Time to face facts?

Are our coaching staff up to the job?


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bluebastardo

Player Valuation: £40m
Are we any good as a football team, and are we asking far too much of our team?

Moyes was a defender in his day. Nothing special as a player, and after Celtic, played for mediocre teams untill moving into management at Preston.

Steve Round was a full back and had a very short career with Derby before retiring through injury.

Jimmy Lumsden was a midfield player who apparantly played 'inside right'. He played half a dozen times in nearly a decade at Leeds before moving on to play for mediocre Scottish teaams most of us won't have heard of.

Is it any wonder that we play mediocre football when we have coaching staff that can't speak from personal experience?

None of our coaching staff, including Moyes, won bugger all as players, and none of them were strikers or attack minded.

How can we possibly expect to play good football, and get the right players in, in order to give us the possibility of playing good football, if the staff have no idea what good football is?

I'm deliberately being harsh here, as I don't see any reason to paint over problems and pretend all is well.

I strongly believe that to play good football, you need to have a very well balanced side, and Everton is anything but a well balanced side at the moment.

Does Moyes buy players with a definite strategy and plan of action, as it seems to me that there are many players in our team who are constantly playing out of position, or playing a role that doesn't suit their style of play.

We tend to play with 1 striker.
This can work fine if the midfield are capable of getting in amongst the opposition and feeding the ball through.

Unfortunately at the moment, we have a defense that think the direct route is the best way forward, and continually hoof the ball up to the lone striker, who is normally amongst 4 defenders, a goaly, and 2 defensive mids.
Other fans continually accuse us of playing hoof ball, and we can't really argue the point.

If Moyes thought hoof ball was wrong, then he would stamp it out. The fact that it is something that happens all too often shows that Moyes actually condones this style of play.

Howard kicks the ball up field 9/10, and we lose possession of the ball 9/10.
Neville floats the ball forward, and does this a lot.
Hibbert does the same, and so does Yobo and Baines.

This is a sign of desperate play and poor coaching.

We are desperate for a midfielder who can hold the ball up, and create a chain of play. Fellaini is probably our best keeper of the ball, but is out of favour for some reason.

Even if we had a creative midfielder, we would still need movement from the rest of the midfield to give the CM options. We are painfully slow on the attack, especially on the right, and very rarely do we catch teams on the break.

We have 2 players who throw the ball.
wtf is this all about? Play is held up while Neville or Baines run up to take the throw in.
This brings either player out of position, and allows the opposition to regroup instead of just throwing the ball and keeping momentum flowing.

Play Neville, or Rodwell, but don't play them both.
Decide who our best midfielders are and stick to it.
Play 2 strikers, so the midfield have someone to play the ball to and if we must play Cahill, then play him as a striker.

I don't think we will improve as a footballing team under our current coaching staff. I'm not talking about improving league positions, but improving the style of play.
We are light years behind other teams regarding flair, and it's no good being defensively sound (which we are not) if we are poor in attack.
Set pieces will not win trophies.

Even if we had money, I don't think we would play good football unless the players were left to their own devices.

The way forward in my opinion :

Replace Howard. He's really not as good as some think.
Replace Neville. Sorry, but not good enough.
Replace Osman. He is playing out of position.
Rotate Cahill with other strikers.

I would try this :

.........................Howard/new keeper........................

Hibbert..........Yobo....................Distin..............Baines

..............Heitinga..............................Rodwell..............

Pienaar..........................Fellaini............................Billy

....................................Striker........................................

Or

.................Heitinga...........................Fellaini

Pienaar...............................................................Billy

......................Cahill........................Striker........................

or

.............................Howard/new keeper.......................

Heitinga..........Yobo....................Distin..............Baines

..............Neville..............................Fellaini..............

Pienaar......................................................Billy

........................Cahill............Striker..........................



Then I would get another coach in that is attack minded.
 

I Tend to agree with most of your comments, watching the game today against Fulham, we had Nevile (a full back at best) playing def Midfield,
we had Cahill (a midfielder) playing up front,we had fellini on the bench along with vaughn and yakubu, our biggest two buys this season not playing,until injury forced heitinger on the pitch,? out of position. i,ve not seen this Billy play, but he's suposed to be good and fast,so we have two good wingers in him and pinnar, we have a proven goal scorer
in yakubu( i know hes been out for a long time but hes not getting match fit on the bench) cahill and osman can play and score goals, rodwell is a very good def midfielder, with heitinger distian yobo and baines we got a reasonable side. all playing in their chosen positions.
Jo isn't a target man he cant play with his back to goal. hibbert is another mick lyons 100% but badly misjudge's tackles too often, nevile a reasonable fullback,but is by no way a midfielder.osman is an attacking midfielder not a winger. he can be tricky he can score goals and can see a pass,
 
Sir Alex Ferguson :
1957–1960 Queen's Park 31 (15)
1960–1964 St. Johnstone 37 (19)
1964–1967 Dunfermline Athletic 89 (66)
1967–1969 Rangers 41 (25)
1969–1973 Falkirk 95 (36)
1973–1974 Ayr United 24 (9)

José Mourinho : No playing career.

