Current Affairs Belarus…and migrants…..

[Mr. White]

The Dutch have roughly the same number of refugees despite a much smaller overall population and a population density that is higher than England and much higher than the UK.

At best, an equal population density to England... That said, I'd love it if England was more like The Netherlands.

In theory, I'm not against higher population, higher density per se. But, it needs to be supported by investment and political will. I've been to The Netherlands a few times... I love it... pedestrians, bikes and public transport come first. Unfortunately, in England, car dependency comes first. Here, everybody wants a house, a driveway, a car... too many Nimby's oppose change, and that makes living in England very expensive.

 

[peteblue]

The issue is that people get their view on what is the law from bog paper like the Telegraph. Under international law, it is perfectly legal for anyone to claim asylum upon arrival in a country.

Except that they are not asylum seekers. They are coming from France where they are not in any danger. They are illegal immigrants and that’s what you cannot get your head around…..try flying to the USA then claiming asylum and see what happens….

 

[Bruce Wayne]

Except that they are not asylum seekers. They are coming from France where they are not in any danger. They are illegal immigrants and that’s what you cannot get your head around…..try flying to the USA then claiming asylum and see what happens….

Ffs Pete, will you actually read up on the law rather than swallow the nonsense in the Torygraph? There is nothing in international law that says that asylum seekers must seek asylum in the first "safe" country they come to. Nothing whatsoever. Instead, international law says people can seek asylum anywhere they choose and by any means they choose.

As you bang on about the war so much, you might like to recall that these are international laws introduced after the "hard won freedoms" created by the war generation you so delight in basking in their glory. Oh for boomers to share some of their wisdom and kindness.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

And tbh, I can't quite get my head around someone whose professional life was spent profiting from war having such a blaze attitude to the people whose lives have been disrupted by those wars.

 

[mill]

Ffs Pete, will you actually read up on the law rather than swallow the nonsense in the Torygraph? There is nothing in international law that says that asylum seekers must seek asylum in the first "safe" country they come to. Nothing whatsoever. Instead, international law says people can seek asylum anywhere they choose and by any means they choose.

As you bang on about the war so much, you might like to recall that these are international laws introduced after the "hard won freedoms" created by the war generation you so delight in basking in their glory. Oh for boomers to share some of their wisdom and kindness.

It also doesn’t make logical sense.

As what it effectively means is that a country would only accept refugees from neighbouring countries.

How exactly would they get to France in the first place?

 

[Bruce Wayne]

It also doesn’t make logical sense.

As what it effectively means is that a country would only accept refugees from neighbouring countries.

How exactly would they get to France in the first place?

It's even more muddle headed when it comes from people who ostensibly bang on about individual liberty so much, yet feel quite happy to deprive people of any agency over where they would like to go.

 

[peteblue]

It also doesn’t make logical sense.

As what it effectively means is that a country would only accept refugees from neighbouring countries.

How exactly would they get to France in the first place?

Every country they passed through, even the ones they originated from have a British Embassy. Walk into one of them and ask for asylum, formally, not travel through a myriad of safe countries then pay people smugglers to put you on a boat to enter a country illegally…

 

[Bruce Wayne]

Every country they passed through, even the ones they originated from have a British Embassy. Walk into one of them and ask for asylum, formally, not travel through a myriad of safe countries then pay people smugglers to put you on a boat to enter a country illegally…

Except there is no legal pathway to claim asylum at an embassy.

 

[Zatara]

Click on the image to expand it and you'll see the UK at the bottom, with no trend indicating any 'migrant crisis' that certain rags seem to be shouting about presumably to detract from the recent government scandals.

Asylum statistics

This briefing summarises statistics on asylum seekers in the UK and refugees who arrive through resettlement programmes.

commonslibrary.parliament.uk

 

[Zatara]

Ffs Pete, will you actually read up on the law rather than swallow the nonsense in the Torygraph? There is nothing in international law that says that asylum seekers must seek asylum in the first "safe" country they come to. Nothing whatsoever. Instead, international law says people can seek asylum anywhere they choose and by any means they choose.

As you bang on about the war so much, you might like to recall that these are international laws introduced after the "hard won freedoms" created by the war generation you so delight in basking in their glory. Oh for boomers to share some of their wisdom and kindness.

This backs you up I think:

The truth about… refugees

Europe’s refugee crisis is getting worse, and if you listen to government ministers and many other political commentators, constitutes a dire threat.

www.amnesty.org.uk

What I dont understand is about those seeking asylum...

...perhaps my impression is wrong here but in my mind they are trying to 'escape' something...look for safe haven in another country.

So if they took a route to arrive in Spain, Italy, France or Germany what is the motivator (now theyre in a 'safe' country) to then want to travel to the UK ?

If someone is desperate then surely they want to apply for asylum at the closest and fastest 'safe' country.


