A special arrangement ?

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....Fergie had control over an inner-sanctum of Manager's that included the likes of DM and Big Sam. Clever man who utilised his status to the benefit of United. Fortunately, DM came a bit unstuck with Fellaini and I thought we managed that negotiation very well. Wonder how that situation would've panned out if DM and SAF stayed where they were.
 
davek said:
I think the relationship (if it can be put that way) between Everton and United got Everton a very easy ride in the press in the recent past. United are a powerful club and can dictate through their masses of contacts how a team/manager/club is portrayed in the media.

Martinez and Everton in general will get a rough ride from now on, IMO.
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Every set of fans think they get a rough ride by the media and are the most persecuted bunch out there. I can't think of a single Man U fan I've ever had a conversation on the subject with who doesn't think they're the most picked on team in the country by pundits and journalists alike (seriously). People hear what they want to hear and most of the time, that's criticism so they can rally against it and create an us against them mentality (the lot across the park exemplify this the most).

Truth is, I think we'll get an even spread. Just using Gillette Soccer Saturday panel as an example. Merson is usually a fan of us and if he does criticise us, it's usually more than valid. Le Tissier can be up and down with us, doesn't really have his finger on the pulse of the club, but usually represents the average neutrals perspective. Thompson, ironically, probably knows us best. He gets in the most cheap shots and unnecessary digs, but, most of the time this can be taken as banter and as long as his point isn't drawing a direct comparison between us and Liverpool, he'll probably get it right. Whereas Charlie Nicholas is someone I see as bias against us. For whatever reason, his opinions on Everton always strike me as negative and are far more serious and demeaning than the small jabs Thompson takes. Add to that he's never been a fan of Martinez (he was calling for his head at Wigan for years), I'd expect his is the opinion that's going to most rile people this season (and be used as the example as to why sky/the media are out to get us).

As goes the footie journos, the one thing twitter has really opened my eyes to is how they care most about their own clubs and opinions on others just flow from that. So we'll get criticised and complimented by them in line with how we're affecting their clubs.
 
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Kurt said:
We've gone back to Wigan and taken 4 players off them mate...... Ok, not in such a poor manner as moyes but we've still done it..... It's football.
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For the life of me can only think of two players we paid wigan for, Kone, & McCarthy.
 
Guest89 said:
Every set of fans think they get a rough ride by the media and are the most persecuted bunch out there. I can't think of a single Man U fan I've ever had a conversation on the subject with who doesn't think they're the most picked on team in the country by pundits and journalists alike (seriously). People hear what they want to hear and most of the time, that's criticism so they can rally against it and create an us against them mentality (the lot across the park exemplify this the most).

Truth is, I think we'll get an even spread. Just using Gillette Soccer Saturday panel as an example. Merson is usually a fan of us and if he does criticise us, it's usually more than valid. Le Tissier can be up and down with us, doesn't really have his finger on the pulse of the club, but usually represents the average neutrals perspective. Thompson, ironically, probably knows us best. He gets in the most cheap shots and unnecessary digs, but, most of the time this can be taken as banter and as long as his point isn't drawing a direct comparison between us and Liverpool, he'll probably get it right. Whereas Charlie Nicholas is someone I see as bias against us. For whatever reason, his opinions on Everton always strike me as negative and are far more serious and demeaning than the small jabs Thompson takes. Add to that he's never been a fan of Martinez (he was calling for his head at Wigan for years), I'd expect his is the opinion that's going to most rile people this season (and be used as the example as to why sky/the media are out to get us).

As goes the footie journos, the one thing twitter has really opened my eyes to is how they care most about their own clubs and opinions on others just flow from that. So we'll get criticised and complimented by them in line with how we're affecting their clubs.
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I cant even think of a case when Everton were portrayed poorly during the past few years. It was on the basis of decent results, yeah. But any critique of the club treading water was conspicuous by its absence. That was down to very favourable media coverage and you have to ask yourself why that was. Undoubtedly Kenwright himself was adept at fielding awkward questions and/or keeping them from being asked in the first place (barring the BU PR assault), and he has powerful backers with clout. I'd say Moyes had clout too with journalists, but you'd have to ask why he was capable of it. United/Ferguson have to be a factor here in terms of how his protege was to be projected.

