will have a Christmas any time soon.

Anyway crazy to push them back to school , its far too dangerous at the moment.

 

[arminisgod]

I don't know the answer, so this is a purely open question. We've had a lockdown for however long now, but have known that at some point it will end and (from a schools perspective) children will return. Schools have also had a situation whereby many seem to have retained a (reduced) service for children of key workers, during which they could perhaps have experimented with approaches on this smaller student body that could then be expanded when schools open more fully.

Has that sort of thing been going on?

My missus is a teacher and has been in for key worker kids. I'll tell you now... her school has done sweet FA. Whilst i've been at work our factory has been putting in social distancing measures, re designing the factory so people can't mix and be within 2 metres.

Her school haven't done anything, and by the sounds of it no schools have.

 

[Tubey]

People need to get their heads around the absolute inevitability of a second wave. Probably even a third or fourth, but the second is an absolute cert to happen.

That's not the reason schools shouldn't re-open - it's because if you are taking active measures to suppress the virus across the country then you need a consistent message for the population to adhere to rules and you need the plan to be as comprehensive as possible but also as short as possible, as people get fatigued and start to not listen unless you have an authoritarian government who would shoot you in the head if you don't.

If you open schools, you are no longer locked down. If they lift the entire lockdown, fine. It'd be a mistake and you'd hasten a massive spike in deaths, but whatever, that's the governments mistake to make. But if you pretend the lockdown is still happening and just open schools and expect everyone to carry on staying indoors or to observe social distancing, they won't - and to make matters worse, when the second spike does happen and you reintroduce lockdown after, what, 2-4 weeks of lifting it, everyone will be annoyed and less likely to listen.

The TLDR version - either end the lockdown and open schools, or keep it and don't. If you're going to ease the lockdown, there's many measures to take beforehand - open beer gardens, outdoor spaces for restaurants etc. But opening schools isn't one of those options; it's an economic decision.

 

[ramacca]

It would have made perfect sense if it were children in and around exams going back to school. Much more able to follow social distancing etc. But the very young ones, it's just being used as baby sitting service bto get mum and dad back to work, Government dont fool anyone. And now paying lip service to poor children now. Its humorous listening to Williamson...

Are they the same poor children that suffered 10 years of vicious austerity. Launched against the poor, disabled, vulnerable, weak and frail that is estimated to have caused 130 000 preventable deaths. Saw millions and millions plunged into poverty, that the UN envoy highlighted. Is it those poor people, I wonder? Using the poor to have a go at teachers sums up their new 'consensus togetherness'. They don't give a toss about the poor as their actions have shown.