If im from Myanmar and want to claim asylum as im in fear for my (and families) life. Am i going to apply in Thailand? Or should i travel further to Malaysia / Indonesia?

Or should i trek across those countries to Singapore? Why would i not apply in any of those 3 other countries if i was desperate?

 

[Bruce Wayne]

This backs you up I think:

The truth about… refugees

Europe’s refugee crisis is getting worse, and if you listen to government ministers and many other political commentators, constitutes a dire threat.

www.amnesty.org.uk

What I dont understand is about those seeking asylum...

...perhaps my impression is wrong here but in my mind they are trying to 'escape' something...look for safe haven in another country.

So if they took a route to arrive in Spain, Italy, France or Germany what is the motivator (now theyre in a 'safe' country) to then want to travel to the UK ?

If someone is desperate then surely they want to apply for asylum at the closest and fastest 'safe' country.


If im from Myanmar and want to claim asylum as im in fear for my (and families) life. Am i going to apply in Thailand? Or should i travel further to Malaysia / Indonesia?

Or should i trek across those countries to Singapore? Why would i not apply in any of those 3 other countries if i was desperate?

Many reasons. Maybe the language is a factor. Maybe there is a diaspora in the country that they believe can help them to settle. Maybe they believe the UK is better for them than other countries (a branding thing). Maybe it's the only choice offered to them by whomever is trafficking them. I'd imagine there may be numerous reasons, but I think two things are important here. Firstly, they're not risking their lives for shits and giggles, so we have to assume there is a decent reason (and all evidence suggests bleeding a compliant welfare system is nowhere near the top of that list). Secondly, internationally, the UK accepts a pretty pitiful number of refugees, so we should get past this narrative that "all" refugees are coming here, as the reality is that a pretty small proportion are.

 

[Deleted member 48881]

Blood chilling interview (full version)

 

[neil999]

This backs you up I think:

The truth about… refugees

Europe’s refugee crisis is getting worse, and if you listen to government ministers and many other political commentators, constitutes a dire threat.

www.amnesty.org.uk

What I dont understand is about those seeking asylum...

...perhaps my impression is wrong here but in my mind they are trying to 'escape' something...look for safe haven in another country.

So if they took a route to arrive in Spain, Italy, France or Germany what is the motivator (now theyre in a 'safe' country) to then want to travel to the UK ?

If someone is desperate then surely they want to apply for asylum at the closest and fastest 'safe' country.


If im from Myanmar and want to claim asylum as im in fear for my (and families) life. Am i going to apply in Thailand? Or should i travel further to Malaysia / Indonesia?

Or should i trek across those countries to Singapore? Why would i not apply in any of those 3 other countries if i was desperate?

Ok think about yourself and if you were fleeing violence, you now want to make a life for yourself somewhere.. Do you stay in France or do you go somewhere you may have family and possibly know the language? It's not just about being safe it's going somewhere where you have to live and make a life

Again it's dehumanising people

Also, I dont know why people keep asking this question instead of trying to find out about it

 

[Bruce Wayne]

Ok think about yourself and if you were fleeing violence, you now want to make a life for yourself somewhere.. Do you stay in France or do you go somewhere you may have family and possibly know the language? It's not just about being safe it's going somewhere where you have to live and make a life

Again it's dehumanising people

Also, I dont know why people keep asking this question instead of trying to find out about it

Or better yet, go and actually talk to some people and learn a bit about their lives

Liverpool - AMURT UK

BREAKFAST KITCHEN “Serving the Community” The success of the AMURT UK feeding programme in London inspired the creation of the Breakfast Kitchen. The programme was set up in October 2014, serving disadvantaged communities in and around L15, Liverpool. The Breakfast Kitchen activities soon grew...

amurt.org.uk

 

[Zatara]

Ok think about yourself and if you were fleeing violence, you now want to make a life for yourself somewhere.. Do you stay in France or do you go somewhere you may have family and possibly know the language? It's not just about being safe it's going somewhere where you have to live and make a life

Again it's dehumanising people

Also, I dont know why people keep asking this question instead of trying to find out about it

When people "keep asking this question" and theres no 'real' answer aside from:

@Bruce Wayne = Britain has better 'branding' and possible language barriers.

And your own, "may have family there", in addition to the potential language issue.

Then they cant "find out about it" as its all conjecure isnt it?

Theres not really a way to know unless you survey everyone and why they ended up in UK or another destination.

If youre running for your life dont you simply apply for asylum in France, Spain or another European country?

Forget your argument about UK / racism / anti immigration etc and think what do you think you would do?

For me, im a bit lost why so many would even want to go to the UK if theyre desperate.

Of course it makes sense about the language and wanting to make a home for themselves and the branding/dream.

But thats not really something id equate with asylum seekers...more so people who want to live in UK spefically.

In which case why not apply for a visa?