Arsène Wenger :
1973–1975 Mulhouse 039 0(7)
1975–1978 ASPV Strasbourg 080 (20)
1978–1981 RC Strasbourg 011 0(0)[1]

Louis van Gaal :
1972–1973 Ajax 000 0(0)
1973–1977 Royal Antwerp 043 0(7)
1977–1978 Telstar 025 0(1)
1978–1986 Sparta Rotterdam 248 (26)
1986–1987 AZ 017 0(0)
 
Sir Alex Ferguson :
1957–1960 Queen's Park 31 (15)
1960–1964 St. Johnstone 37 (19)
1964–1967 Dunfermline Athletic 89 (66)
1967–1969 Rangers 41 (25)
1969–1973 Falkirk 95 (36)
1973–1974 Ayr United 24 (9)

José Mourinho : No playing career.

Arsène Wenger :
1973–1975 Mulhouse 039 0(7)
1975–1978 ASPV Strasbourg 080 (20)
1978–1981 RC Strasbourg 011 0(0)[1]

Louis van Gaal :
1972–1973 Ajax 000 0(0)
1973–1977 Royal Antwerp 043 0(7)
1977–1978 Telstar 025 0(1)
1978–1986 Sparta Rotterdam 248 (26)
1986–1987 AZ 017 0(0)

Exactly. Sven's another you can add to that list. Pretty sure that Roy Hodgson didn't have a playing career either.
 

theres no need to panic
Moyes has got us out of this trouble before and i can see the same happening this year

This long ball stuff may be painful to watch, but i think the lack of arteta is the main leader to it
 
the long ball stuff did my head in yesterday, especially when you see someone chip a 10 yard pass up to fellani, why?. Utter garbage, the only saving grace is that our three best players haven't really figured yet.

And to be honest I think Moyes may have had one eye on Thursday there was a few decent shouts on the bench. If we beat AEK, this result may be put in perspective. For example, if we win and Fulham lose in Europe, who would you rather be?, obviously it may not happen that way but it's early days, Hettinga and billyaletdinov have to bed in yet, Jags, Arteta and Yakuba aren't set yet and we're still trying to adjust distin for lescott.

To be honest, we played some garbage long ball at the end but we were still better than Fulham and didn't deserve to lose, we were better than them at their home ground and they were a top 7 side last season.

Lets not panic yet, it's a long old season, win our game in hand and we'll only be three points off a Europa League place, 6 points off the Champions league.

On a Final note AEK may be our toughest opponents, so why not rest a few, sacrafice one league game and try to focus on that?

Just hope this long ball cr** goes away....
 

Are we any good as a football team, and are we asking far too much of our team?

Moyes was a defender in his day. Nothing special as a player, and after Celtic, played for mediocre teams untill moving into management at Preston.

Steve Round was a full back and had a very short career with Derby before retiring through injury.

Jimmy Lumsden was a midfield player who apparantly played 'inside right'. He played half a dozen times in nearly a decade at Leeds before moving on to play for mediocre Scottish teaams most of us won't have heard of.

Is it any wonder that we play mediocre football when we have coaching staff that can't speak from personal experience?

None of our coaching staff, including Moyes, won bugger all as players, and none of them were strikers or attack minded.

How can we possibly expect to play good football, and get the right players in, in order to give us the possibility of playing good football, if the staff have no idea what good football is?

I'm deliberately being harsh here, as I don't see any reason to paint over problems and pretend all is well.

I strongly believe that to play good football, you need to have a very well balanced side, and Everton is anything but a well balanced side at the moment.

Does Moyes buy players with a definite strategy and plan of action, as it seems to me that there are many players in our team who are constantly playing out of position, or playing a role that doesn't suit their style of play.

We tend to play with 1 striker.
This can work fine if the midfield are capable of getting in amongst the opposition and feeding the ball through.

Unfortunately at the moment, we have a defense that think the direct route is the best way forward, and continually hoof the ball up to the lone striker, who is normally amongst 4 defenders, a goaly, and 2 defensive mids.
Other fans continually accuse us of playing hoof ball, and we can't really argue the point.

If Moyes thought hoof ball was wrong, then he would stamp it out. The fact that it is something that happens all too often shows that Moyes actually condones this style of play.

Howard kicks the ball up field 9/10, and we lose possession of the ball 9/10.
Neville floats the ball forward, and does this a lot.
Hibbert does the same, and so does Yobo and Baines.

This is a sign of desperate play and poor coaching.

