Current Affairs Coronavirus Thread - Serious stuff !!!

[peteblue]

No, it's not actually. It far from being believed.

Familiarise yourself with the debate.

It is believed, obviously not by you because the CCP didn’t issue the number

Err ONS themselves have said that the UK official numbers are likely a vast undercount and that is before you get into the timeliness of the reporting, especially over weekends.

Weekly death rate in England and Wales hits record high due to the coronavirus

The Office for National Statistics reported the highest level of deaths in England and Wales since official weekly statistics began 15 years ago.

www.cnbc.com

The ONS also said its data showed that 6,236 deaths involving the coronavirus in England and Wales had occurred this year up to April 3, and registered by April 11.

That’s 50% higher than the 4,093 deaths reported on April 4 by the U.K.’s health department. The ONS didn’t include figures for Scotland and Northern Ireland.

“There is a difference in the numbers as we include all deaths where COVID-19 was mentioned on the death certificate even if only suspected, and we include deaths that happened in hospital and in the community,” the ONS said on Twitter.

In contrast, the official U.K. coronavirus death toll only includes those that occurred in hospitals.

And that has been stated from the beginning.....

 

[Armaghtoffee]

You’d only complain if they did.... let’s be honest, it doesn’t matter what they do, say, or achieve, you and others will just cry and moan about them and tell us how Chairman Corbyn would have ensured that no one died from the Chinese Coronavirus, by using his magic vaccine tree....whinge, whinge, moan , moan, Tories, murderers etc etc.......

No Pete, questions must be asked of the government as to why the NHS has been left in such an ill prepared state.

It is also reasonable to ask what the plan was to manage the Pandemic initially, why this has changed and what the revised plan is for the country (and based on what evidence).

 

[BlueStevie35]

That monstor encouraged millions to socialise on the eve of a lockdown knowing how much more infections that would cause.

The government have messed it, no doubt but its majorly childish to make death threats over the internet when you and I know you’d never have the bottle to do it in person

 

[LinekersLegs]

It is believed, obviously not by you because the CCP didn’t issue the number


And that has been stated from the beginning.....

The UK government has stated their official coronavirus figures are a large undercount right from the beginning? Could you perhaps direct me to that announcement/qualification as I must have missed it.

 

[RAFUH]

There are lots of articles on the net, Covid-19 seems to be a combination of viruses, the question is how did it become a sum of different viruses, naturally or man-made.

China are restricting their top scientists from exploring the virus further, deleting information on research done so far, Why?

China clamping down on coronavirus research, deleted pages suggest

Move is likely to be part of attempt to control the narrative surrounding the pandemic

www.theguardian.com

Coronavirus origins: genome analysis suggests two viruses may have combined

The SARS-CoV-2 virus responsible for the COVID-19 pandemic is undergoing extensive genetic analysis around the world to understand its origin and evolution.

theconversation.com

Did you read these?

First one - shocker Chinese government is trying to control a narrative that might make them look bad. It then goes on to say that sciencists say it originated from animals.


Second one - This recombination mechanism had already been described in coronaviruses, in particular to explain the origin of SARS-CoV. It is important to know that recombination results in a new virus potentially capable of infecting a new host species. For recombination to occur, the two divergent viruses must have infected the same organism simultaneously.

So the virus underwent a natural process we already knew the class of virus could do.

 

[davek]

The government have messed it, no doubt but its majorly childish to make death threats over the internet when you and I know you’d never have the bottle to do it in person

It's called hyperbole.

*sigh*

 

[roydo]

The UK government has stated their official coronavirus figures are a large undercount right from the beginning? Could you perhaps direct me to that announcement/qualification as I must have missed it.

i think thats obvious, as in they said from the get go pretty much that they were only counting hospital deaths. But they were recorded, and thats the trend they are basing the science on. Kinda makes more sense than scrabbling around for every single death before decisions are made.

 

[BlueStevie35]

It's called hyperbole.

*sigh*

Ah so now it’s hyperbole cos you’ve been called out, never change mate

 

[davek]

Ah so now it’s hyperbole cos you’ve been called out, never change mate

No, of course it isn't hyperbole, I'm actually going to get a can of petrol and matches etc.,

FFS...and YOU told ME to grow up!

 

[LinekersLegs]

i think thats obvious, as in they said from the get go pretty much that they were only counting hospital deaths. But they were recorded, and thats the trend they are basing the science on. Kinda makes more sense than scrabbling around for every single death before decisions are made.

As I say, I hadn’t realized that was made clear in the early stages in the UK - was a lot of confusion about it in the US as seen by New York significantly raising their figures the past week as they included “at home” deaths which have sadly escalated.

 

[BlueStevie35]

No, of course it isn't hyperbole, I'm actually going to get a can of petrol and matches etc.,

FFS...and YOU told ME to grow up!

Calm down ffs, I’m not the one calling people murderers like a man child am I?

 

[roydo]

As I say, I hadn’t realized that was made clear in the early stages in the UK - was a lot of confusion about it in the US as seen by New York significantly raising their figures the past week.

Well, "making it clear" is perhaps giving them too much credit. But it was latched onto pretty early that the tweets suddenly referred to "NHS deaths" only. Makes sense to me. Trend is a trend. Another 50 or 100 deaths makes a headline, but doesnt actually make much of a difference, science wise.

 

[neil999]

I don’t think you know what you mean. If the argument is that this has been caused by years of underinvestment in the NHS, then the current situation where almost unlimited resources have been thrown at it almost pays heed to it. The answer clearly isn’t just to pour more money in, otherwise we wouldn’t have the death figures we currently have.

The issue we currently have is that our ability to manufacture medical supplies within our own country has been highlighted to be a huge flaw, there’s a PPE shortage because we, along with a vast number of other countries, are reliant on China who can’t supply the demand. It’s all well and good that the money is there to buy stuff, but it’s pretty useless when the stuff isn’t there to be bought.

There’s clearly not been enough lessons learned from previous Pandemics that have happened across the world in previous years and within a global economy that’s poor.

There’s also the issue that we’ve been told for years that the increased rates of obesity was essentially a ticking time bomb for health in this country. With research showing that elevated BMI is a risk factor, the countries failure to address that is also a huge issue. Arguably, advice from authorities on this has been poor for decades and the ‘health food’ industry has spread so much misinformation that it is no surprise that people don’t know what to eat or what constitutes a ‘high’ level of exercise. The growing rates of respiratory disease in the country doesn’t help either.

But I’m sure you meant all that, and weren’t just desperately back tracking after looking like a tit for having a go at a 99 year old.

Wat

 

[davek]

Calm down ffs, I’m not the one calling people murderers like a man child am I?

What word would you use?

 

[LinekersLegs]

Well, "making it clear" is perhaps giving them too much credit. But it was latched onto pretty early that the tweets suddenly referred to "NHS deaths" only. Makes sense to me. Trend is a trend. Another 50 or 100 deaths makes a headline, but doesnt actually make much of a difference, science wise.

Tbf it is something that most countries seem to have struggled with. The reporting procedures seem far more robust/established for hospital settings but not when there are significant numbers at home/in care facilities.

I do think the extra context those figures give is quite important though, not only from coronavirus but to get a clearer picture of the disease‘s secondary impacts on the community as a whole. Lot of worry from doctors that they aren’t seeing their ”regular” E.R. patients like heart attack/stroke that (unlike say car accidents) there doesn’t seem to be much explanation as to why there is a reduction other than fear.

Could be important in setting up “non coronavirus” places where people with other medical issues/symptoms feel safe to turn up to.