Martinez will be fair game now. He already is. The narrative established a few months back was that he was the wrong appointment for Everton in the first place, and now that he's up and running his style of play will be pulled apart. The only way he can stop it is to be successful...really successful that is, not 'Moyes successful'.
 
davek said:
I cant even think of a case when Everton were portrayed poorly during the past few years. It was on the basis of decent results, yeah. But any critique of the club treading water was conspicuous by its absence. That was down to very favourable media coverage and you have to ask yourself why that was. Undoubtedly Kenwright himself was adept at fielding awkward questions and/or keeping them from being asked in the first place (barring the BU PR assault), and he has powerful backers with clout. I'd say Moyes had clout too with journalists, but you'd have to ask why he was capable of it. United/Ferguson have to be a factor here in terms of how his protege was to be projected.

Martinez will be fair game now. He already is. The narrative established a few months back was that he was the wrong appointment for Everton in the first place, and now that he's up and running his style of play will be pulled apart. The only way he can stop it is to be successful...really successful that is, not 'Moyes successful'.
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Fair play if you think we've been well done by in the media in recent years (to a point I'd agree if you're talking about ignoring flaws in the finances of the club and passing over our terrible starts), but I'd say most of our fans have felt very hard done by in the media under Moyes (constantly patronised, the whole 'hard working', 'punching above our weight' lines regularly being reeled off without recognising good results we did achieve without any kind of caveats and how we are one of the biggest clubs in English football).

But as goes media pressure in general, I'd say it'd affect us far less anyway. The media would not be able to force Martinez out like it could do Moyes at Man U, just by virtue of the fact the vast majority of our fans aren't part time supporters. Most of our fans will form their own opinions on Martinez based on watching us week in, week out. Write ups in tabloids and blogs are unlikely to change the views of our support like it does the global brand clubs who have large sections of fans whose opinions on football are formed by the popular view they see on TV/twitter rather than what they see for themselves (in 10 minutes of highlights).

Time will tell, but I don't think the media tone toward our club will be any more negative this season, it'll just be asking different questions.
 
Kurt said:
The manner in which we did it was different but at the end of the day we still went back for 4 players.... It happens all over football when managers move clubs.
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It does happen but the manner in the way it happens is important. Moyes upset the Club he spent 11 years with his classless manner whereas Martinez showed class and didn't try to embarrass Wigan or disrepect Wigan. In other words he didn't try to act a big cheese.
 
We only bought 2 players from Wigan. One was a free agent and the other was an athletico player who Martinez has monitored for years who happened to be on loan at Wigan for the end of last season.
 
Quote Originally Posted by Kurt View Post
We've gone back to Wigan and taken 4 players off them mate...... Ok, not in such a poor manner as moyes but we've still done it..... It's football.

For the life of me can only think of two players we paid wigan for, Kone, & McCarthy.


on't try and be clever mate... You know what I meant.... All 4 of them players were on wigans payroll last season regardless of who owns them or any transfer fee


No I'm not trying to be clever just stating facts, your trying to make out that we keep going back to wigan when really only twice have we had to negotiate with them.
 
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sapper said:
No I'm not trying to be clever just stating facts, your trying to make out that we keep going back to wigan when really only twice have we had to negotiate with them.
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Firstly I have no issue with going back to Wigan mate, two players we ave paid a fee for from them, also we took Alcaraz on a free and we paid a fee to atletico ? For Robles.... Whichever way we look at it that's 4 players off their playing staff from last season. I'm not arsed about moyes... He's the united manager now.....but let's not be hypocritical slating him when we have basically done the same thing.....


Although we have gone about it very differently.
 
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