We are desperate for a midfielder who can hold the ball up, and create a chain of play. Fellaini is probably our best keeper of the ball, but is out of favour for some reason.

Even if we had a creative midfielder, we would still need movement from the rest of the midfield to give the CM options. We are painfully slow on the attack, especially on the right, and very rarely do we catch teams on the break.

We have 2 players who throw the ball.
wtf is this all about? Play is held up while Neville or Baines run up to take the throw in.
This brings either player out of position, and allows the opposition to regroup instead of just throwing the ball and keeping momentum flowing.

Play Neville, or Rodwell, but don't play them both.
Decide who our best midfielders are and stick to it.
Play 2 strikers, so the midfield have someone to play the ball to and if we must play Cahill, then play him as a striker.

I don't think we will improve as a footballing team under our current coaching staff. I'm not talking about improving league positions, but improving the style of play.
We are light years behind other teams regarding flair, and it's no good being defensively sound (which we are not) if we are poor in attack.
Set pieces will not win trophies.

Even if we had money, I don't think we would play good football unless the players were left to their own devices.

The way forward in my opinion :

Replace Howard. He's really not as good as some think.
Replace Neville. Sorry, but not good enough.
Replace Osman. He is playing out of position.
Rotate Cahill with other strikers.

I would try this :

.........................Howard/new keeper........................

Hibbert..........Yobo....................Distin..............Baines

..............Heitinga..............................Rodwell..............

Pienaar..........................Fellaini............................Billy

....................................Striker........................................

Or

.................Heitinga...........................Fellaini

Pienaar...............................................................Billy

......................Cahill........................Striker........................

or

.............................Howard/new keeper.......................

Heitinga..........Yobo....................Distin..............Baines

..............Neville..............................Fellaini..............

Pienaar......................................................Billy

........................Cahill............Striker..........................



Then I would get another coach in that is attack minded.





Mate you're spot on except the fact that poor players don't necessarily have a bad management career.
 
Mate you're spot on except the fact that poor players don't necessarily have a bad management career.
I agree, but I would choose this line-up

------------Howard------------

Heitinga - Yobo - Distin - Baines

--------Rodwell - Fellaini-------

Bilyaletdinov ----------- Piennar

--------------Cahill------------

-------------Yakubu-----------

We need good passers of the ball in the def mid positions and with Arteta out, Rodwell and Fellaini are the best. To my mind Fellaini would rock as def mid - he has the entire passing range and with Rodwell next to him he could make those forward runs that he does for Belgium.
We cannot leave out Cahill - he's our biggest goal threat.
 
We need to fine players to keep them from hoofing up. I know it's drastic but then being paid 40k pr week they ought to have more intelligence and experience to know it won't work when all our attacking players is more effective with ball to feet.

Agree mostly with thread starter. Moyes simply love long balls, and I believe it's his primary attacking approach for this game.
 
the long ball stuff did my head in yesterday, especially when you see someone chip a 10 yard pass up to fellani, why?. Utter garbage, the only saving grace is that our three best players haven't really figured yet.

And to be honest I think Moyes may have had one eye on Thursday there was a few decent shouts on the bench. If we beat AEK, this result may be put in perspective. For example, if we win and Fulham lose in Europe, who would you rather be?, obviously it may not happen that way but it's early days, Hettinga and billyaletdinov have to bed in yet, Jags, Arteta and Yakuba aren't set yet and we're still trying to adjust distin for lescott.

To be honest, we played some garbage long ball at the end but we were still better than Fulham and didn't deserve to lose, we were better than them at their home ground and they were a top 7 side last season.

Lets not panic yet, it's a long old season, win our game in hand and we'll only be three points off a Europa League place, 6 points off the Champions league.

On a Final note AEK may be our toughest opponents, so why not rest a few, sacrafice one league game and try to focus on that?

Just hope this long ball cr** goes away....


Me too. The amount of times the ball is just hoofed up to Fellaini is ridiculous. That is all the defence did once he came on yesterday and for a player who stands at 6'4", he loses the majority of aeriel duels, something at least Big Dunc did'nt when he was at the club. We got the name the School Of Science for our brand of football, maybe Moyes should tell our current players that and get them playing attractive football again instead of the dross they have dished out for us so far this season.
 
I don't think Moyes is a long ball merchant. The squad he started with was grafters who punted to Ferguson as that was the limit of their ability. Over time he has brought in better ball players in the majority and certainly hasn't gone for players suited for the long ball game.

We have two main problems, lack of confidence which leads to "playing it safe" rather than risk short passes out of defense to midfield and the reliance on young Rodwell to be the progressive passer while Pip is in there. Yesterday the defense repeatedly received the ball back from the central midfield pairing. We need to try Pienaar or use Ossie centrally and get Billy playing. Cahill is not the answer and nor at the moment is Fellaini.
 

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