Aiming for the Champions League? Damn Right!

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davek said:
He said 'the chairman hasn't put any pressure on me' in a jokey 'oh yes he has' way, as anyone who heard him say it will tell you.

Really, if you haven't caught the 'rowing back' by Martinez from Kenwright's millstone comments in the couple of days since that press conference you simply haven't been listening/reading.
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Who cares?!

If he can't hack the heat, get out the kitchen... It's been a long time since an Everton manager had some ambition put on his neck and it's about time. You/we've all bemoaned a lack of ambition at the Club, openly talking about it is what the fans and players want, and need.
 
davek said:
He'll defo have a different attitude to Moyes in certain respects: not being afraid to take on the 'elite' clubs on their own grounds being one. I do feel sorry for him though that he's had his back to the wall straight away trying to define just what he can achieve here because Kenwright couldn't hold his tongue. I suppose what I'm saying is that talk on forums of Martinez being more up for pushing on for the CL spots than Moyes is just more unnecessary pressure heaped on the new man. No one should have that unreal level of expectancy. I certainly didn't have it for Moyes. The financial realities are too overwhelming to make the top four anything other than 'the dream' that Martinez rightly describes it as. And all the talk about 'well if we'd got that win there and that win in that game' is just clutching at straws and belongs in the 'if my auntie had a dick she'd be my uncle' category. Those extra wins and points come from having a class, in-depth squad. That's what the clubs who have that depth pay out all that money for - to have them in waiting for such key moments in the campaign. We're way off that. We just had a great season and still missed out on CL football by 10 points and an avalanche in GD.

Martinez needs to be given a break here not buried under a ton of wishful thinking.
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This.

We need to not bury RM in unrealistic expectations from the get go.

Money talks. Bar extraordinary circumstances and a long, unbroken chain of fortunate events, we got too little to overtake teams who can spend 100 mil+ a season(Spurs maybe 50 mil). People who think that Martinez will be the ace up our sleeve need to remember that the clubs we´re competing with have sharp, ambitious managers themselves (Lfc obvious exception).
 
GrandOldTeam said:
Who cares?!

If he can't hack the heat, get out the kitchen... It's been a long time since an Everton manager had some ambition put on his neck and it's about time. You/we've all bemoaned a lack of ambition at the Club, openly talking about it is what the fans and players want, and need.
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Ambitions ace but not enough. You need means as well.
 
GrandOldTeam said:
Who cares?!

If he can't hack the heat, get out the kitchen... It's been a long time since an Everton manager had some ambition put on his neck and it's about time. You/we've all bemoaned a lack of ambition at the Club, openly talking about it is what the fans and players want, and need.
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Bemoaning not enough attacking play is a bit different to bemoaning that we haven't had CL football, though.

It's unsustainable placing the burden of CL qualification on a manager of this club. Moyes got it once, but it wasn't ever a serious stick to beat him with if he fell short, and circumstances haven't changed since he went. We have every right to be ambitious for domestic silverware under a manager who's proven he can roll the dice and be bold in the cups. Outside of a lot more investment though, there can be no realistic expectation of an Everton manager leapfrogging another two places and ten points to get CL football.
 
davek said:
Bemoaning not enough attacking play is a bit different to bemoaning that we haven't had CL football, though.

It's unsustainable placing the burden of CL qualification on a manager of this club. Moyes got it once, but it wasn't ever a serious stick to beat him with if he fell short, and circumstances haven't changed since he went. We have every right to be ambitious for domestic silverware under a manager who's proven he can roll the dice and be bold in the cups. Outside of a lot more investment though, there can be no realistic expectation of an Everton manager leapfrogging another two places and ten points to get CL football.
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Those ten points is 3/4 results mate - if we'd shown that attacking intent you referred to in plenty of games last season who knows?

For me, it's refreshing to hear some ambition (albeit, a tad optimistic).
 
davek said:
We do keep hold of the ball well in the last third when we get hold of it there; we dont look comfortable enough to do it in our own half against very good teams. We tend to play that diagonal ball from inside our own box into the last third - which is pretty hit and miss - and that will (hopefully) be largely confined to a minor role under Martinez. It's going to be a major change for these players to get their head around. I think the term 'possession football' has been diluted if we believe it to have been the hallmark of Moyes' teams!
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Spoy on mate, I've been saying the same for years.
 
GrandOldTeam said:
Those ten points is 3/4 results mate - if we'd shown that attacking intent you referred to in plenty of games last season who knows?

For me, it's refreshing to hear some ambition (albeit, a tad optimistic).
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The table doesn't lie though. How many other teams could say the same year in, year out - yet it's still the same clutch of teams that actually secure the top four spots. That's no fluke, it's down to rising to the challenge with enough quality players in your squad to place pressure on first teamers when it isn't happening. Look what we had: perseverance through necessity with a misfiring striker.

By all means we should be ambitious about Europe (I'm sure Martinez is), but we have to temper that with the overwhelming financial realities of qualification for the CL.
 
We've cultivated an image of 'punching above our weight' for a long time now. It's the first thing ALL the pundits say when Everton are mentioned. It's no wonder no investor is interested when you openly admit that the only way is down. Perception is important. Why would an investor buy into a business which is openly telling people it is already over achieving?

The medium term goal has to be striving for champions league.
 
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CahillsCornerFlag said:
Spot on this.

Would rather aim for fourth and fail than aim for 40 points and whatever comes after is a bonus.
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Too right!

A team with our quality should take 40 pts as a given and be plotting as to how we are going to pick up the 30 odd pts need for CL qualification.

If it can be achieved though, the extra income generated by a run in the CL could allow us to strengthen that position further.

We can dream. It was a different era but we won the league the season after we lost 0-5 at home to the sh*te.

Anything is possible if you believe.

Teams in other countries who have an unequal financial situation have qualified, notably from Spain and Germany so there's no reason why not.

In addition, the sh*te have always achieved more than they seem capable of because they believe they should and that they are better than the teams they are playing. We should be going out with that attitude - instead of "being a match for anyone" and as a result drawing too many games, we should be believing that we are better than anyone who finished below us and a match for those above.

That attitude could be the difference we need.
 
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Librarian said:
We've cultivated an image of 'punching above our weight' for a long time now. It's the first thing ALL the pundits say when Everton are mentioned. It's no wonder no investor is interested when you openly admit that the only way is down. Perception is important. Why would an investor buy into a business which is openly telling people it is already over achieving?

The medium term goal has to be striving for champions league.
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Because it means they have less to invest for an immediate return

The people who bought City had to spend much more than any potential investor in Everton would have to spend to get the same level of success
 
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